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It was 4.5L per day though. Enough to stupefy any man or keep them drunk all day. "For sailors the beer supplied was of the strong kind (10%-15% alcohol) since

It was 4.5L per day though. Enough to stupefy any man or keep them drunk all day. "For sailors the beer supplied was of the strong kind (10%-15% alcohol) since this was the only kind that preserved itself well in the sea, hence drunk as a sailor."

crooked-v 3y ago
Though historical sailors in various navies were punished if they were visibly intoxicated while on duty (off-shift was fine, of course), so either they were incredibly functional alcoholics, they were great at pacing themselves, or that booze was heavily watered down.
robga 3y ago
Who drinks 4.5L of anything a day? That’s 18 x 250ml glasses.
- hanche 3y ago
  If you’re doing hard physical labour all day on a hot day, maybe you need about that much? It does match advice I have seen for desert hiking.
- yetihehe 3y ago
  It's much easier to drink beer than water. When you are working physically in hot weather, it's pretty easy to drink 5L and perspirate most of that.
  - gcanyon 3y ago
    One time I bicycled something over 40 miles in the hills outside Las Vegas on a 105-degree day. I: 1. Drank a gallon of liquid (could have been water or sports drink, I don't remember) on that ~3 hour ride. 2. Didn't pee until I got home -- and not much then. 3. Came home with dry clothes, despite (obviously) sweating something like a gallon of liquid. There was no evidence of sweat, ever -- it all evaporated.
    - yetihehe 3y ago
      One time I was helping build a house in summer. I drank 5L of watery low-sugar tea apart from about 1,5L other liquids and peed maybe three times that day. I had dry clothes but very visible traces of salt on them. Other time I drank 7L of beer in a night, but peed like every 20min.
      - gcanyon 3y ago
        When I was a kid my mom stocked Minute Maid frozen orange juice and powdered vitamin c. When I was sick I would stay home (maybe 11 or 12, different times) and watch TV and drink orange juice. I would fall into a pattern of drinking a 10-12 oz glass of juice during a show segment (maybe 7 minutes) and during the commercial break I’d go pee and refill my juice. On the half hour break i’d make another pitcher. So that works out to something like 3 quarts of heavily-vitamin-c-dosed orange juice per hour for at least several hours out of the day. I have no idea how my kidneys kept up with that.
    - brewdad 3y ago
      Ok, but that’s an extreme example and you only consumed 3.8L. 4.5L is a LOT. Even the 8 glasses a day of water suggestion is considered on the high side and that’s only 1.9L.
      - kgwgk 3y ago
        > Even the 8 glasses a day of water suggestion is considered on the high side and that’s only 1.9L. The recommended amount depends on who does the recommendation but 1.9L doesn't seem high. https://www.efsa.europa.eu/fr/efsajournal/pub/1459 https://www.efsa.europa.eu/fr/efsajournal/pub/1459 "Adequate Intakes (AI) have been defined derived from a combination of observed intakes in population groups with desirable osmolarity values of urine and desirable water volumes per energy unit consumed. The reference values for total water intake include water from drinking water, beverages of all kind, and from food moisture and only apply to conditions of moderate environmental temperature and moderate physical activity levels (PAL 1.6). [...] Available data for adults permit the definition of AIs as 2.0 L/day (P 95 3.1 L) for females and 2.5 L/day (P95 4.0 L) for males." https://apps.who.int/iris/handle/10665/43403 https://apps.who.int/iris/handle/10665/43403 "The minimum water requirement for fluid replacement for a 70kg human in a temperate zone equates to 3L per day, or 42.9mL/kg [according to the Tropical Agriculture Association]. Minimum requirements for an individual the same size but in a tropical zone equates to 4.1 to 6L/day" "Age and gender specific Adequate Intakes (AI) for water were established in 2004 by the [United States] Food and Nutrition Board (5). The Dietary Reference Intakes (DRI) for water are [for ages 19 and older] Men 3.7 L/day Women 2.7 L/day"
- gcoakes 3y ago
  I usually do. I have a 2 liter water bottle that I fill up at least twice a day. Though ironically with the heat this summer, I've been exercising and drinking less.
- darkclouds 3y ago
  Anyone trying to keep parts of their immune system down.
- Modified3019 3y ago
  Obviously they need something to wash down their 40 potatoes a day. I also find the amount questionable, as I suspect that our modern expectations of what that means and the details of what they meant when they recorded personal consumption means there's something lost in translation here. Even when I was outside scouting crops 10-12 hours a day on foot in southwest kansas with peak 110F temps, I'd still not need to drink more than 4 liters of water a day. I could push it up another liter, but it wasn't needed and could actually be harmful if one overhydrates. And that's the extreme of the year, way more what I'd reach for most of the year. Whereas the daily motto of the fuckers was apparently "I am a machine that turns beer into piss"
- ChoGGi 3y ago
  It's pretty easy to drink four gallons (+extras) on a hot day roofing.
bsmithers 3y ago
4.5L of 0.5% ABV beer would not make you drunk. For comparison, this is equivalent to less than a pint of a typical mainstream beer. Indeed a 0.5% ABV drink can be branded alcohol free (at least in the UK). Would 4.5L of 2% ABV make you drunk? Depends how quickly you can drink it. It's 9 units of alcohol. We commonly assume the body can process 1 unit/hour so if this quantity was consumed over an entire day, I don't think you'd get merry. I'm not saying it's a good idea to drink like this, just highlighting the impact of ABV on the outcome.
- junofan 3y ago
  It’s 8 pints of 13% ABV if you look at the table in the article. Manageable over the course of a day, but you’re definitely drinking.
  - luc4sdreyer 3y ago
    Which table? The referenced table (9) only says "strong" (relative to what?) and gives a calorie count, which for beer is not very useful as an ABV estimate.
  - SCdF 3y ago
    For sailors, in one estimate, and sailors are a special case as the article mentions, because strong beer is the only thing that doesn't go off at sea. Everyone else is the much lower estimate discussed up thread. > Manageable over the course of a day, but you’re definitely drinking. Maybe I'm a lightweight, I would be absolutely trollied if I had to drink eight 13% pints over the course of a day. I have never been anywhere where they'd even sell you an entire pint of 13%, you are in 2/3rd or maybe even 1/3rd territory.
    - brewdad 3y ago
      I have a favorite speciality beer that comes in around 13%. They used to sell it only in 22oz bottles and that was it for the night. If I decided to open one, I knew that was my one drink for the evening. They recently started selling it in 12oz bottles, so it’s no longer a commitment but rather a choice.
deleted 3y ago
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zhte415 3y ago
The article also mentioned the beer ration could be passed to families. Which had me thinking of various pecuniary benefits armies pass and why. Salt -> salary is well documented, on the opposite side slightly less so but still somewhat known was for conquering armies to compensate farmers for essentially pillage as the monetary compensation can't buy much grain nor meat when the army's eaten the village's as well as that of surrounding villages. It also wasn't unusual for state coffers to run dry also, delaying soldiers' salaries, plus graft - several banks still around were founded on the basis of lending to a liquidity starved crown, a modern placation and guarantee of support in the classical baronesque sense perhaps. And I became curious about all the other money-like tokens, like these beer rations, backed by the promise of a commodity, that floated around in those time, and in ours today. Meandering thoughts, the best kind.
- ffhhttt 3y ago
  > Salt -> salary is well documented Is it? At least for Roman soldiers there is no evidence at all that was the case. It just seems to be a myth originating in 18-19th centuries (like a lot of things in popular history).
  - coldtea 3y ago
    Doesn't make sense either, as you can't do much with salt except use it on food as seasoning or as a preservative, which are both useless as salary since you still need to pay for your actual food and other expenses. It would only make sense if it was given to be used a store of value, but they had perfectly good coins to pay salaries with.
    - NeoTar 3y ago
      > It would only make sense if it was given to be used a store of value, but they had perfectly good coins to pay salaries with. The Roman Empire towards its end in the west had suffered from a lot of inflation, so coinage was either too expensive for everyday use (i.e. gold-coins, each of which would be a year's salary for a soldier), or worthless (basically just lumps of base-metal). I think at a certain point taxes were required to be paid in goods rather than coin which really does show that your currency is worthless (when even the state refuses to accept it!)
ErikCorry 3y ago
I don't think the yeasts they had at the time could get anywhere near 10%, so is he saying the beer was fortified with spirits? I know that Churchill said "The traditions of the Royal Navy are rum, sodomy and the lash" so perhaps it was.
- WangComputers 3y ago
  How could they make wine if they couldn't get close to 10% ?
  - ErikCorry 3y ago
    Wine uses completely different yeasts, and probably wasn't as strong either as it is today.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]

crooked-v 3y ago

Though historical sailors in various navies were punished if they were visibly intoxicated while on duty (off-shift was fine, of course), so either they were incredibly functional alcoholics, they were great at pacing themselves, or that booze was heavily watered down.

robga 3y ago

Who drinks 4.5L of anything a day? That’s 18 x 250ml glasses.

hanche 3y ago
If you’re doing hard physical labour all day on a hot day, maybe you need about that much? It does match advice I have seen for desert hiking.
yetihehe 3y ago
It's much easier to drink beer than water. When you are working physically in hot weather, it's pretty easy to drink 5L and perspirate most of that.
- gcanyon 3y ago
  One time I bicycled something over 40 miles in the hills outside Las Vegas on a 105-degree day. I: 1. Drank a gallon of liquid (could have been water or sports drink, I don't remember) on that ~3 hour ride. 2. Didn't pee until I got home -- and not much then. 3. Came home with dry clothes, despite (obviously) sweating something like a gallon of liquid. There was no evidence of sweat, ever -- it all evaporated.
  - yetihehe 3y ago
    One time I was helping build a house in summer. I drank 5L of watery low-sugar tea apart from about 1,5L other liquids and peed maybe three times that day. I had dry clothes but very visible traces of salt on them. Other time I drank 7L of beer in a night, but peed like every 20min.
    - gcanyon 3y ago
      When I was a kid my mom stocked Minute Maid frozen orange juice and powdered vitamin c. When I was sick I would stay home (maybe 11 or 12, different times) and watch TV and drink orange juice. I would fall into a pattern of drinking a 10-12 oz glass of juice during a show segment (maybe 7 minutes) and during the commercial break I’d go pee and refill my juice. On the half hour break i’d make another pitcher. So that works out to something like 3 quarts of heavily-vitamin-c-dosed orange juice per hour for at least several hours out of the day. I have no idea how my kidneys kept up with that.
  - brewdad 3y ago
    Ok, but that’s an extreme example and you only consumed 3.8L. 4.5L is a LOT. Even the 8 glasses a day of water suggestion is considered on the high side and that’s only 1.9L.
    - kgwgk 3y ago
      > Even the 8 glasses a day of water suggestion is considered on the high side and that’s only 1.9L. The recommended amount depends on who does the recommendation but 1.9L doesn't seem high. https://www.efsa.europa.eu/fr/efsajournal/pub/1459 https://www.efsa.europa.eu/fr/efsajournal/pub/1459 "Adequate Intakes (AI) have been defined derived from a combination of observed intakes in population groups with desirable osmolarity values of urine and desirable water volumes per energy unit consumed. The reference values for total water intake include water from drinking water, beverages of all kind, and from food moisture and only apply to conditions of moderate environmental temperature and moderate physical activity levels (PAL 1.6). [...] Available data for adults permit the definition of AIs as 2.0 L/day (P 95 3.1 L) for females and 2.5 L/day (P95 4.0 L) for males." https://apps.who.int/iris/handle/10665/43403 https://apps.who.int/iris/handle/10665/43403 "The minimum water requirement for fluid replacement for a 70kg human in a temperate zone equates to 3L per day, or 42.9mL/kg [according to the Tropical Agriculture Association]. Minimum requirements for an individual the same size but in a tropical zone equates to 4.1 to 6L/day" "Age and gender specific Adequate Intakes (AI) for water were established in 2004 by the [United States] Food and Nutrition Board (5). The Dietary Reference Intakes (DRI) for water are [for ages 19 and older] Men 3.7 L/day Women 2.7 L/day"
gcoakes 3y ago
I usually do. I have a 2 liter water bottle that I fill up at least twice a day. Though ironically with the heat this summer, I've been exercising and drinking less.
darkclouds 3y ago
Anyone trying to keep parts of their immune system down.
Modified3019 3y ago
Obviously they need something to wash down their 40 potatoes a day. I also find the amount questionable, as I suspect that our modern expectations of what that means and the details of what they meant when they recorded personal consumption means there's something lost in translation here. Even when I was outside scouting crops 10-12 hours a day on foot in southwest kansas with peak 110F temps, I'd still not need to drink more than 4 liters of water a day. I could push it up another liter, but it wasn't needed and could actually be harmful if one overhydrates. And that's the extreme of the year, way more what I'd reach for most of the year. Whereas the daily motto of the fuckers was apparently "I am a machine that turns beer into piss"
ChoGGi 3y ago
It's pretty easy to drink four gallons (+extras) on a hot day roofing.

bsmithers 3y ago

4.5L of 0.5% ABV beer would not make you drunk. For comparison, this is equivalent to less than a pint of a typical mainstream beer. Indeed a 0.5% ABV drink can be branded alcohol free (at least in the UK). Would 4.5L of 2% ABV make you drunk? Depends how quickly you can drink it. It's 9 units of alcohol. We commonly assume the body can process 1 unit/hour so if this quantity was consumed over an entire day, I don't think you'd get merry. I'm not saying it's a good idea to drink like this, just highlighting the impact of ABV on the outcome.

junofan 3y ago
It’s 8 pints of 13% ABV if you look at the table in the article. Manageable over the course of a day, but you’re definitely drinking.
- luc4sdreyer 3y ago
  Which table? The referenced table (9) only says "strong" (relative to what?) and gives a calorie count, which for beer is not very useful as an ABV estimate.
- SCdF 3y ago
  For sailors, in one estimate, and sailors are a special case as the article mentions, because strong beer is the only thing that doesn't go off at sea. Everyone else is the much lower estimate discussed up thread. > Manageable over the course of a day, but you’re definitely drinking. Maybe I'm a lightweight, I would be absolutely trollied if I had to drink eight 13% pints over the course of a day. I have never been anywhere where they'd even sell you an entire pint of 13%, you are in 2/3rd or maybe even 1/3rd territory.
  - brewdad 3y ago
    I have a favorite speciality beer that comes in around 13%. They used to sell it only in 22oz bottles and that was it for the night. If I decided to open one, I knew that was my one drink for the evening. They recently started selling it in 12oz bottles, so it’s no longer a commitment but rather a choice.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

zhte415 3y ago

The article also mentioned the beer ration could be passed to families. Which had me thinking of various pecuniary benefits armies pass and why. Salt -> salary is well documented, on the opposite side slightly less so but still somewhat known was for conquering armies to compensate farmers for essentially pillage as the monetary compensation can't buy much grain nor meat when the army's eaten the village's as well as that of surrounding villages. It also wasn't unusual for state coffers to run dry also, delaying soldiers' salaries, plus graft - several banks still around were founded on the basis of lending to a liquidity starved crown, a modern placation and guarantee of support in the classical baronesque sense perhaps. And I became curious about all the other money-like tokens, like these beer rations, backed by the promise of a commodity, that floated around in those time, and in ours today. Meandering thoughts, the best kind.

ffhhttt 3y ago
> Salt -> salary is well documented Is it? At least for Roman soldiers there is no evidence at all that was the case. It just seems to be a myth originating in 18-19th centuries (like a lot of things in popular history).
- coldtea 3y ago
  Doesn't make sense either, as you can't do much with salt except use it on food as seasoning or as a preservative, which are both useless as salary since you still need to pay for your actual food and other expenses. It would only make sense if it was given to be used a store of value, but they had perfectly good coins to pay salaries with.
  - NeoTar 3y ago
    > It would only make sense if it was given to be used a store of value, but they had perfectly good coins to pay salaries with. The Roman Empire towards its end in the west had suffered from a lot of inflation, so coinage was either too expensive for everyday use (i.e. gold-coins, each of which would be a year's salary for a soldier), or worthless (basically just lumps of base-metal). I think at a certain point taxes were required to be paid in goods rather than coin which really does show that your currency is worthless (when even the state refuses to accept it!)

ErikCorry 3y ago

I don't think the yeasts they had at the time could get anywhere near 10%, so is he saying the beer was fortified with spirits? I know that Churchill said "The traditions of the Royal Navy are rum, sodomy and the lash" so perhaps it was.

WangComputers 3y ago
How could they make wine if they couldn't get close to 10% ?
- ErikCorry 3y ago
  Wine uses completely different yeasts, and probably wasn't as strong either as it is today.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]