4 ms·

> generating tonal effects that can't really be replicated. Seems my headphones can replicate it judging from hearing the audio. Am I missing something?

by dtx1 3y ago

ruined 3y ago
you're listening to a recording. a musician wants to make sound
wahnfrieden 3y ago
Synthesis not sample
piwi 3y ago
There are simulators such a Kemper or neural DSP that can reproduce fairly well any amp, but it is expensive, and imperfect. When you play on emulation it's difficult to know if it is faithful without having used the original. Some musician appreciate them, others avoid them. When you happen to finally get the real gear, you often realize it sounds better, and have a wider range of usage. The convenience of real dedicate knobs, without menus is unmatched. There is some pleasure with getting the real thing, and use it by yourself.
Blackthorn 3y ago
Well, it's the creation rather than the playback that's important, but you aren't really missing anything. It's not like the various waveshaping functionality of those aren't documented, they're entirely reproducible in software.
- fennecfoxy 3y ago
  This is why most "audiophile" stuff is redundant in my mind, a lot of people seem to act like valves have some sort of magic that we cannot profile and just reproduce in software. But then again there's nothing wrong with people romanticising stuff as long as it's more "valves are cool because they're retro and nostalgic" over "valves are cool because they're objectively better".
tnecniv 3y ago
It’s not about playing the wave form but creating the wave form. Guitarists today still use tube amps and germanium transistors (in guitar pedals) for two reasons. The first is that most guitar amps back in the day used tubes (mostly) and the early guitar pedals used Germanium. Guitarists wanted to sound like the earlier musicians that used that technology [1] so they want to use that technology to achieve a certain tone with their instrument. The generation after them wanted to sound like them, so that means old tech for them, too! Repeat until today. The second reason is that an electric guitar is a combination of a physical and electrical system, and the distortion that is essentially synonymous with electric guitars [2] comes from pushing an amplifier out of its “intended” linear regime [3] into the nonlinear regime where it stops amplifying and starts clipping the signal. The way this nonlinear regime varies with the choice of tubes and transistors, but in general you can’t really replicate one with the other. These unique non linearities impact both the output sound and, most importantly to me as a player, the way the amplifier responds to my physical technique (e.g., how the sound varies with how hard I hit a string). I have played solid state amps that aim to emulate tube amps, and to me the biggest difference isn’t the sound but that physical response. I haven’t played the top of the line modeling amps, but this has been my main problem with the practice amps I’ve tried. As a result, if I’m not playing in my bedroom (pushing a tube amp to distort at apartment friendly volumes is hard), I play through a tube amp. The differences between silicon and germanium transistors are similar, but more subtle and I’m someone who owns a lot of pedals and is constantly switching them out to fit my mood. [1] an interesting counter example is that the Beatles used early solid state amps on at least some albums [2] Plenty of people play “clean” without distortion, but if you spend time on guitar forums, you see a lot of beginners who ask a question of the form “I just got my first electric guitar, why doesn’t it sound like an electric guitar?” [3] Early on the goal was to produce high headroom amps that didn’t distort, but this was very challenging. Rock musicians latched on to the distorted sound and then that became a design feature in later amps. However, if you try to make like a 59 Bassman distort, you have to play it loud enough to kill someone. You can also achieve distortion in other ways, e.g. clipping diodes, but that’s not really germane to this discussion.

> generating tonal effects that can't really be replicated. Seems my headphones can replicate it judging from hearing the audio. Am I missing something?

by dtx1 3y ago

> generating tonal effects that can't really be replicated. Seems my headphones can replicate it judging from hearing the audio. Am I missing something?

ruined 3y ago

you're listening to a recording. a musician wants to make sound

wahnfrieden 3y ago

Synthesis not sample

piwi 3y ago

There are simulators such a Kemper or neural DSP that can reproduce fairly well any amp, but it is expensive, and imperfect. When you play on emulation it's difficult to know if it is faithful without having used the original. Some musician appreciate them, others avoid them. When you happen to finally get the real gear, you often realize it sounds better, and have a wider range of usage. The convenience of real dedicate knobs, without menus is unmatched. There is some pleasure with getting the real thing, and use it by yourself.

Blackthorn 3y ago

Well, it's the creation rather than the playback that's important, but you aren't really missing anything. It's not like the various waveshaping functionality of those aren't documented, they're entirely reproducible in software.

fennecfoxy 3y ago
This is why most "audiophile" stuff is redundant in my mind, a lot of people seem to act like valves have some sort of magic that we cannot profile and just reproduce in software. But then again there's nothing wrong with people romanticising stuff as long as it's more "valves are cool because they're retro and nostalgic" over "valves are cool because they're objectively better".

tnecniv 3y ago

It’s not about playing the wave form but creating the wave form. Guitarists today still use tube amps and germanium transistors (in guitar pedals) for two reasons. The first is that most guitar amps back in the day used tubes (mostly) and the early guitar pedals used Germanium. Guitarists wanted to sound like the earlier musicians that used that technology [1] so they want to use that technology to achieve a certain tone with their instrument. The generation after them wanted to sound like them, so that means old tech for them, too! Repeat until today. The second reason is that an electric guitar is a combination of a physical and electrical system, and the distortion that is essentially synonymous with electric guitars [2] comes from pushing an amplifier out of its “intended” linear regime [3] into the nonlinear regime where it stops amplifying and starts clipping the signal. The way this nonlinear regime varies with the choice of tubes and transistors, but in general you can’t really replicate one with the other. These unique non linearities impact both the output sound and, most importantly to me as a player, the way the amplifier responds to my physical technique (e.g., how the sound varies with how hard I hit a string). I have played solid state amps that aim to emulate tube amps, and to me the biggest difference isn’t the sound but that physical response. I haven’t played the top of the line modeling amps, but this has been my main problem with the practice amps I’ve tried. As a result, if I’m not playing in my bedroom (pushing a tube amp to distort at apartment friendly volumes is hard), I play through a tube amp. The differences between silicon and germanium transistors are similar, but more subtle and I’m someone who owns a lot of pedals and is constantly switching them out to fit my mood. [1] an interesting counter example is that the Beatles used early solid state amps on at least some albums [2] Plenty of people play “clean” without distortion, but if you spend time on guitar forums, you see a lot of beginners who ask a question of the form “I just got my first electric guitar, why doesn’t it sound like an electric guitar?” [3] Early on the goal was to produce high headroom amps that didn’t distort, but this was very challenging. Rock musicians latched on to the distorted sound and then that became a design feature in later amps. However, if you try to make like a 59 Bassman distort, you have to play it loud enough to kill someone. You can also achieve distortion in other ways, e.g. clipping diodes, but that’s not really germane to this discussion.