5 ms·

Have you looked at modern Gnome or KDE Plasma? They are both at least as petty as MacOS or Windows.

nmstoker 3y ago
KDE Plasma is great and actually seems to have inspired a bunch of Win11 approaches, so it is possible to get things looking good but there's definitely truth in the sentiment above: a huge chunk of OSS software looking terrible. There's always the form vs function debate but it's a shame that more doesn't manage to have both form and function if the respective specialists could coordinate
RamblingCTO 3y ago
> They are both at least as petty as MacOS or Windows Yeah, no. I don't think you use macOS/win at all if you say stuff like that. It feels and always has felt rough around the edges.
- nerdponx 3y ago
  I use both and I think KDE looks and feels great.
- em-bee 3y ago
  i still use MacOS and windows from time to time, and i simply have to disagree. using MacOS has just as many WTF moments as i get with Gnome (and KDE too i think, but i haven't used that in a while) a windows just leaves me baffled every time i have to touch it. ( https://commadot.com/wtf-per-minute/ https://commadot.com/wtf-per-minute/ )
  - tracker1 3y ago
    The one thing I think is great in Windows is the whatever the active apps bar at the bottom is (taskbar?). Hover, get thumbnails, etc. On mac, I find it kind of painful to juggle a few windows of the same application. Can say the same in Linux as well, some apps don't even show up at all, even though they're running in a window/viewport. I genuinely like and dislike most OS UIs I've tried. They all have things that irk me. While windows settings has gotten more consistent, it's also all the more painful when you had gotten used to the "old way" of doing things and where to look. If MS executives could just get TF out of their own way on some of the stupidity and force-feeding. Mac, just feels a bit dated at this point, but the touchpad integration across all apps is great. Not to mention the macbook touchpads being second to none in terms of usability. Linux, I can shift to almost exactly what I want. There are rough edges and spots you cannot reach via UI, but it mostly works without issue. Been using Budgie as my DE for over a year, fairly customized and like it a lot.
    - bloopernova 3y ago
      Not defending macOS here, but switching between windows and managing them is usually performed via Exposé, (ctrl-uparrow)
      - tracker1 3y ago
        Thanks, That's a hotkey I wasn't aware of... I know I could use gestures (three finger swipe up), but usually using my mouse.
        em-bee 3y ago
        discovery of hotkeys can be a challenge. despite having used gnome for years now i only recently learned that i can switch windows with alt-esc instead of alt-tab, which is much faster when you have multiple windows of the same app or want to switch back and forth between to windows. and i only found this while searching for an extension that would make switching windows easier.
        nequo 3y ago
        Unity used to show the keyboard shortcuts when you held the Super key: https://i.stack.imgur.com/JDDku.png https://i.stack.imgur.com/JDDku.png To my knowledge, modern GNOME does not have this which is sad. There's this webpage instead: https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/shell-keyboard-shortcuts.html.en https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/shell-keyboar...
        em-bee 3y ago
        the thing is that i would not even have thought of looking there. i was at "switching windows is a pain, how can i make it better" which is not "is there a hotkey to switch windows differently, because why would i even consider that there are multiple ways to switch windows, especially with gnome that kind of has a reputation of removing seemingly unneeded features.
- jlund-molfese 3y ago
  Modern KDE is actually more polished than MacOS in specific areas, like allowing a single window to span across multiple monitors in a seamless manner
  - jwells89 3y ago
    Less polished in some areas too, though. It's slowly improving over time but for example fine UI/UX details like whitespace usage, control alignment/placement, and typography have always felt a bit… "off" in KDE as well in most software written with Qt, which I think probably boils down to Qt being more likely to be chosen by devs who are more technically inclined than design or UX inclined. In my opinion GNOME and GTK apps generally get those details more "correct", though GNOME 3 and up goes way overboard on padding. Strip that padding down with a theme and its design is solid though, and Cinnamon, XFCE, and MATE get these right out of the box with no modifications necessary.
    - jlund-molfese 3y ago
      But that's why these "X has a better UI than Y" arguments are silly. I prefer KDE to any other DE because it worked (I now use MacOS and can't run other DEs) for me, and most people who prefer other DEs. That's OK. They all have different strengths and weaknesses (customization, resource usage, ability to run on certain OSes, high DPI support, etc).
gapan 3y ago
I understand "petty" is a typo, but I kind of agree with that meaning too.

KDE Plasma is great and actually seems to have inspired a bunch of Win11 approaches, so it is possible to get things looking good but there's definitely truth in the sentiment above: a huge chunk of OSS software looking terrible. There's always the form vs function debate but it's a shame that more doesn't manage to have both form and function if the respective specialists could coordinate

RamblingCTO 3y ago

> They are both at least as petty as MacOS or Windows Yeah, no. I don't think you use macOS/win at all if you say stuff like that. It feels and always has felt rough around the edges.

nerdponx 3y ago
I use both and I think KDE looks and feels great.
em-bee 3y ago
i still use MacOS and windows from time to time, and i simply have to disagree. using MacOS has just as many WTF moments as i get with Gnome (and KDE too i think, but i haven't used that in a while) a windows just leaves me baffled every time i have to touch it. ( https://commadot.com/wtf-per-minute/ https://commadot.com/wtf-per-minute/ )
- tracker1 3y ago
  The one thing I think is great in Windows is the whatever the active apps bar at the bottom is (taskbar?). Hover, get thumbnails, etc. On mac, I find it kind of painful to juggle a few windows of the same application. Can say the same in Linux as well, some apps don't even show up at all, even though they're running in a window/viewport. I genuinely like and dislike most OS UIs I've tried. They all have things that irk me. While windows settings has gotten more consistent, it's also all the more painful when you had gotten used to the "old way" of doing things and where to look. If MS executives could just get TF out of their own way on some of the stupidity and force-feeding. Mac, just feels a bit dated at this point, but the touchpad integration across all apps is great. Not to mention the macbook touchpads being second to none in terms of usability. Linux, I can shift to almost exactly what I want. There are rough edges and spots you cannot reach via UI, but it mostly works without issue. Been using Budgie as my DE for over a year, fairly customized and like it a lot.
  - bloopernova 3y ago
    Not defending macOS here, but switching between windows and managing them is usually performed via Exposé, (ctrl-uparrow)
    - tracker1 3y ago
      Thanks, That's a hotkey I wasn't aware of... I know I could use gestures (three finger swipe up), but usually using my mouse.
      - em-bee 3y ago
        discovery of hotkeys can be a challenge. despite having used gnome for years now i only recently learned that i can switch windows with alt-esc instead of alt-tab, which is much faster when you have multiple windows of the same app or want to switch back and forth between to windows. and i only found this while searching for an extension that would make switching windows easier.
        nequo 3y ago
        Unity used to show the keyboard shortcuts when you held the Super key: https://i.stack.imgur.com/JDDku.png https://i.stack.imgur.com/JDDku.png To my knowledge, modern GNOME does not have this which is sad. There's this webpage instead: https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/shell-keyboard-shortcuts.html.en https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/shell-keyboar...
        em-bee 3y ago
        the thing is that i would not even have thought of looking there. i was at "switching windows is a pain, how can i make it better" which is not "is there a hotkey to switch windows differently, because why would i even consider that there are multiple ways to switch windows, especially with gnome that kind of has a reputation of removing seemingly unneeded features.
jlund-molfese 3y ago
Modern KDE is actually more polished than MacOS in specific areas, like allowing a single window to span across multiple monitors in a seamless manner
- jwells89 3y ago
  Less polished in some areas too, though. It's slowly improving over time but for example fine UI/UX details like whitespace usage, control alignment/placement, and typography have always felt a bit… "off" in KDE as well in most software written with Qt, which I think probably boils down to Qt being more likely to be chosen by devs who are more technically inclined than design or UX inclined. In my opinion GNOME and GTK apps generally get those details more "correct", though GNOME 3 and up goes way overboard on padding. Strip that padding down with a theme and its design is solid though, and Cinnamon, XFCE, and MATE get these right out of the box with no modifications necessary.
  - jlund-molfese 3y ago
    But that's why these "X has a better UI than Y" arguments are silly. I prefer KDE to any other DE because it worked (I now use MacOS and can't run other DEs) for me, and most people who prefer other DEs. That's OK. They all have different strengths and weaknesses (customization, resource usage, ability to run on certain OSes, high DPI support, etc).

gapan 3y ago

I understand "petty" is a typo, but I kind of agree with that meaning too.