4 ms·

It's a very good idea to not assume public representatives are incompetent. I've worked with many people in Congress here in the US, and I haven't met one that

It's a very good idea to not assume public representatives are incompetent. I've worked with many people in Congress here in the US, and I haven't met one that wasn't startlingly smart. It feels good to think they're dumb, but it is very dangerous.

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
Yes, privately schooled people groomed for political positions are not idiots in the classical term, and while he might not be incompetent at doing things that further his own agenda but he's incompetent at tackling present day issues as going cashless was never an issue in Austria to begin with.
- mdp2021 3y ago
  > going cashless was never an issue in Austria to begin with I have had requests in Austria to pay with a card: some pressure exists. After 2020, such pressure was on signs spread in the territory. And Austria is part of systems above. Or, for example, does one still find bank cards without "Contactless" NFC in Austria? Please let us know - I am sitting in the car right now.
  - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
    >I have had requests in Austria to pay with a card: We must be living in different Austrias then. I've never been pressured to pay by card ever and many places don't even accept cards. >After 2020, such pressure was on signs spread in the territory. Well yeah, Covid happened in 2020, and contactless payment is much more hygienic than exchanging paper that's been through god knows where throught its lifetime. Or don't you feel public health and safety in a pandemic is irrelevant?
    - mdp2021 3y ago
      So you are minimizing the pressure towards using cards instead of cash in the last years as contingent only. At least in Austria. And you are suggesting that now it is over. You are also minimizing the point that Austria is not a disconnected independent self-ruling entity, but part of bigger systems and a subject in bigger systems. I said: are there still traditional bank cards in Austria, not readable from a distance? The wave to remove them seems to be international. Not only the apparently last international circuit (Maestro) using them was ceased one month ago, but I am not aware of traditional cards working in at least local circuits. Austria seems to be bearing "alien" pressures like the rest. You have to see the waves coming to prevent them. That of Covid is suggestive: in the Fall of 2020 in Austria it seemed to be regarded as just an "Italian predicament".
      - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
        >are there still traditional bank cards in Austria, not readable from a distance? Do you actually live in Austria and know the real situation on the ground, or are you making up fantasy scenarios for strawman arguments for some good old-fashioned internet trolling? Because you would know the answer tot that.
        mdp2021 3y ago
        I wrote very clearly, FirmwareBurner: if you did not understand, re-read what I wrote and make the mandated effort. If clarifications are useful, ask for them. Nobody told you I live in Austria. The information I have is based on my research, which is unfortunately bound to be limited (which also implies, it was unsuccessful in finding around alternatives to the current mess). I have also been in Austria and made my limited queries (not only as I have not visited every bank, but also as it did not happen in the past months, and some of the systemic changes are only weeks old): those queries have been unsuccessful, like in other territories. And very clearly, the point was beyond bank cards - it is about binding trends, as I wrote very literally -, which are mentioned to make an example. And if you have good information, share it, or you are being unhelpful, further to your unhelpful attitude towards comprehension. > fantasy scenarios for strawman arguments Logical process, induction and deduction, probabilistic. Maestro is gone, and it is the last international channel with "traditional" service I knew. In some territories, local channels have been shut down. I have been in a few banks of "your" territory, they did not offer said service. Web sources have not shown solutions. All of this does not promise well. And I have not made factual statements: both times I asked in this branch I made direct questions. If you, from this, could deduce "Oh, but see: Austria reveals to be an exception", because you retained services that disappeared elsewhere, then the original point would be corroborated by the fact that elsewhere those services disappeared.
        FirmwareBurner 3y ago
        Then you don't know what you're talking about, so I will end the conversation here to preserve my sanity. Good day sir.
hackyhacky 3y ago
If they are so smart, why do they say so many dumb things?
- debacle 3y ago
  Because their political objectives are completely tangential to what most of the apolitical public believes elected officials are motivated by.
- rootusrootus 3y ago
  It's like Jeopardy. Notice that pretty much any halfway knowledgable adult can answer most of the questions on the show? Now try to become an actual contestant. It takes real intelligence to convince millions of people to support you, and the skill to talk at their level and pretend to care about things in the same way they do. I have to remind myself of this -- when a politician says something stupid, it isn't because they are actually stupid, it's because they know who they are trying to talk to. So my gripe isn't really with the politician. I may not like Trump, but the more important underlying questions are who supports him and why. If not him, it'll just be someone else, because those people have a viewpoint and they'll vote for someone that matches it.
  - AnthonyMouse 3y ago
    The other thing to keep in mind with politicians is that they spend all day talking and then reporters choose the six words to quote in a story based on whether they want to make them sound like a genius or an idiot. Nearly every time you hear a politician quoted as saying something outrageous it turns out to be some ambiguous or inarticulate wording they didn't intend that way or something that was just maliciously taken out of context. Because motivating the opposition isn't in their interest. Trump is an unusual exception because he says things in context that sound outrageous out of context on purpose in order to get people to talk about him, and reporters keep lining up to fall in the trap like it's a ride at an amusement park.

FirmwareBurner 3y ago

Yes, privately schooled people groomed for political positions are not idiots in the classical term, and while he might not be incompetent at doing things that further his own agenda but he's incompetent at tackling present day issues as going cashless was never an issue in Austria to begin with.

mdp2021 3y ago
> going cashless was never an issue in Austria to begin with I have had requests in Austria to pay with a card: some pressure exists. After 2020, such pressure was on signs spread in the territory. And Austria is part of systems above. Or, for example, does one still find bank cards without "Contactless" NFC in Austria? Please let us know - I am sitting in the car right now.
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  >I have had requests in Austria to pay with a card: We must be living in different Austrias then. I've never been pressured to pay by card ever and many places don't even accept cards. >After 2020, such pressure was on signs spread in the territory. Well yeah, Covid happened in 2020, and contactless payment is much more hygienic than exchanging paper that's been through god knows where throught its lifetime. Or don't you feel public health and safety in a pandemic is irrelevant?
  - mdp2021 3y ago
    So you are minimizing the pressure towards using cards instead of cash in the last years as contingent only. At least in Austria. And you are suggesting that now it is over. You are also minimizing the point that Austria is not a disconnected independent self-ruling entity, but part of bigger systems and a subject in bigger systems. I said: are there still traditional bank cards in Austria, not readable from a distance? The wave to remove them seems to be international. Not only the apparently last international circuit (Maestro) using them was ceased one month ago, but I am not aware of traditional cards working in at least local circuits. Austria seems to be bearing "alien" pressures like the rest. You have to see the waves coming to prevent them. That of Covid is suggestive: in the Fall of 2020 in Austria it seemed to be regarded as just an "Italian predicament".
    - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
      >are there still traditional bank cards in Austria, not readable from a distance? Do you actually live in Austria and know the real situation on the ground, or are you making up fantasy scenarios for strawman arguments for some good old-fashioned internet trolling? Because you would know the answer tot that.
      - mdp2021 3y ago
        I wrote very clearly, FirmwareBurner: if you did not understand, re-read what I wrote and make the mandated effort. If clarifications are useful, ask for them. Nobody told you I live in Austria. The information I have is based on my research, which is unfortunately bound to be limited (which also implies, it was unsuccessful in finding around alternatives to the current mess). I have also been in Austria and made my limited queries (not only as I have not visited every bank, but also as it did not happen in the past months, and some of the systemic changes are only weeks old): those queries have been unsuccessful, like in other territories. And very clearly, the point was beyond bank cards - it is about binding trends, as I wrote very literally -, which are mentioned to make an example. And if you have good information, share it, or you are being unhelpful, further to your unhelpful attitude towards comprehension. > fantasy scenarios for strawman arguments Logical process, induction and deduction, probabilistic. Maestro is gone, and it is the last international channel with "traditional" service I knew. In some territories, local channels have been shut down. I have been in a few banks of "your" territory, they did not offer said service. Web sources have not shown solutions. All of this does not promise well. And I have not made factual statements: both times I asked in this branch I made direct questions. If you, from this, could deduce "Oh, but see: Austria reveals to be an exception", because you retained services that disappeared elsewhere, then the original point would be corroborated by the fact that elsewhere those services disappeared.
        FirmwareBurner 3y ago
        Then you don't know what you're talking about, so I will end the conversation here to preserve my sanity. Good day sir.

hackyhacky 3y ago

If they are so smart, why do they say so many dumb things?

debacle 3y ago
Because their political objectives are completely tangential to what most of the apolitical public believes elected officials are motivated by.
rootusrootus 3y ago
It's like Jeopardy. Notice that pretty much any halfway knowledgable adult can answer most of the questions on the show? Now try to become an actual contestant. It takes real intelligence to convince millions of people to support you, and the skill to talk at their level and pretend to care about things in the same way they do. I have to remind myself of this -- when a politician says something stupid, it isn't because they are actually stupid, it's because they know who they are trying to talk to. So my gripe isn't really with the politician. I may not like Trump, but the more important underlying questions are who supports him and why. If not him, it'll just be someone else, because those people have a viewpoint and they'll vote for someone that matches it.
- AnthonyMouse 3y ago
  The other thing to keep in mind with politicians is that they spend all day talking and then reporters choose the six words to quote in a story based on whether they want to make them sound like a genius or an idiot. Nearly every time you hear a politician quoted as saying something outrageous it turns out to be some ambiguous or inarticulate wording they didn't intend that way or something that was just maliciously taken out of context. Because motivating the opposition isn't in their interest. Trump is an unusual exception because he says things in context that sound outrageous out of context on purpose in order to get people to talk about him, and reporters keep lining up to fall in the trap like it's a ride at an amusement park.