3 ms·

Not a great argument. Police here are not interested in justice, and this is trivial to prove based on their behavior. Courts have also ruled that police have

Not a great argument. Police here are not interested in justice, and this is trivial to prove based on their behavior. Courts have also ruled that police have no duty to protect citizens. Policing in the US is fundamentally broken. That there exist places with worse policing problems does not mean ours are not serious, foundational, and endemic.

justapassenger 3y ago
> Police here are not interested in justice, and this is trivial to prove based on their behavior. Is it? There are bad stories, sure. Horrible ones, yes. Police officers who should be in jail for life - yes! But there’s also a tons of good stories, that just don’t get reported, because they don’t generate outrage and clicks.
- ubermonkey 3y ago
  That's a hilarious and counterfactual thing to assert on a thread noting that cops literally steal more money from people than criminals do. Cops do what is easy, by and large. The overriding motivations in the job do not align with the values that the public would actually WANT from a police force. They are not required to "protect and serve," and have actually argued in court (and won!) that they are not required to protect anyone. They are protected by a union with absurdly outsized power, which prevents real accountability in all but the most egregious cases. These unions and their fellow-travelers work hard to prevent common-sense recordkeeping on national violent incidents by cops, and to avoid any kind of national peace officer licensing and certification that would keep bad cops "fired" by one city from just drifting to the next town over and continuing their behavior. Cops, in the US, are part of the problem. https://theap.substack.com/p/what-do-cops-do https://theap.substack.com/p/what-do-cops-do
  - justapassenger 3y ago
    World is more complex than you make it. Police can have big problems, that you mention, and at the same time can be interested in justice. Are software engineers force of evil, because of lot of them work for companies that disregard privacy and make billions of dollars off it? And are not required by law to follow ethical standards?
    - ubermonkey 3y ago
      Software engineers are not uniquely empowered to deploy violence against more or less anyone they want with little chance of liability or repercussions. There is no "qualified immunity" for a software engineer who beats an unarmed motorist for no good reason.
      - justapassenger 3y ago
        Software engineers can build systems that are going to kill people and face no legal consequences for it (like Uber self driving car - it was extremely reckless, and engineers behind are not in jail).
        ubermonkey 3y ago
        Be realistic. Software engineers are creating nowhere NEARLY the problem that unchecked, unaccountable, and violence-prone American police are causing. I feel like you're either very naive about American policing, or you are unwilling to engage with this in good faith, so I'm going to bow out here -- but your comparison is honestly risible.
        justapassenger 3y ago
        Be realistic? According to you every single policeman is a dirty criminal, and each and every police department is a mob and lawless institution. I’m agreeing from a start, that USA police has tons of issues. But it’s not a lawless institution. Really, go live in a country without effective policing and then we can talk if USA police is only bringing lawlessness to the table.
        ubermonkey 3y ago
        At no point have I said anything resembling "every single policeman is a dirty criminal," but your assertion that I have definitely proves the points made in my prior reply.

justapassenger 3y ago

> Police here are not interested in justice, and this is trivial to prove based on their behavior. Is it? There are bad stories, sure. Horrible ones, yes. Police officers who should be in jail for life - yes! But there’s also a tons of good stories, that just don’t get reported, because they don’t generate outrage and clicks.

ubermonkey 3y ago
That's a hilarious and counterfactual thing to assert on a thread noting that cops literally steal more money from people than criminals do. Cops do what is easy, by and large. The overriding motivations in the job do not align with the values that the public would actually WANT from a police force. They are not required to "protect and serve," and have actually argued in court (and won!) that they are not required to protect anyone. They are protected by a union with absurdly outsized power, which prevents real accountability in all but the most egregious cases. These unions and their fellow-travelers work hard to prevent common-sense recordkeeping on national violent incidents by cops, and to avoid any kind of national peace officer licensing and certification that would keep bad cops "fired" by one city from just drifting to the next town over and continuing their behavior. Cops, in the US, are part of the problem. https://theap.substack.com/p/what-do-cops-do https://theap.substack.com/p/what-do-cops-do
- justapassenger 3y ago
  World is more complex than you make it. Police can have big problems, that you mention, and at the same time can be interested in justice. Are software engineers force of evil, because of lot of them work for companies that disregard privacy and make billions of dollars off it? And are not required by law to follow ethical standards?
  - ubermonkey 3y ago
    Software engineers are not uniquely empowered to deploy violence against more or less anyone they want with little chance of liability or repercussions. There is no "qualified immunity" for a software engineer who beats an unarmed motorist for no good reason.
    - justapassenger 3y ago
      Software engineers can build systems that are going to kill people and face no legal consequences for it (like Uber self driving car - it was extremely reckless, and engineers behind are not in jail).
      - ubermonkey 3y ago
        Be realistic. Software engineers are creating nowhere NEARLY the problem that unchecked, unaccountable, and violence-prone American police are causing. I feel like you're either very naive about American policing, or you are unwilling to engage with this in good faith, so I'm going to bow out here -- but your comparison is honestly risible.
        justapassenger 3y ago
        Be realistic? According to you every single policeman is a dirty criminal, and each and every police department is a mob and lawless institution. I’m agreeing from a start, that USA police has tons of issues. But it’s not a lawless institution. Really, go live in a country without effective policing and then we can talk if USA police is only bringing lawlessness to the table.
        ubermonkey 3y ago
        At no point have I said anything resembling "every single policeman is a dirty criminal," but your assertion that I have definitely proves the points made in my prior reply.