3 ms·

Yep, experience of life, love of family, desire to help steer the country you’ve contributed your whole life to… nah, you’re right, fuck the old they have nothi

• paulmd 3y ago
  Having no stake in the long term future is not the same thing as having nothing to offer. We also don’t generally allow other “transient” populations like non-citizen immigrants to vote either, despite them having a lot to offer too. If you’re not going to be here in 10 years you don’t get a say. We also have lower age limits on voting and there’s very good reasons for that too. People try to raise the voting age limits all the time to curb the political influence of the younger voters. It’s a situation like class wars where one side is playing hardball and the other side isn’t even aware they were playing. Point out the nature of the game you’ll be pounced (just as you did here) for “ageism” despite ageism already being written into the rules, and despite the elderly here (in the US) are continually trying to shift those rules even further in their own favor. The hand of the dead should not bind the living, nor should the hand of transient populations bind those with a long-term stake in the society. And there will inevitably be some edge-cases where people slip around the edges of the rules (citizens with deadly illnesses, immigrants who own homes and settle, etc) but those are just the guiding principles society has agreed upon, except when it comes to the elderly.
  • Nursie 3y ago
    > We also don’t generally allow other “transient” populations like non-citizen immigrants to vote either This is not why we don't allow migrants who have not yet become citizens the ability to vote. They have not (yet) been granted a place in society because they have not yet demonstrated commitment to the country, nor contributed, and the country has not yet decided they are valuable enough to allow into the society. > We also have lower age limits on voting and there’s very good reasons for that too. Yes, due to inexperience of life, ignorance of politics and the wider world, and brains which are not yet fully formed, reasons that people below these ages are denied full autonomy in a number of areas. These reasons are not applicable to most older people. > People try to raise the voting age limits all the time In the context of the UK, which this discussion is about, this has literally never happened, not once. The elections are comparatively well run, you seldom have to wait more than a few minutes to vote there because polling stations and staff are not limited, gerrymandering doesn't exist, voter suppression is pretty universally regarded as evil. You seem to be in the US, one of your political parties appears to have effectively become cancerous and is trying to kill US democracy, I wish you luck in dealing with it but inter-generational hate is unlikely to help. > It’s a situation like class wars where one side ... Point out the nature of the game you’ll be pounced (just as you did here) ... those are just the guiding principles ... There are no sides here. There is no war between the young and the old. These are not principles that society has agreed on at all. It's hard to see how you could be more wrong. I 'pounced' upon these views because they are gross. At what age do you think people have no stake in the long term future? Do you only have a stake or guidance to give if you personally will be affected? Do you not get to vote on the short term matters that do personally affect you? Should people in general only be able to vote on things that affect them personally and directly? I don't have kids, should I be denied a vote because we might be deciding eduction policy and school funding? Besides naked prejudice, you seem to have a very transactional view of democracy - you assume people will obviously only vote in their own short-term self interest, not use their knowledge and morality to guide their choices for their own good and that of others. I wish you luck in fixing the US, but don't project its flaws onto everyone else. And don't just blame old people for your woes. Those steering the ship over there are not all ancient and there are plenty of young people involved in all sorts of terrible stuff.