6 ms·

Samsung blowtware is a problem though

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
Which bloatware and what problems does it make you? For me, I don't really consider Microsoft Office as bloatware as I can use it, plus, what's bloatware for you might be useful apps for others, and I found it stays out of my way once I push it to the side if I don't need it, so it's existence is a non-issue for usability. Samsung bloatware used to be bad in the past but now it's decent IMHO, and I think people are being overly pedantic and mostly overblow the problem of some bloatware just to win some religious argument of "my choice of phone is better than yours" while ignoring the other useful reasons people buy it. If you wanna see real bloatware, check out Chinese phones.
- drcongo 3y ago
  If the apps are useful to some people but not others, they could just put them on the Play store, but they don't they force everyone to have them.
  - FirmwareBurner 3y ago
    Sure, each to his own, but personally I and others don't really care about the preexisting apps as they're few and they stay out of my way and don't pester me. I just want a great phone for a decent price, that fits all my needs and I'm not gonna die on this "zero-bloatware" hill for the sake of a philosophical stance, because I'm not letting perfect be the enemy of good. What use to me is a zero bloatware device that doesn't have the HW, features or updates, that I personally need and value?
  - Xeamek 3y ago
    Just like google does with their apps, right? Oh wait...
- tjoff 3y ago
  ALL OF THEM. It is utterly insane how much crap they have in baked in. Everything tries to connect to you ludicrous samsung account and the best selling point their apps have is that they try to masquerade them as standard android apps and not a cheap samsung knockoff. I have to support friends with samsung a bit and I get a headache even touching them. Great cameras, wouldn't touch one even if I was paid to actually use it. And this is using top-of-line devices. They also have the absolute lowest range too, which is quite impressive hardware/dollar wise but the software situation is of course even worse on such an underpowered device. The telemetry and the dark patterns they utilize gets me in the stomach. The big problem is that for I guess the majority that don't actively fight it they get extremely tied to samsung. Which I guess is a key reason to their success. A big detriment to android though.
  - Xeamek 3y ago
    >Everything tries to connect to you ludicrous samsung account So, exactly as with google trying to sign into google's account? >the best selling point their apps have is that they try to masquerade them as standard android apps and not a cheap samsung knockoff. Again, same for google's apps which people think "come as a part of android", but in reallity they arent? >The telemetry and the dark patterns they utilize gets me in the stomach. As if google doesn't use telemetry? Not to mention, there are things in which the samsung apps are OBJECTIVELLY better: OneUI's customization is far beyond what stock android offers. Samsung Files has more features then google files, ie. mounting network drives. Sure, those are small differences, but people just default to "samsung bad" without actually giving the altenatives a fair shot
    - tjoff 3y ago
      >So, exactly as with google trying to sign into google's account? Massive difference though. Samsung tries to trick people to use it by not being up front with what account it is and what it is for. Now, don't get me wrong. Google would probably do the same, but in this case they don't have to - because it is their OS. It is trivial to skip the google account if you want but it actually has its place in android. A samsung account on the other hand just makes things objectively worse, and at every turn they dare they try to get you deeper into their dependence, always trying to trick you into depending on samsung for the same stuff google already does for you (if you went that route). How you can compare the two boggles me. And even if the shady practices doesn't bother you and you feel like they are equally bad, then both of them are twice as bad. Why on earth would I want to use one I didn't have to? And above all, why would I tie my android experience to one vendor? > Again, same for google's apps which people think "come as a part of android", but in reallity they arent? Really not the same, but yes, google bundles crap too if that is your point. Samsung is way better at making crap though. Regardless, who should be bundling crap anyway? The OS vendor or the hardware vendor? The hardware vendor is more than fine to write apps directly related to hardware features but other than that they should just fuck off. > As if google doesn't use telemetry? You think it is ok if Dell installs telemetry on a Windows PC? As much as I hate google what samsung is doing doesn't compare.
- jwells89 3y ago
  I don't want the OS to have any material differences at all between devices. Android should be like Windows, which is the same no matter where it's running. Even the "good" changes that manufacturers make are unwelcome, because they dull much of the appeal of an OS like Android where hardware vendors are interchangeable and can be switched on a whim without software downsides. I don't want to become dependent on some manufacturer-specific change. If it were practical to do so, every Android device I buy would immediately have its OS replaced with something like LineageOS or Pixel Experience to eliminate these variances, much as technically inclined people will wipe the Windows install that comes stock on a prebuilt PC in favor of vanilla Windows.
  - pmontra 3y ago
    > Android should be like Windows, which is the same no matter where it's running Is it? I remember some HP specific software when I turned on my new laptop to reformat it with Linux.
    - jwells89 3y ago
      It is, if you wipe it and reinstall plain Windows and whatever drivers are necessary, which is trivial on x86 PCs and basically the default for technically capable individuals. But even then, PC manufacturer bloatware doesn't typically modify the OS itself and is just extra crap bolted to it. The versions of Android that gets shipped on phones and tablets by contrast are different at the source level, sometimes bearing significant divergences from AOSP.
      - cma 3y ago
        Razer and Nvidia drivers almost force a login on you and do things like constantly spin up and wear out your idle HDDs searching for games to "optimize." You often have to do a research project filled with SEO spam to get around stuff like that.
        jwells89 3y ago
        At least in the case of Nvidia, the drivers bundled with Windows are good enough for most peoples' needs. It sucks for those of us who want up to date drivers for more demanding use cases though.
- kaba0 3y ago
  I am just personally opposed to Google having all that much access to my data, which is quite funnily only possible to prevent on an android by having.. a pixel and installing GrapheneOS on top. Sure, lineage and such exist for other phones as well, but people seem to forget that it is not some thinkpad where you can just swap the OS to your liking — plenty of phones have proprietary firmware that auto-wipes on reinstall. I wouldn’t want my fancy, expensive S-twenty-X’s camera to become essentially garbage.
- HelloMcFly 3y ago
  > Which bloatware and what problems does it make you? Just about every single pre-installed app? Their store, their browser, Bixby, Bixby vision, messaging, their car mode, their friends, Galaxy smartwatch BS, SmartThings, their weather app. It's all - to an app - worse than the alternatives, and worse than Google's defaults if that's your preference.
  - throw9away6 3y ago
    This i want to be able to get rid of it all
  - wilsonnb3 3y ago
    > Just about every single pre-installed app? You can disable any app aside from the Galaxy Store, I believe. Takes like 5 minutes to do them all if you are a die hard Samsung hater. > Their store, their browser, Bixby, Bixby vision, messaging, their car mode, their friends, Galaxy smartwatch BS, SmartThings, their weather app. It's all - to an app - worse than the alternatives, and worse than Google's defaults if that's your preference. They don't have their own car mode or messaging, they use Android Auto and Google Messages. As someone who uses some of them, Samsung apps are actually quite good generally. Even if they were all hot garbage, there is nothing wrong with having more options IMO. All you lose is a bit of diskspace if you disable them.
    - JohnFen 3y ago
      > You can disable any app aside from the Galaxy Store, I believe. Yes, which is better than nothing, but not nearly as good as being able to uninstall that stuff.
    - HelloMcFly 3y ago
      > They don't have their own car mode or messaging, they use Android Auto and Google Messages. As of late 2021 when I got my last Samsung this was not the case for the default messaging app. I thought driving mode (not Android Auto alternative) was different too but I do feel less confident about that.
  - 3y ago
yabatopia 3y ago
How about Google bloatware? Samsung Internet browser is far more superior than Google Chrome, but you can't uninstall Chrome. Of Gmail. Or Play Store. Much of the bloat is coming from Google. After all, it's a Samsung device, not a Google device. I used to be some kind of Androis purist, owner of multiple Nexus and Pixel devices. But for several years now, I'm sticking with Samsung.
lurker919 3y ago
Yes, the only reason that prods me away from a samsung phone. I don't want unnecessary apps on my screens/mindspace.
- Xeamek 3y ago
  You can hide an app from showing in "apps" screen

Which bloatware and what problems does it make you? For me, I don't really consider Microsoft Office as bloatware as I can use it, plus, what's bloatware for you might be useful apps for others, and I found it stays out of my way once I push it to the side if I don't need it, so it's existence is a non-issue for usability. Samsung bloatware used to be bad in the past but now it's decent IMHO, and I think people are being overly pedantic and mostly overblow the problem of some bloatware just to win some religious argument of "my choice of phone is better than yours" while ignoring the other useful reasons people buy it. If you wanna see real bloatware, check out Chinese phones.

drcongo 3y ago
If the apps are useful to some people but not others, they could just put them on the Play store, but they don't they force everyone to have them.
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  Sure, each to his own, but personally I and others don't really care about the preexisting apps as they're few and they stay out of my way and don't pester me. I just want a great phone for a decent price, that fits all my needs and I'm not gonna die on this "zero-bloatware" hill for the sake of a philosophical stance, because I'm not letting perfect be the enemy of good. What use to me is a zero bloatware device that doesn't have the HW, features or updates, that I personally need and value?
- Xeamek 3y ago
  Just like google does with their apps, right? Oh wait...
tjoff 3y ago
ALL OF THEM. It is utterly insane how much crap they have in baked in. Everything tries to connect to you ludicrous samsung account and the best selling point their apps have is that they try to masquerade them as standard android apps and not a cheap samsung knockoff. I have to support friends with samsung a bit and I get a headache even touching them. Great cameras, wouldn't touch one even if I was paid to actually use it. And this is using top-of-line devices. They also have the absolute lowest range too, which is quite impressive hardware/dollar wise but the software situation is of course even worse on such an underpowered device. The telemetry and the dark patterns they utilize gets me in the stomach. The big problem is that for I guess the majority that don't actively fight it they get extremely tied to samsung. Which I guess is a key reason to their success. A big detriment to android though.
- Xeamek 3y ago
  >Everything tries to connect to you ludicrous samsung account So, exactly as with google trying to sign into google's account? >the best selling point their apps have is that they try to masquerade them as standard android apps and not a cheap samsung knockoff. Again, same for google's apps which people think "come as a part of android", but in reallity they arent? >The telemetry and the dark patterns they utilize gets me in the stomach. As if google doesn't use telemetry? Not to mention, there are things in which the samsung apps are OBJECTIVELLY better: OneUI's customization is far beyond what stock android offers. Samsung Files has more features then google files, ie. mounting network drives. Sure, those are small differences, but people just default to "samsung bad" without actually giving the altenatives a fair shot
  - tjoff 3y ago
    >So, exactly as with google trying to sign into google's account? Massive difference though. Samsung tries to trick people to use it by not being up front with what account it is and what it is for. Now, don't get me wrong. Google would probably do the same, but in this case they don't have to - because it is their OS. It is trivial to skip the google account if you want but it actually has its place in android. A samsung account on the other hand just makes things objectively worse, and at every turn they dare they try to get you deeper into their dependence, always trying to trick you into depending on samsung for the same stuff google already does for you (if you went that route). How you can compare the two boggles me. And even if the shady practices doesn't bother you and you feel like they are equally bad, then both of them are twice as bad. Why on earth would I want to use one I didn't have to? And above all, why would I tie my android experience to one vendor? > Again, same for google's apps which people think "come as a part of android", but in reallity they arent? Really not the same, but yes, google bundles crap too if that is your point. Samsung is way better at making crap though. Regardless, who should be bundling crap anyway? The OS vendor or the hardware vendor? The hardware vendor is more than fine to write apps directly related to hardware features but other than that they should just fuck off. > As if google doesn't use telemetry? You think it is ok if Dell installs telemetry on a Windows PC? As much as I hate google what samsung is doing doesn't compare.
jwells89 3y ago
I don't want the OS to have any material differences at all between devices. Android should be like Windows, which is the same no matter where it's running. Even the "good" changes that manufacturers make are unwelcome, because they dull much of the appeal of an OS like Android where hardware vendors are interchangeable and can be switched on a whim without software downsides. I don't want to become dependent on some manufacturer-specific change. If it were practical to do so, every Android device I buy would immediately have its OS replaced with something like LineageOS or Pixel Experience to eliminate these variances, much as technically inclined people will wipe the Windows install that comes stock on a prebuilt PC in favor of vanilla Windows.
- pmontra 3y ago
  > Android should be like Windows, which is the same no matter where it's running Is it? I remember some HP specific software when I turned on my new laptop to reformat it with Linux.
  - jwells89 3y ago
    It is, if you wipe it and reinstall plain Windows and whatever drivers are necessary, which is trivial on x86 PCs and basically the default for technically capable individuals. But even then, PC manufacturer bloatware doesn't typically modify the OS itself and is just extra crap bolted to it. The versions of Android that gets shipped on phones and tablets by contrast are different at the source level, sometimes bearing significant divergences from AOSP.
    - cma 3y ago
      Razer and Nvidia drivers almost force a login on you and do things like constantly spin up and wear out your idle HDDs searching for games to "optimize." You often have to do a research project filled with SEO spam to get around stuff like that.
      - jwells89 3y ago
        At least in the case of Nvidia, the drivers bundled with Windows are good enough for most peoples' needs. It sucks for those of us who want up to date drivers for more demanding use cases though.
kaba0 3y ago
I am just personally opposed to Google having all that much access to my data, which is quite funnily only possible to prevent on an android by having.. a pixel and installing GrapheneOS on top. Sure, lineage and such exist for other phones as well, but people seem to forget that it is not some thinkpad where you can just swap the OS to your liking — plenty of phones have proprietary firmware that auto-wipes on reinstall. I wouldn’t want my fancy, expensive S-twenty-X’s camera to become essentially garbage.
HelloMcFly 3y ago
> Which bloatware and what problems does it make you? Just about every single pre-installed app? Their store, their browser, Bixby, Bixby vision, messaging, their car mode, their friends, Galaxy smartwatch BS, SmartThings, their weather app. It's all - to an app - worse than the alternatives, and worse than Google's defaults if that's your preference.
- throw9away6 3y ago
  This i want to be able to get rid of it all
- wilsonnb3 3y ago
  > Just about every single pre-installed app? You can disable any app aside from the Galaxy Store, I believe. Takes like 5 minutes to do them all if you are a die hard Samsung hater. > Their store, their browser, Bixby, Bixby vision, messaging, their car mode, their friends, Galaxy smartwatch BS, SmartThings, their weather app. It's all - to an app - worse than the alternatives, and worse than Google's defaults if that's your preference. They don't have their own car mode or messaging, they use Android Auto and Google Messages. As someone who uses some of them, Samsung apps are actually quite good generally. Even if they were all hot garbage, there is nothing wrong with having more options IMO. All you lose is a bit of diskspace if you disable them.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > You can disable any app aside from the Galaxy Store, I believe. Yes, which is better than nothing, but not nearly as good as being able to uninstall that stuff.
  - HelloMcFly 3y ago
    > They don't have their own car mode or messaging, they use Android Auto and Google Messages. As of late 2021 when I got my last Samsung this was not the case for the default messaging app. I thought driving mode (not Android Auto alternative) was different too but I do feel less confident about that.
- 3y ago

yabatopia 3y ago

How about Google bloatware? Samsung Internet browser is far more superior than Google Chrome, but you can't uninstall Chrome. Of Gmail. Or Play Store. Much of the bloat is coming from Google. After all, it's a Samsung device, not a Google device. I used to be some kind of Androis purist, owner of multiple Nexus and Pixel devices. But for several years now, I'm sticking with Samsung.

lurker919 3y ago

Yes, the only reason that prods me away from a samsung phone. I don't want unnecessary apps on my screens/mindspace.

Xeamek 3y ago
You can hide an app from showing in "apps" screen