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Dismissing possible negative effects of psychedelics with a comparison to caffeine and nicotine feels off. Psychedelics are much more intense than either - on a

Dismissing possible negative effects of psychedelics with a comparison to caffeine and nicotine feels off. Psychedelics are much more intense than either - on a different scale, to the point they are emotionally draining. Otherwise, I can dig it. There are a variety of factors.

galangalalgol 3y ago
Operating vehicles on psychedelics seems like a far worse idea than the other two as well. But comparing them to alcohol would probably have alcohol coming up far more dangerous in every category.
cm2012 3y ago
I don't want to try it because of risk to my mental health. The 40+ year old psychedelic enthusiasts I know are just not all there. Plus it can trigger schizophrenia, etc.
- local_issues 3y ago
  Same - and this isn't discussed enough in Tech circles. I know a girl who's done acid 100 times, and she's pretty "off." Kind of like a record left in the sun for a bit. She's not dumb or anything, just a little sideways. Not in a good way either - in a "can't hold a job or relationship together" way.
  - lillecarl 3y ago
    People with ADHD are VERY overrepresented in substance use, and "Can't hold a job or relationship together" is an ADHD trait as well, maybe like me she enjoys being a bit whacked in the head by something to deal with the incredibly boring, mundane, slow-moving, uncreative reality most of us live in. Or acid fried her brain, but I'm sceptical.
    - Slava_Propanei 3y ago
      [dead]
  - racked 3y ago
    Did you know her before she did acid, and if so, what exactly changed about her?
- bnjms 3y ago
  I think about what drug caused the burned out hippie vibe and between weed and psychedelics I think it’s the psychedelics. I think that because any drug that helps one draw new connections eventually starts drawing potential connections that aren’t there resulting in needing excess consideration. I’m pro psychedelic legalization and think they should be available behind the counter. I just also think they should be feared and thought of as medicine.
brotchie 3y ago
After 1st psychedelic experience “damn, everyone should try this”. After further experience, no longer a huge proponent. A new user has to make a mental commitment that they will be changed and they themselves take responsibility for that and own the positives and negatives and can’t externalize that blame, otherwise they’re going to have a bad reality going forwards. My first experience was late 30s, I don’t know what it would have been like having that experience 17 or 18. I don’t know if I’d want my kids to have that experience at such a young age. Psychedelics are profoundly strange. My before-the-experience expectations about what it would be like (having read an absolute shitload of literature and trip reports) and what it’s actually like were orthogonal. A bad trip does equip you with a lot of confidence and resilience in yourself and your mental strength to almost get through anything. Once you’ve been through that (like seriously believing your reality is broken) a lot of other things in life seem easier.
- aliasxneo 3y ago
  > A bad trip does equip you with a lot of confidence and resilience in yourself and your mental strength to almost get through anything Just out of curiosity, do you mean the person's self-confidence may dramatically improve with use? The only reason is because I had a recent co-worker who was laid off after taking psychedelics for a decent period of time. He effectively stopped contributing to the team and started making concerted efforts to get the CEO to establish a new, special position for him so that "real work" could get done and the "company would function 100x better." Seeing the before and after was fairly dramatic. I tried to encourage them to stop using, but that "self-confidence" was so over the top that they ignored all of us and eventually lost their job.
  - uristohkrat 3y ago
    Anecdotally, I found using psychedelics regularly kind of left me estranged from sober reality. Better to do it semi annually at most, imo. If you need them more frequently then that you are probably missing the point.
  - rjbwork 3y ago
    That seems like dude was consistently disconnected from reality due to being constantly high on drugs. I think GP was referring to the long-term mental resilience and mindset shifts that can be byproducts of trips, not the effects of being under the influence.
philipov 3y ago
I would hesitate to downplay the long-term effects of heavy caffeine use.
- overrun11 3y ago
  What are they?
  - lillecarl 3y ago
    Dependency is the only one I've heard about within reasonable consumption. Think "ooof my headache I need a coffee" people.
  - philipov 3y ago
    "nervousness; insomnia; dehydration; stomach irritation; fatigue." It's not just headaches. Fatigue in particular can be severe. If I don't drink coffee, I can barely stay awake at all.
djtango 3y ago
Someone I knew developed psychosis and eventually committed suicide. I'm not close enough to know the full diagnosis but my understanding was that they the psychosis was brought on by drug abuse, possibly "2cb" but who knows what you're really consuming in random pills... A friend once pointed out that much discussion around drugs is completely polarised. Either drugs are evil and we must root it from the face of this earth or cannabis and psilocybin are wonder cures that fix everything from back pain and anxiety to IBS and writers block.

galangalalgol 3y ago

Operating vehicles on psychedelics seems like a far worse idea than the other two as well. But comparing them to alcohol would probably have alcohol coming up far more dangerous in every category.

cm2012 3y ago

I don't want to try it because of risk to my mental health. The 40+ year old psychedelic enthusiasts I know are just not all there. Plus it can trigger schizophrenia, etc.

local_issues 3y ago
Same - and this isn't discussed enough in Tech circles. I know a girl who's done acid 100 times, and she's pretty "off." Kind of like a record left in the sun for a bit. She's not dumb or anything, just a little sideways. Not in a good way either - in a "can't hold a job or relationship together" way.
- lillecarl 3y ago
  People with ADHD are VERY overrepresented in substance use, and "Can't hold a job or relationship together" is an ADHD trait as well, maybe like me she enjoys being a bit whacked in the head by something to deal with the incredibly boring, mundane, slow-moving, uncreative reality most of us live in. Or acid fried her brain, but I'm sceptical.
  - Slava_Propanei 3y ago
    [dead]
- racked 3y ago
  Did you know her before she did acid, and if so, what exactly changed about her?
bnjms 3y ago
I think about what drug caused the burned out hippie vibe and between weed and psychedelics I think it’s the psychedelics. I think that because any drug that helps one draw new connections eventually starts drawing potential connections that aren’t there resulting in needing excess consideration. I’m pro psychedelic legalization and think they should be available behind the counter. I just also think they should be feared and thought of as medicine.

brotchie 3y ago

After 1st psychedelic experience “damn, everyone should try this”. After further experience, no longer a huge proponent. A new user has to make a mental commitment that they will be changed and they themselves take responsibility for that and own the positives and negatives and can’t externalize that blame, otherwise they’re going to have a bad reality going forwards. My first experience was late 30s, I don’t know what it would have been like having that experience 17 or 18. I don’t know if I’d want my kids to have that experience at such a young age. Psychedelics are profoundly strange. My before-the-experience expectations about what it would be like (having read an absolute shitload of literature and trip reports) and what it’s actually like were orthogonal. A bad trip does equip you with a lot of confidence and resilience in yourself and your mental strength to almost get through anything. Once you’ve been through that (like seriously believing your reality is broken) a lot of other things in life seem easier.

aliasxneo 3y ago
> A bad trip does equip you with a lot of confidence and resilience in yourself and your mental strength to almost get through anything Just out of curiosity, do you mean the person's self-confidence may dramatically improve with use? The only reason is because I had a recent co-worker who was laid off after taking psychedelics for a decent period of time. He effectively stopped contributing to the team and started making concerted efforts to get the CEO to establish a new, special position for him so that "real work" could get done and the "company would function 100x better." Seeing the before and after was fairly dramatic. I tried to encourage them to stop using, but that "self-confidence" was so over the top that they ignored all of us and eventually lost their job.
- uristohkrat 3y ago
  Anecdotally, I found using psychedelics regularly kind of left me estranged from sober reality. Better to do it semi annually at most, imo. If you need them more frequently then that you are probably missing the point.
- rjbwork 3y ago
  That seems like dude was consistently disconnected from reality due to being constantly high on drugs. I think GP was referring to the long-term mental resilience and mindset shifts that can be byproducts of trips, not the effects of being under the influence.

philipov 3y ago

I would hesitate to downplay the long-term effects of heavy caffeine use.

overrun11 3y ago
What are they?
- lillecarl 3y ago
  Dependency is the only one I've heard about within reasonable consumption. Think "ooof my headache I need a coffee" people.
- philipov 3y ago
  "nervousness; insomnia; dehydration; stomach irritation; fatigue." It's not just headaches. Fatigue in particular can be severe. If I don't drink coffee, I can barely stay awake at all.

djtango 3y ago

Someone I knew developed psychosis and eventually committed suicide. I'm not close enough to know the full diagnosis but my understanding was that they the psychosis was brought on by drug abuse, possibly "2cb" but who knows what you're really consuming in random pills... A friend once pointed out that much discussion around drugs is completely polarised. Either drugs are evil and we must root it from the face of this earth or cannabis and psilocybin are wonder cures that fix everything from back pain and anxiety to IBS and writers block.