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> They come with much of the same concerns you raised about pickup trucks I disagree strongly with that. these are very different vehicles. Crossovers are reg
by dangus 3y ago
> They come with much of the same concerns you raised about pickup trucks
I disagree strongly with that. these are very different vehicles.
Crossovers are regulated like cars, built like cars, and anre often are roughly the same size as equivalent cars. They’re just lifted slightly off the ground (in some cases barely) and given a hatchback.
As an example, compare dimensions of a Toyota Camry to a Toyota RAV4. Most of the exterior dimensions are almost identical. The RAV4 is notably a little bit longer outside of the wheelbase and only about 200 pounds heavier.
- giobox 3y agoI think the distinction people are grasping at here are monocoque constructed vehicles (the vast majority of cars/crossovers/SUVs on sale today) and ladder-frame/body on frame construction - most trucks and some really big SUVs/offroaders. It's the body on frame vehicles that end up being heavy and compromised much of the time - its a way of manufacturing a vehicle that stretches back practically to the stone age. I also agree crossovers do not deserve to be compared to body-on-frame construction. In interests of not upsetting anyone - I also agree there are some limited usecases body on frame is better! But for most private passenger transport, a monocoque construction will have advantages - size, weight, fuel economy (function of weight reduction), driving dynamics, pedestrian safety etc. Body on frame can also make it easier for a commercial vehicle to offer bed customization options, given the car structurally is just a pair of rails on wheels that can be extended or shortened as application demands. A monocoque generally can't change its length as easily. There are new pickups flirting with monocoque construction - the Honda Ridgeline, Ford Maverick, Hyundai Santa Cruz, famously the Tesla Cybertruck...
- linuxftw 3y agoTrucks need to haul and tow. You need a real steel frame to do that.
- giobox 3y agoThe cybertruck will manage 14,000lbs on a monocoque. Just because traditionally this hasn't been the case doesn't mean you can't make a monocoque that can tow. The truck industry has had little incentive to innovate here until very recently as for 40 years vintage body-on-frame architectures have sold and sold. As I said - I'm not disagreeing that body on frame does have some legitimate use cases today - it's just that with modern construction techniques it's much more rarely going to be private transport.
- linuxftw 3y agoI think if someone tries to tow 14k lbs with a cybertruck, it's going to be ripped in half.
- giobox 3y agoIt's literally rated for 14,000 lbs, so no, it won't.
- linuxftw 3y agoRated by who? Because I don't believe Tesla's claim because it seems absolutely outlandish. They would have been building F150's like this decades ago if it were true.
- giobox 3y agoHas a car manufacturer ever lied about rated tow weights in recent memory? I genuinely don't see the incentive - it would just lead to crashes, warranty claims and eventually a class action lawsuit, or worse if deaths resulted. People rely on these numbers to drive safely. 14,000 lbs is absolutely within realms of normal/possible for a nearly 20 foot long 6000lb truck - its more or less exactly the same as high-spec Ford trucks. It's almost a given one of the first things youtube is going do with a production Cybertruck is find something that weighs almost exactly 14000 lbs and try to tow it up and down the steepest inclines they can find.
- hcurtiss 3y agoI ran into one problem with monocoque/unibody construction. I ran my wife's Honda Pilot into another vehicle on icy roads. Around 5 mpg, direct T-Bone. We drove home about 75 miles just fine. No leaking fluids. About 35,000 miles total on the car. Just smashed in the front right a little. Insurance totaled it and gave me $18,500. Body shop told me monocoque/unibody construction is very difficult and expensive to repair. Evidently, for anything more than plastic fender-benders, they're very frequently "totaled" instead of repaired.
- dangus 3y agoI think this is a very minor downside of this style of construction. Another aspect is that repairability of the frame isn’t as important as preventing injury to the occupants. You know what’s more expensive than a totaled $18,500 vehicle? Hospital bills.
- hcurtiss 3y agoI am not convinced in that circumstance I would have been worse off in an F-150 or any other modern body on frame construction.