5 ms·

It's a terrible luxury product though because 1) Prop 13 means that people from 50 years ago are still in the luxury neighborhoods 2) Crime is not sufficiently

It's a terrible luxury product though because 1) Prop 13 means that people from 50 years ago are still in the luxury neighborhoods 2) Crime is not sufficiently eradicated even from expensive areas

esotericimpl 3y ago
California is in the top quartile of safest states in the US. Your complaint is that rich people wont have their property taxes jacked up and they haven't "eradicated" crime. As a response to the fact that California is as close to the French Riviera as we have in the US.
- pookha 3y ago
  I've never seen this insanity anywhere in world except for California: https://nypost.com/2023/07/18/san-francisco-stores-lock-up-frozen-food-to-deter-shoplifters/ https://nypost.com/2023/07/18/san-francisco-stores-lock-up-f...
  - mrguyorama 3y ago
    This KIND of thing however is extremely common in poverty stricken areas. Poor areas are crime ridden, because most people in poverty lack other choices, and very few people will choose to just lay down and die quietly like some people seem to think they should. Look at mcdonalds in detroit and stuff like that, they look like banks inside, with bulletproof plastic panels between customers and staff. Californian elitists just get pissy that they have to see it in their back yard, because they want the suffering required to support their profits to be out of sight and out of mind. People bitch and moan that "california already spends a shitload on homelessness" but like, it's california, even the small office you have to have just for a social worker to have a laptop to keep things organized will cost millions a year. If you want to function somewhere that has a land cost ten times anywhere else, you are going to have to pay more. Period. The janitors need to live there too.
  - esotericimpl 3y ago
    [dead]
ChuckMcM 3y ago
Just to put a dose of reality here, Prop 13 property taxes reset on sales (there are exceptions when selling to children of the owners but generally they reset) and property turnover rates in California are generally in excess of 10%. What that means is that pretty much all of the taxes are reset every 10 years or so. This is more true of "desirable" places to live (Bay Area, LA, San Diego) than say "less desirable". I have encouraged (without success so far) the County Assessor's office to publish the "net" tax year (average, median, and mode) for the county to help people better understand this.
- riku_iki 3y ago
  Unless it is the same 10 percent resetting over and over and other 90 percent don't change hands
- sokoloff 3y ago
  It seems like around 2/3 of the base would be reset in 10 years, if each house has an equal, random chance to be sold. I think the reality is smaller homes change hands more often and larger homes less often, meaning the chance that a larger home changes hands in a given decade could easily be less than half. (And naturally, the longer a house is held, the longer it’s likely to be held, even without Prop 13, but Prop 13 makes it a stronger sticky force.)
- sib 3y ago
  >> Prop 13 property taxes reset on sales ... and property turnover rates in California are generally in excess of 10%. What that means is that pretty much all of the taxes are reset every 10 years or so That would be assuming certain things, among which would be that if 10% of properties sell every year, there is a consistent 10% chance of a given property selling each year. What I can tell you from looking at the data on all the houses in the neighborhood in which we bought our home in 2019 is that the vast majority of them had been last purchased more than 20 years earlier (and quite a few more than 30). Given the significant economic incentives created by Prop 13, houses in appreciating areas should be less likely to turn over than ones in areas where values are relatively stable.
  - 3y ago
seizethecheese 3y ago
Nah, many luxury products (like an Ivy League education) involve lower class people. It adds flavor.
drcode 3y ago
crime in Mill valley, just on the other side of the golden gate bridge, is infinitesimal

It's a terrible luxury product though because 1) Prop 13 means that people from 50 years ago are still in the luxury neighborhoods 2) Crime is not sufficiently eradicated even from expensive areas

esotericimpl 3y ago

California is in the top quartile of safest states in the US. Your complaint is that rich people wont have their property taxes jacked up and they haven't "eradicated" crime. As a response to the fact that California is as close to the French Riviera as we have in the US.

pookha 3y ago
I've never seen this insanity anywhere in world except for California: https://nypost.com/2023/07/18/san-francisco-stores-lock-up-frozen-food-to-deter-shoplifters/ https://nypost.com/2023/07/18/san-francisco-stores-lock-up-f...
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  This KIND of thing however is extremely common in poverty stricken areas. Poor areas are crime ridden, because most people in poverty lack other choices, and very few people will choose to just lay down and die quietly like some people seem to think they should. Look at mcdonalds in detroit and stuff like that, they look like banks inside, with bulletproof plastic panels between customers and staff. Californian elitists just get pissy that they have to see it in their back yard, because they want the suffering required to support their profits to be out of sight and out of mind. People bitch and moan that "california already spends a shitload on homelessness" but like, it's california, even the small office you have to have just for a social worker to have a laptop to keep things organized will cost millions a year. If you want to function somewhere that has a land cost ten times anywhere else, you are going to have to pay more. Period. The janitors need to live there too.
- esotericimpl 3y ago
  [dead]

ChuckMcM 3y ago

Just to put a dose of reality here, Prop 13 property taxes reset on sales (there are exceptions when selling to children of the owners but generally they reset) and property turnover rates in California are generally in excess of 10%. What that means is that pretty much all of the taxes are reset every 10 years or so. This is more true of "desirable" places to live (Bay Area, LA, San Diego) than say "less desirable". I have encouraged (without success so far) the County Assessor's office to publish the "net" tax year (average, median, and mode) for the county to help people better understand this.

riku_iki 3y ago
Unless it is the same 10 percent resetting over and over and other 90 percent don't change hands
sokoloff 3y ago
It seems like around 2/3 of the base would be reset in 10 years, if each house has an equal, random chance to be sold. I think the reality is smaller homes change hands more often and larger homes less often, meaning the chance that a larger home changes hands in a given decade could easily be less than half. (And naturally, the longer a house is held, the longer it’s likely to be held, even without Prop 13, but Prop 13 makes it a stronger sticky force.)
sib 3y ago
>> Prop 13 property taxes reset on sales ... and property turnover rates in California are generally in excess of 10%. What that means is that pretty much all of the taxes are reset every 10 years or so That would be assuming certain things, among which would be that if 10% of properties sell every year, there is a consistent 10% chance of a given property selling each year. What I can tell you from looking at the data on all the houses in the neighborhood in which we bought our home in 2019 is that the vast majority of them had been last purchased more than 20 years earlier (and quite a few more than 30). Given the significant economic incentives created by Prop 13, houses in appreciating areas should be less likely to turn over than ones in areas where values are relatively stable.
- 3y ago

seizethecheese 3y ago

Nah, many luxury products (like an Ivy League education) involve lower class people. It adds flavor.

drcode 3y ago

crime in Mill valley, just on the other side of the golden gate bridge, is infinitesimal