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I would love for you to point out comments that that are bigoted against trans people. HN has always been a trans-friendly website and major members of HN over

I would love for you to point out comments that that are bigoted against trans people. HN has always been a trans-friendly website and major members of HN over the years have been either trans or openly pro-trans. I've never seen it, which implies dang actually does his job.

Timon3 3y ago
I've seen it a number of times and tried to argue against it when possible. Many comment chains and posts about trans people have a couple of comments deriding them as mentally ill or denying their identity. They do go dead often, but that also doesn't happen immediately.
- DiabloD3 3y ago
  It's never going to happen immediately... comments are hidden after x amount of flags, and only made actually dead after human review (ie, dang looks at the mod queue). Anything else would be a fast path to (ab)using flagging to silence individuals. I have showdead on, so I do see dead comments saying absolutely dumb shit from time to time. What I was asking for above was proof that, at this moment, there are comments that are as described and are not either dead or downvoted into oblivion. There will always be dumb people saying dumb shit, no website on earth that has user created content will ever be free of that. As long as dumb people exist on the Internet, dumb things that were uttered by dumb people will continue be handled by mods.
_cenw 3y ago
It happens pretty consistently if you mention you're trans for any reason (even if it is fully on-topic) or you are visibly trans as the writer of the post itself, you will either get voted down or an entire tangent on how trans people are mentally ill, unreliable, how you shouldn't use any projects with trans people in leadership roles will form as as a subthread... Any number of unprompted off-topic discussion involving your mental state or how trans people in general are all delusional or going into transphobic talking points (which, if you push back on them, you'll be accused of being intellectually bankrupt or something - in a thread not even about trans people). It's not "most of HN" in my experience, but more people could be calling these subthreads out, getting posts out of downvote hell and of course dang and friends could just cut that shit out, period.
- DiabloD3 3y ago
  Except... I've never seen that happen. There is no downvote brigade on HN that targets trans people. Being part of a downvote brigade is against the rules, and dang will ban you for doing it. You are asking dang to do something that is already occurring. I have never seen any thread in showdead or not that specifically targets people for being trans. I am going to re-iterate my request: show me the evidence.
  - _wf2l 3y ago
    I'm not going to argue with someone who has been on HN for so long "but never seen it", because that likely means you're one of those people who will argue indefinitely that "questioning biological gender" isn't transphobia, and that transphobic discussions just... aren't! it's there, I urge you to be aware of it in the future and not harass people who are making others aware of it. and absolutely don't tell people that they're wrong for the transphobia they have often EXPERIENCED. (And no, you don't get to ask trans people to bring out the receipts of their trauma, wtf?)
    - DiabloD3 3y ago
      Nobody is asking for trans people to "bring out receipts" of their trauma. I'm asking for proof that dang has not done his job and that there are transphobic comment threads that have not been properly moderated out of existence. Accusing people on HN of being transphobic for asking proof of transphobic behavior so that the moderators can moderate it is called "being a troll".
      - _cenw 3y ago
        I'll reiterate my claim: It does mostly get moderated, but not entirely and often way too late when the post is falling off the front page anyway. The comments do not happen on other platforms in the first place. HN just has a segment of people that will cause this. I don't want to explore if dang can personally change this or if this site needs a culture shift to address these (probably few) people, but they're there. Here's a bunch of receipts: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/110507731403617388 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/110507731403617388 Here's the thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36230649 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36230649 And here's the other thread that marcan refers to that was [flagged][dead] for about the first 3 hours and only recovered because of attention elsewhere. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36030969 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36030969 The last one also has some great comments (/s) ranging from grating to outright genocidal, especially if you switch on showdead.

Timon3 3y ago

I've seen it a number of times and tried to argue against it when possible. Many comment chains and posts about trans people have a couple of comments deriding them as mentally ill or denying their identity. They do go dead often, but that also doesn't happen immediately.

DiabloD3 3y ago
It's never going to happen immediately... comments are hidden after x amount of flags, and only made actually dead after human review (ie, dang looks at the mod queue). Anything else would be a fast path to (ab)using flagging to silence individuals. I have showdead on, so I do see dead comments saying absolutely dumb shit from time to time. What I was asking for above was proof that, at this moment, there are comments that are as described and are not either dead or downvoted into oblivion. There will always be dumb people saying dumb shit, no website on earth that has user created content will ever be free of that. As long as dumb people exist on the Internet, dumb things that were uttered by dumb people will continue be handled by mods.

_cenw 3y ago

It happens pretty consistently if you mention you're trans for any reason (even if it is fully on-topic) or you are visibly trans as the writer of the post itself, you will either get voted down or an entire tangent on how trans people are mentally ill, unreliable, how you shouldn't use any projects with trans people in leadership roles will form as as a subthread... Any number of unprompted off-topic discussion involving your mental state or how trans people in general are all delusional or going into transphobic talking points (which, if you push back on them, you'll be accused of being intellectually bankrupt or something - in a thread not even about trans people). It's not "most of HN" in my experience, but more people could be calling these subthreads out, getting posts out of downvote hell and of course dang and friends could just cut that shit out, period.

DiabloD3 3y ago
Except... I've never seen that happen. There is no downvote brigade on HN that targets trans people. Being part of a downvote brigade is against the rules, and dang will ban you for doing it. You are asking dang to do something that is already occurring. I have never seen any thread in showdead or not that specifically targets people for being trans. I am going to re-iterate my request: show me the evidence.
- _wf2l 3y ago
  I'm not going to argue with someone who has been on HN for so long "but never seen it", because that likely means you're one of those people who will argue indefinitely that "questioning biological gender" isn't transphobia, and that transphobic discussions just... aren't! it's there, I urge you to be aware of it in the future and not harass people who are making others aware of it. and absolutely don't tell people that they're wrong for the transphobia they have often EXPERIENCED. (And no, you don't get to ask trans people to bring out the receipts of their trauma, wtf?)
  - DiabloD3 3y ago
    Nobody is asking for trans people to "bring out receipts" of their trauma. I'm asking for proof that dang has not done his job and that there are transphobic comment threads that have not been properly moderated out of existence. Accusing people on HN of being transphobic for asking proof of transphobic behavior so that the moderators can moderate it is called "being a troll".
    - _cenw 3y ago
      I'll reiterate my claim: It does mostly get moderated, but not entirely and often way too late when the post is falling off the front page anyway. The comments do not happen on other platforms in the first place. HN just has a segment of people that will cause this. I don't want to explore if dang can personally change this or if this site needs a culture shift to address these (probably few) people, but they're there. Here's a bunch of receipts: https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/110507731403617388 https://social.treehouse.systems/@marcan/110507731403617388 Here's the thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36230649 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36230649 And here's the other thread that marcan refers to that was [flagged][dead] for about the first 3 hours and only recovered because of attention elsewhere. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36030969 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36030969 The last one also has some great comments (/s) ranging from grating to outright genocidal, especially if you switch on showdead.