5 ms·

Pull of the Undercurl

triyambakam 3y ago
Pretty amazing to see someone else using my exact same setup - alacritty, tmux and neovim. Is that like seeing a unicorn?
- LorenzoGood 3y ago
  It's fairly common for twm users.
- dcow 3y ago
  Kitty performs better and renders font more beautifully than Alacritty, and Alacritty's devs are openly hostile to macOS users, so I've stuck with Kitty. I really want a native Rust terminal emulator to be good, though.
  - pdimitar 3y ago
    > Alacritty's devs are openly hostile to macOS users What do you mean by that? I noticed some bindings randomly stop working even though I'm explicitly configuring them -- ALT and left / right arrow are the most prominent example -- but I'm curious if your observations are rooted in other problems?
    - dcow 3y ago
      It likely broke because the dev won’t touch macOS with a 39.5' pole, so they obviously don’t test changes. I tried offering to help get the macOS build notarized (financially and logistically) so that it would work without disabling gatekeeper and was laughed out of the issue tracker for using a stupid OS. I tried explaining that I don’t always control which OS I use (not that it matters) and that since I use all of them one of the major advantages of a terminal emulator is that it works consistently across platforms. They basically told me that I’m an idiot for using macOS and put me in the middle of their ideological battle with Apple.
      - zenolove 3y ago
        I believe this is the issue mentioned by parent: https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty/issues/4673 https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty/issues/4673
        dcow 3y ago
        The best part is the maintainer wouldn’t even approve a PR to add one sentence to the readme explaining the expectation that users need to manually add a gatekeeper exception, because helping macOS users onboard “has no value” to the project (to him).
- DiabloD3 3y ago
  Isn't this the norm? Are we all the same person?
  - fernandotakai 3y ago
    i legit thought this was an incredibly popular setup, because i have three coworkers (+ myself) with the exact same config (alacritty + tmux + neovim).
    - triyambakam 3y ago
      I had no idea it was so popular! I'm the only engineer at my company that I'm aware of that uses vim (neovim), let alone alacritty or tmux.
- igor47 3y ago
  It's my setup also!
- lwhsiao 3y ago
  This used to be my setup as well! Nowadays I'm running wezterm, tmux, and helix.
- oh_sigh 3y ago
  It is pretty weird, that is my exact setup too. But instead of alacritty I use iterm2, and instead of tmux I use screen, and instead of neovim I use emacs. But regardless, spooky!
  - quaddo 3y ago
    I'm trying to tell from your comment as well as the others' comments whether you're running screen locally, and what benefits that brings above and beyond iTerm for local shell sessions. For anyone else using tmux locally, I'd be interested as well. Genuinely curious. I'd consider doing likewise if the reason is compelling.
    - zokier 3y ago
      I'd guess one factor is that macos has relatively poor native keyboard driven tiling capabilities, so tmux functions as kind of poor mans tiling wm.
    - paulannesley 3y ago
      > what benefits that brings above and beyond iTerm for local shell sessions > For anyone else using tmux locally, I'd be interested as well. I run tmux in iTerm2 on macOS; tmux is my window-manager of choice for terminal applications; shells, nvim, etc. I usually have 2–10 tmux “windows” (more like tabs) with 2–4 split panes in each (more like tiled windows). I generally never detach from my local tmux session. Most things I use and love tmux for could probably be done with iTerm2 tabs and splits, or a modern text editor and its terminal integrations. But, I can use tmux in iTerm2 or Terminal.app or Kitty or Gnome Terminal or urxvt, on macOS or Linux or FreeBSD and it works the same everywhere. Perhaps that's a key feature; decoupling your “terminal window manager” or “terminal desktop environment” from your terminal emulator (I guess that's like the X server in this analogy). Also, tmux feels more keyboard-native… I can do everything from the keyboard, including navigating scrollbacks, finding/selecting/copying/pasting text, etc. Again, you can probably achieve at least 90% of this using a richly-featured terminal emulator like iTerm2, but tmux does it well, and it's portable. Also, tmux feels more Unix… it has config files that can be git-managed, it has man pages, it is scriptable from bash/anything, etc. That easy scriptability leads to some nice integrations, like I can configure key bindings in nvim that run commands (e.g. the test I have open) in a tmux split alongside nvim. Again, that's nothing that things like VS Code can't do too with their built-in terminal emulators etc. But it's nice. (Despite loving tmux and iTerm2, the one thing I don't like is iTerm2's native tmux integration, where it uses tmux as the “engine” but replaces the UI with OS-native windows/splits etc. It's technically impressive, but mostly negates all the reasons I run tmux inside iTerm2 in the first place)
Temporary_31337 3y ago
Since so many people here seem to have a similar setup can anyone recommend a write up on how to set it up and why is it worth the hassle?
- throwaway290 3y ago
  if you read HN for more than a month you will probably see more than one post discussing them as well as their alternatives, or you can use search to see those posts. If you find that you like each tool for what it offers (and doesn't offer) then you will probably like them in combination. If not then not. Why would you expect someone to know you enough to say it's worth the hassle for you?
nubinetwork 3y ago
Dupe https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36753161 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36753161
- jsnell 3y ago
  That had no comments and one upvote. It's totally fine to resubmit articles that didn't get significant attention the first time.
  - nubinetwork 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - yabbs 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - dang 3y ago
        Please don't post unsubstantive comments to HN. We're trying for something else here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
    - jsnell 3y ago
      If you continue antagonizing people with your fake dupe claims and have a large proportion of your posts flashed, there's a chance that the entire account gets shadowbanned. And then most people won't see the subset of posts where you have a legit point either. A small number of reposts is not only permitted by the rules of the doors, it is very often explicitly encouraged by the mods. Railing against that is really not productive, especially since those reposts are often some of the very best posts to the site.
- dang 3y ago
  HN's policy about dupes has been consistent for many years (it goes back to pg, who started the site and ran it for the first 8 years or so), so I hope it's ok if I explain it a bit. On HN, a post only counts as a dupe if the same story has had significant attention in the last year or so. If it hasn't had significant attention yet, or if it has, but more than a year or so ago, then reposts are fine. The reason is that we want to give good stories multiple cracks at the bat, i.e. multiple chances at getting attention. Otherwise it's too random—randomness is a strong factor in what does or doesn't get noticed on the /newest page and we want to even that out over time. Pointing out dupes in HN comments is great, but only if you link to a previous post that has had significant attention in the last year or so. Otherwise HN users will get irritated when they click on a link and are taken to a previous submission that didn't get any activity. I hope that makes sense! By the way, some of the posts you've flagged as dupes were actually invited reposts—we comb through old submissions looking for good articles that didn't get noticed the first (or second, or third) time around, and invite one of the previous submitters to submit it again. Invited reposts go into the second-chance pool (https://news.ycombinator.com/pool https://news.ycombinator.com/pool, explained at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308), so they get a random placement on HN's front page. This is another device we came up with for trying to mitigate the randomness of /newest. We want to maximize the opportunity for the best (for HN) articles to get in front of the community. At that point, readers can make up their own minds if the article is of interest or not.
pacaro 3y ago
Where does the undercurl come from? TFA credits kitty, which I understand to mean supporting undercurl in a terminal. My first experience of it was with the spell checker in Microsoft word circa 1993, does anyone have an earlier sighting?

Pretty amazing to see someone else using my exact same setup - alacritty, tmux and neovim. Is that like seeing a unicorn?

LorenzoGood 3y ago
It's fairly common for twm users.
dcow 3y ago
Kitty performs better and renders font more beautifully than Alacritty, and Alacritty's devs are openly hostile to macOS users, so I've stuck with Kitty. I really want a native Rust terminal emulator to be good, though.
- pdimitar 3y ago
  > Alacritty's devs are openly hostile to macOS users What do you mean by that? I noticed some bindings randomly stop working even though I'm explicitly configuring them -- ALT and left / right arrow are the most prominent example -- but I'm curious if your observations are rooted in other problems?
  - dcow 3y ago
    It likely broke because the dev won’t touch macOS with a 39.5' pole, so they obviously don’t test changes. I tried offering to help get the macOS build notarized (financially and logistically) so that it would work without disabling gatekeeper and was laughed out of the issue tracker for using a stupid OS. I tried explaining that I don’t always control which OS I use (not that it matters) and that since I use all of them one of the major advantages of a terminal emulator is that it works consistently across platforms. They basically told me that I’m an idiot for using macOS and put me in the middle of their ideological battle with Apple.
    - zenolove 3y ago
      I believe this is the issue mentioned by parent: https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty/issues/4673 https://github.com/alacritty/alacritty/issues/4673
      - dcow 3y ago
        The best part is the maintainer wouldn’t even approve a PR to add one sentence to the readme explaining the expectation that users need to manually add a gatekeeper exception, because helping macOS users onboard “has no value” to the project (to him).
DiabloD3 3y ago
Isn't this the norm? Are we all the same person?
- fernandotakai 3y ago
  i legit thought this was an incredibly popular setup, because i have three coworkers (+ myself) with the exact same config (alacritty + tmux + neovim).
  - triyambakam 3y ago
    I had no idea it was so popular! I'm the only engineer at my company that I'm aware of that uses vim (neovim), let alone alacritty or tmux.
igor47 3y ago
It's my setup also!
lwhsiao 3y ago
This used to be my setup as well! Nowadays I'm running wezterm, tmux, and helix.
oh_sigh 3y ago
It is pretty weird, that is my exact setup too. But instead of alacritty I use iterm2, and instead of tmux I use screen, and instead of neovim I use emacs. But regardless, spooky!
- quaddo 3y ago
  I'm trying to tell from your comment as well as the others' comments whether you're running screen locally, and what benefits that brings above and beyond iTerm for local shell sessions. For anyone else using tmux locally, I'd be interested as well. Genuinely curious. I'd consider doing likewise if the reason is compelling.
  - zokier 3y ago
    I'd guess one factor is that macos has relatively poor native keyboard driven tiling capabilities, so tmux functions as kind of poor mans tiling wm.
  - paulannesley 3y ago
    > what benefits that brings above and beyond iTerm for local shell sessions > For anyone else using tmux locally, I'd be interested as well. I run tmux in iTerm2 on macOS; tmux is my window-manager of choice for terminal applications; shells, nvim, etc. I usually have 2–10 tmux “windows” (more like tabs) with 2–4 split panes in each (more like tiled windows). I generally never detach from my local tmux session. Most things I use and love tmux for could probably be done with iTerm2 tabs and splits, or a modern text editor and its terminal integrations. But, I can use tmux in iTerm2 or Terminal.app or Kitty or Gnome Terminal or urxvt, on macOS or Linux or FreeBSD and it works the same everywhere. Perhaps that's a key feature; decoupling your “terminal window manager” or “terminal desktop environment” from your terminal emulator (I guess that's like the X server in this analogy). Also, tmux feels more keyboard-native… I can do everything from the keyboard, including navigating scrollbacks, finding/selecting/copying/pasting text, etc. Again, you can probably achieve at least 90% of this using a richly-featured terminal emulator like iTerm2, but tmux does it well, and it's portable. Also, tmux feels more Unix… it has config files that can be git-managed, it has man pages, it is scriptable from bash/anything, etc. That easy scriptability leads to some nice integrations, like I can configure key bindings in nvim that run commands (e.g. the test I have open) in a tmux split alongside nvim. Again, that's nothing that things like VS Code can't do too with their built-in terminal emulators etc. But it's nice. (Despite loving tmux and iTerm2, the one thing I don't like is iTerm2's native tmux integration, where it uses tmux as the “engine” but replaces the UI with OS-native windows/splits etc. It's technically impressive, but mostly negates all the reasons I run tmux inside iTerm2 in the first place)

Temporary_31337 3y ago

Since so many people here seem to have a similar setup can anyone recommend a write up on how to set it up and why is it worth the hassle?

throwaway290 3y ago
if you read HN for more than a month you will probably see more than one post discussing them as well as their alternatives, or you can use search to see those posts. If you find that you like each tool for what it offers (and doesn't offer) then you will probably like them in combination. If not then not. Why would you expect someone to know you enough to say it's worth the hassle for you?

nubinetwork 3y ago

Dupe https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36753161 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36753161

jsnell 3y ago
That had no comments and one upvote. It's totally fine to resubmit articles that didn't get significant attention the first time.
- nubinetwork 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - yabbs 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - dang 3y ago
      Please don't post unsubstantive comments to HN. We're trying for something else here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - jsnell 3y ago
    If you continue antagonizing people with your fake dupe claims and have a large proportion of your posts flashed, there's a chance that the entire account gets shadowbanned. And then most people won't see the subset of posts where you have a legit point either. A small number of reposts is not only permitted by the rules of the doors, it is very often explicitly encouraged by the mods. Railing against that is really not productive, especially since those reposts are often some of the very best posts to the site.
dang 3y ago
HN's policy about dupes has been consistent for many years (it goes back to pg, who started the site and ran it for the first 8 years or so), so I hope it's ok if I explain it a bit. On HN, a post only counts as a dupe if the same story has had significant attention in the last year or so. If it hasn't had significant attention yet, or if it has, but more than a year or so ago, then reposts are fine. The reason is that we want to give good stories multiple cracks at the bat, i.e. multiple chances at getting attention. Otherwise it's too random—randomness is a strong factor in what does or doesn't get noticed on the /newest page and we want to even that out over time. Pointing out dupes in HN comments is great, but only if you link to a previous post that has had significant attention in the last year or so. Otherwise HN users will get irritated when they click on a link and are taken to a previous submission that didn't get any activity. I hope that makes sense! By the way, some of the posts you've flagged as dupes were actually invited reposts—we comb through old submissions looking for good articles that didn't get noticed the first (or second, or third) time around, and invite one of the previous submitters to submit it again. Invited reposts go into the second-chance pool (https://news.ycombinator.com/pool https://news.ycombinator.com/pool, explained at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308), so they get a random placement on HN's front page. This is another device we came up with for trying to mitigate the randomness of /newest. We want to maximize the opportunity for the best (for HN) articles to get in front of the community. At that point, readers can make up their own minds if the article is of interest or not.

pacaro 3y ago

Where does the undercurl come from? TFA credits kitty, which I understand to mean supporting undercurl in a terminal. My first experience of it was with the spell checker in Microsoft word circa 1993, does anyone have an earlier sighting?