4 ms·

Ah yes, it's totally the fault of the occasional use of firefighting foam, and not the fault of literally every single food package being covered in the stuff.

Ah yes, it's totally the fault of the occasional use of firefighting foam, and not the fault of literally every single food package being covered in the stuff. Do you have numbers to back up your assertion?

TylerE 3y ago
Food packaging? Do you have a citation for that? Cookware yes, but packaging?
- TedDoesntTalk 3y ago
  Absolutely used in food packaging. Even the inside of microwave popcorn bags has it. Just google "PFAS food packaging" and you'll lots of info.
s1artibartfast 3y ago
If we're talking about groundwater contamination, then yes, the major contributor is firefighters and US Government facilities based on the numbers I've seen. It's not food packaging making it hundreds of feet underground and leaching out into rivers. Scroll through these 180 pfas contamination Superfund sites and count how many are government facilities versus private companies. https://www.epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/superfund-sites-identified-by-epa-to-have-pfas-contamination https://www.epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/superfund-sites-... If you want to get technical, this paper estimates the impact of different sources, Comparing airports and military sites to Major PFA industrial sites. There are ~350 PFA sources from airports and military, and 7 from industry (including 3M!). The individual military and airports released more PFOS per SITE than industry. The industrial sites are associated with about 5X the PFOA in the local water. However, we are still talking about 7 industrial sites vs 350 airports and military bases. https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c07255 https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c07255
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  I'm mostly talking about breadth of harm, ie that PFAS is quite literally everywhere, rather than depth of harm, ie a couple hundred rivers have been made into poison. If the damage was exclusively contained to these rivers, the cleanup would be obscenely expensive, but possible. Currently cleanup is basically impossible.

TylerE 3y ago

Food packaging? Do you have a citation for that? Cookware yes, but packaging?

TedDoesntTalk 3y ago
Absolutely used in food packaging. Even the inside of microwave popcorn bags has it. Just google "PFAS food packaging" and you'll lots of info.

s1artibartfast 3y ago

If we're talking about groundwater contamination, then yes, the major contributor is firefighters and US Government facilities based on the numbers I've seen. It's not food packaging making it hundreds of feet underground and leaching out into rivers. Scroll through these 180 pfas contamination Superfund sites and count how many are government facilities versus private companies. https://www.epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/superfund-sites-identified-by-epa-to-have-pfas-contamination https://www.epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/superfund-sites-... If you want to get technical, this paper estimates the impact of different sources, Comparing airports and military sites to Major PFA industrial sites. There are ~350 PFA sources from airports and military, and 7 from industry (including 3M!). The individual military and airports released more PFOS per SITE than industry. The industrial sites are associated with about 5X the PFOA in the local water. However, we are still talking about 7 industrial sites vs 350 airports and military bases. https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c07255 https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c07255

mrguyorama 3y ago
I'm mostly talking about breadth of harm, ie that PFAS is quite literally everywhere, rather than depth of harm, ie a couple hundred rivers have been made into poison. If the damage was exclusively contained to these rivers, the cleanup would be obscenely expensive, but possible. Currently cleanup is basically impossible.