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I'm very far left, and was in South Africa when this chant was coined (more than a decade ago I think). It is completely pro-violence. As for Musk's commentary:

I'm very far left, and was in South Africa when this chant was coined (more than a decade ago I think). It is completely pro-violence. As for Musk's commentary: even a broken clock is correct twice a day - although I still wish he would shut the fuck up, he emigrated _during_ apartheid. The issue about farm killings is extremely complex. On the one hand you can understand the anger towards the white farmer, but on the other hand more murder and dispossession is not the answer to murder and dispossession: https://www.accord.org.za/ajcr-issues/farm-attacks-or-white-genocide-interrogating-the-unresolved-land-question-in-south-africa/ https://www.accord.org.za/ajcr-issues/farm-attacks-or-white-.... Either way, it's real and Malema is encouraging it. Malema is extremely separatist and xenophobic, or racist if you use the modern definition of the term. "Kill the boer" is definitely fighting words, and "western" commentators do not have the lived experience to add valuable perspective to the issue. The race situation in America is not the same as the race situation in South Africa (the race situation is all over the spectrum in Africa, let alone inconsistent with western problems).

tibbydudeza 3y ago
I have been to these dorpies in the Vrystaat and can see why farmers are attacked. In the middle of a sea of poverty they live with a homestead with cars,stuff and guns - during the court case they could not prove ONE incident where the criminals were influenced by the song. But the song has no place today, but the EFF knows their support base (stick it to the white man) but fortunately most South Africans don't support them and their agenda. Also the leader the FF+ was a former general of the old regime and the TRC did not have kind words for him and his mates - they are milking this as well. They have been stuck at 10% of the vote for 10 years now.
- OfSanguineFire 3y ago
  > In the middle of a sea of poverty they live with a homestead with cars,stuff and guns I cycled across South Africa and stayed many nights with white farmers. (Since the land is fenced off, it’s not easy to just stop and camp. You have to find the road up to the farmhouse and ask the farmer’s permission. It usually results in an invitation to dinner and to sleep in the guest bedroom.) What surprised me is how cash-poor a lot of those farming families were, in spite of their land holdings. Yes, they had a higher standard of living than in the townships, but they seemed of only modest wealth in a general developed-world context. They seemed poor compared to some Johannesburg black elites. Farmers complained that their children had moved away not necessarily due to violence but rather for improved financial prospects.
  - tibbydudeza 3y ago
    Land holdings are usually inherited but they definitely have more i.r.o material possessions compared to say farm workers or the folks living in the "location" outside of town. Farming is hard - the debt you need to take on and being beholden to the climate - reckon these days only the big Agri-Corps like Beefmaster near Kimberley is making money.
xepriot 3y ago
Why do you perform this “well, they have a reason to be upset” ritualistic apologia before you condemn racist murder and the rhetoric that provokes it?
- zamalek 3y ago
  Everyone has a range of reasons to have many emotions and beliefs. It doesn't mean that we roll over and adopt those emotions and beliefs. Indigenous Africans were dispossessed, murdered, and enslaved. Sugarcoating it for us fragile white people does no good.
  - xepriot 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - merman 3y ago
    If you contort your thinking enough, 1920s Germans suffered miserably and unfairly and we could never comprehend their suffering, us being so fragile. How can we judge them for what they did later?
    - zamalek 3y ago
      At what point did I say that they are beyond judgment? Germany is still paying for reparations, after all.
  - lockhouse 3y ago
    > Indigenous Africans were dispossessed, murdered, and enslaved Yes, mostly by fellow Africans... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa
    - zamalek 3y ago
      Which excuses the white man doing it?
ryzvonusef 3y ago
Acc to his biography, he left to escape the mandatory conscription by the Apartheid, so take it as you will. South Africa doesn't know what to do with the flipped around situation; first they were oppressed by the minority... then the tables turned and the oppressor became the oppressed (or whatever the applicable term is), and they are now at a cross roads.

tibbydudeza 3y ago

I have been to these dorpies in the Vrystaat and can see why farmers are attacked. In the middle of a sea of poverty they live with a homestead with cars,stuff and guns - during the court case they could not prove ONE incident where the criminals were influenced by the song. But the song has no place today, but the EFF knows their support base (stick it to the white man) but fortunately most South Africans don't support them and their agenda. Also the leader the FF+ was a former general of the old regime and the TRC did not have kind words for him and his mates - they are milking this as well. They have been stuck at 10% of the vote for 10 years now.

OfSanguineFire 3y ago
> In the middle of a sea of poverty they live with a homestead with cars,stuff and guns I cycled across South Africa and stayed many nights with white farmers. (Since the land is fenced off, it’s not easy to just stop and camp. You have to find the road up to the farmhouse and ask the farmer’s permission. It usually results in an invitation to dinner and to sleep in the guest bedroom.) What surprised me is how cash-poor a lot of those farming families were, in spite of their land holdings. Yes, they had a higher standard of living than in the townships, but they seemed of only modest wealth in a general developed-world context. They seemed poor compared to some Johannesburg black elites. Farmers complained that their children had moved away not necessarily due to violence but rather for improved financial prospects.
- tibbydudeza 3y ago
  Land holdings are usually inherited but they definitely have more i.r.o material possessions compared to say farm workers or the folks living in the "location" outside of town. Farming is hard - the debt you need to take on and being beholden to the climate - reckon these days only the big Agri-Corps like Beefmaster near Kimberley is making money.

xepriot 3y ago

Why do you perform this “well, they have a reason to be upset” ritualistic apologia before you condemn racist murder and the rhetoric that provokes it?

zamalek 3y ago
Everyone has a range of reasons to have many emotions and beliefs. It doesn't mean that we roll over and adopt those emotions and beliefs. Indigenous Africans were dispossessed, murdered, and enslaved. Sugarcoating it for us fragile white people does no good.
- xepriot 3y ago
  [flagged]
- merman 3y ago
  If you contort your thinking enough, 1920s Germans suffered miserably and unfairly and we could never comprehend their suffering, us being so fragile. How can we judge them for what they did later?
  - zamalek 3y ago
    At what point did I say that they are beyond judgment? Germany is still paying for reparations, after all.
- lockhouse 3y ago
  > Indigenous Africans were dispossessed, murdered, and enslaved Yes, mostly by fellow Africans... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa
  - zamalek 3y ago
    Which excuses the white man doing it?

ryzvonusef 3y ago

Acc to his biography, he left to escape the mandatory conscription by the Apartheid, so take it as you will. South Africa doesn't know what to do with the flipped around situation; first they were oppressed by the minority... then the tables turned and the oppressor became the oppressed (or whatever the applicable term is), and they are now at a cross roads.