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You got it, swappable batteries is the key to EV mass-adoption. Do people care about range with internal combustion vehicles? Not really, if they can get betwe

You got it, swappable batteries is the key to EV mass-adoption. Do people care about range with internal combustion vehicles? Not really, if they can get between gas stations. It takes very little time to refill, and each vehicle (regardless of manufacturer) uses the same stuff. The trouble is that standardizing when there is hot competition is very political. Things need to cool down a little before it can be done, and you don't want to standardize until designs naturally converge. You don't want government to get involved early when engineering is involved. EVs will be a pain until a standard emerges though. I can't wait until I can drive up to a station and get a pre-charged battery.

CamperBob2 3y ago
My thinking was always that the physical packages should be standardized -- think two 'AA's for a Miata and twenty 'D's for a Peterbilt -- along with the connectors. Also a rudimentary bus protocol to communicate the battery's parameters to chargers and loads, store usage history, keep track of expected remaining life, and such. But literally nothing else other than basic environmental and safety considerations. A battery must be recyclable in some form or fashion, will not usually set your house on fire, cannot explode under normal operating conditions, cannot emit more than X milliroentgens per hour, whatever. Other than that, no rules. Don't standardize the chemistry, or the voltage, or the current limit, or the charging rate, or anything else... just make it fit. Then require the industry to adopt standardized power converters and chargers under similar auspices. For the hardware, don't specify voltage, don't specify cost, don't specify charging time, don't mandate anything except the ability to charge a particular class of battery. Simply mandating the form factor, connector, and handshaking could have made all the difference. We would have manufacturers competing to see who could build the most economical and/or performant batteries, chargers and converters. Charging could take place at times and places that optimize efficiency. Filling up an EV could take less time than getting gas, not more. And there would be no chicken-and-egg problem to impede adoption, as we're seeing now. You would not be stuck with the batteries or the charger that your car came with. We will kick ourselves for the next 50 years for not doing this.
janalsncm 3y ago
> You don't want government to get involved early when engineering is involved. Apple would argue the EU was stepping on their toes by imposing USB-C. Maybe whatever proprietary connector Apple comes up with is better in some technical ways. But that benefit has to be weighed against the emergent benefits of standardization. Maybe 120V AC isn’t objectively the best. But isn’t it nice you don’t have to think about it before plugging into a wall? I think so.
- ffhhttt 3y ago
  > Maybe 120V AC isn’t l objectively the best Just like miles and gallons..
- jvdvegt 3y ago
  > Maybe 120V AC isn’t objectively the best. It is not indeed, 240V AC is better as you need only half the current for the same amount of power.
ffhhttt 3y ago
EVs with swappable batteries would be inferior to those with fixed ones in many ways (weight/size/aerodynamics) the swapping part and all the related infrastructure would be very expensive. I just don’t how could this ever be competitive with fast charging.

CamperBob2 3y ago

My thinking was always that the physical packages should be standardized -- think two 'AA's for a Miata and twenty 'D's for a Peterbilt -- along with the connectors. Also a rudimentary bus protocol to communicate the battery's parameters to chargers and loads, store usage history, keep track of expected remaining life, and such. But literally nothing else other than basic environmental and safety considerations. A battery must be recyclable in some form or fashion, will not usually set your house on fire, cannot explode under normal operating conditions, cannot emit more than X milliroentgens per hour, whatever. Other than that, no rules. Don't standardize the chemistry, or the voltage, or the current limit, or the charging rate, or anything else... just make it fit. Then require the industry to adopt standardized power converters and chargers under similar auspices. For the hardware, don't specify voltage, don't specify cost, don't specify charging time, don't mandate anything except the ability to charge a particular class of battery. Simply mandating the form factor, connector, and handshaking could have made all the difference. We would have manufacturers competing to see who could build the most economical and/or performant batteries, chargers and converters. Charging could take place at times and places that optimize efficiency. Filling up an EV could take less time than getting gas, not more. And there would be no chicken-and-egg problem to impede adoption, as we're seeing now. You would not be stuck with the batteries or the charger that your car came with. We will kick ourselves for the next 50 years for not doing this.

janalsncm 3y ago

> You don't want government to get involved early when engineering is involved. Apple would argue the EU was stepping on their toes by imposing USB-C. Maybe whatever proprietary connector Apple comes up with is better in some technical ways. But that benefit has to be weighed against the emergent benefits of standardization. Maybe 120V AC isn’t objectively the best. But isn’t it nice you don’t have to think about it before plugging into a wall? I think so.

ffhhttt 3y ago
> Maybe 120V AC isn’t l objectively the best Just like miles and gallons..
jvdvegt 3y ago
> Maybe 120V AC isn’t objectively the best. It is not indeed, 240V AC is better as you need only half the current for the same amount of power.

ffhhttt 3y ago

EVs with swappable batteries would be inferior to those with fixed ones in many ways (weight/size/aerodynamics) the swapping part and all the related infrastructure would be very expensive. I just don’t how could this ever be competitive with fast charging.