4 ms·

Meanwhile as a "people" I have to sit here and watch MS, Google, Tesla and god knows who else buy and run as many GPUs as possible and run them at maximum capac

Meanwhile as a "people" I have to sit here and watch MS, Google, Tesla and god knows who else buy and run as many GPUs as possible and run them at maximum capacity while I'm being told to sit back and stop eating meat, not use my A/C and all the rest of it. As a people I have to watch the Amazon being chopped down and burned and coal usage being at an all time high, while methane is spewed out by leaking coal seam plants and some how it's something I'm doing wrong? Imagine how people in Africa feel about all this...we worry about AI wiping out humanity but we're doing a pretty good job ourselves....

Ekaros 3y ago
I often wonder could we do things more efficiently. At least from power point of view. In computing and telecom. Do we actually need to move megabytes of javascript or massive pictures each time we refresh a web page? Say what you will about saving developer time, but should we maybe think about these resources too?
- tomjen3 3y ago
  I don't think that matters too much if just one physical meeting gets replaced with a phonecall or a video call we are miles and miles ahead on the CO2 budget.
  - nologic01 3y ago
    In this sense this is a major silver line from the pandemic that may have significant impact on the sustainability challenge. We cannot unsee that a lot of work can be accomplished without pushing around the planet our clumsy bodies in massive exoskeletons.
myshpa 3y ago
> while I'm being told to ... stop eating meat > I have to watch the Amazon being chopped down https://ourworldindata.org/drivers-of-deforestation https://ourworldindata.org/drivers-of-deforestation The research suggests that by far the largest driver of deforestation in the Brazilian Amazon has been driven by the expansion of pasture land for beef production, soy is likely to have played at least some role in the loss of forest. More than three-quarters (77%) of global soy is fed to livestock for meat and dairy production. Just 7% of soy is used directly for human food products such as tofu, soy milk, edamame beans, and tempeh. https://www.discovermagazine.com/environment/weve-lost-35-percent-of-forests-in-the-past-300-years https://www.discovermagazine.com/environment/weve-lost-35-pe... The Southern Brazilian Amazon has lost 30 percent of its forests, and if the destruction doesn’t stop, the area will lose 56 percent of its forests by 2050. Environmental scientists argue the loss of the Amazon will have a global impact ... https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/feb/19/colombia-cattle-ranching-coca-amazon-deforestation https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/feb/19/colombia... Cattle, not coca, drive deforestation of the Amazon in Colombia – report https://phys.org/news/2022-08-global-forest-area-capita-decreased.html https://phys.org/news/2022-08-global-forest-area-capita-decr... New study finds global forest area per capita has decreased by over 60% https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/02/the-multinational-companies-that-industrialised-the-amazon-rainforest https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/02/t... The multinational companies that industrialised the Amazon rainforest Ranching is the biggest driver of deforestation and greenhouse gas emissions after land grabbing, with which it is often closely associated. By 2018, the Brazilian Amazon had lost 741,759 sq km (about 286,000 sq miles) of its original forest cover, mainly due to agricultural expansion. This accelerated during the presidency of Jair Bolsonaro, when forest clearance increased by 59.5%, the fastest rate since at least 1988. More than 2bn trees were cut or burned. The soya sector is another powerhouse in the region. Between 2014 and 2020, five multinational food companies – Bunge, Cargill, ADM, Amaggi and Louis Dreyfus – extracted soya worth $18bn on global markets ... https://earth.org/major-companies-responsible-for-deforestation/ https://earth.org/major-companies-responsible-for-deforestat... 13 Major Companies Responsible for Deforestation 1. Cargill (soy & beef) 3. Wilmar International Ltd. (soy) 4. Walmart (palm oil, pulp and paper, soy, and beef) 5. JBS (beef) 6. IKEA 9. Starbucks 10. McDonald’s 11. Yum! Brands (KFC, Pizza Hut and Taco Bell) 13. Ahold (meat) https://news.mongabay.com/2023/05/3-million-hectares-of-colombian-amazon-deforested-for-illegal-pasture-study/ https://news.mongabay.com/2023/05/3-million-hectares-of-colo... 3 million hectares of Colombian Amazon deforested for illegal pasture: Study https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/02/more-than-800m-amazon-trees-felled-in-six-years-to-meet-beef-demand https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/02/more-tha... More than 800m Amazon trees felled in six years to meet beef demand https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26231772/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26231772/ Biodiversity conservation: The key is reducing meat consumption https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/11/15/4110/htm https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/11/15/4110/htm Which Diet Has the Least Environmental Impact on Our Planet? A Systematic Review of Vegan, Vegetarian and Omnivorous Diets https://ourworldindata.org/carbon-opportunity-costs-food https://ourworldindata.org/carbon-opportunity-costs-food What are the carbon opportunity costs of our food? https://www.wri.org/insights/without-changing-diets-agriculture-alone-could-produce-enough-emissions-surpass-15degc https://www.wri.org/insights/without-changing-diets-agricult... Without Changing Diets, Agriculture Alone Could Produce Enough Emissions to Surpass 1.5°C of Global Warming ... and many more ... > some how it's something I'm doing wrong? You have to answer that.
- ChatGTP 3y ago
  Yes I eat chicken and vegetarian meals 95% of the time. I'm building furniture myself and not using Ikea. I never go to Starbucks and I've had McDonalds probably 5 times in ten years. This reinforces my point, millions of other people go to McDonalds each day because it's cheap food, I can't judge them for it. So me never eating McDonalds and building my own furniture from recycled timber means hardly anything and the rain forest is still fucked. The US Government should do more about it. Not me.
  - myshpa 3y ago
    > Yes I eat chicken, and vegetarian meals 95% of the time Soy it is then ;) https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fsufs.2019.00036/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fsufs.2019.0003... Soybean is one of the primary ingredients in poultry diets ... 77% of soy is for animal feed (source higher in the thread) > So me never eating it means hardly anything and the rain forest is still fucked. ... Not me. > The US Government should do more about it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance Be well.
    - ChatGTP 3y ago
      Chicken flesh, is food, whether you like it or not. So is Tofu, and this also comes for Brazil and other countries which have chopped down many of their forests, such as the USA. I'll assume you're a vegetarian, and you're probably eating legumes and the legumes you're eating are exported from a country where people cannot afford them. This was an issue I had with being vegetarian, one, I was hungry and tired a lot of the time and I needed a lot more time to prepare meals to feel better. Second, most legumes I had access too where taken from India, Mexico and South Amerca, thus people in those countries were going without. I'll continue to eat food...and if I can't get access to it readily, I'll take it by other means. So I get it, you're being smug, but you're dismissing the fact that people need to eat food. This should have priority over burning fossil fuels for energy. You've not refuted shit with your graphs. McDonalds isn't going to shut down for you. They' just drop their prices to lure people back. Be well.

Ekaros 3y ago

I often wonder could we do things more efficiently. At least from power point of view. In computing and telecom. Do we actually need to move megabytes of javascript or massive pictures each time we refresh a web page? Say what you will about saving developer time, but should we maybe think about these resources too?

tomjen3 3y ago
I don't think that matters too much if just one physical meeting gets replaced with a phonecall or a video call we are miles and miles ahead on the CO2 budget.
- nologic01 3y ago
  In this sense this is a major silver line from the pandemic that may have significant impact on the sustainability challenge. We cannot unsee that a lot of work can be accomplished without pushing around the planet our clumsy bodies in massive exoskeletons.

myshpa 3y ago

> while I'm being told to ... stop eating meat > I have to watch the Amazon being chopped down https://ourworldindata.org/drivers-of-deforestation https://ourworldindata.org/drivers-of-deforestation The research suggests that by far the largest driver of deforestation in the Brazilian Amazon has been driven by the expansion of pasture land for beef production, soy is likely to have played at least some role in the loss of forest. More than three-quarters (77%) of global soy is fed to livestock for meat and dairy production. Just 7% of soy is used directly for human food products such as tofu, soy milk, edamame beans, and tempeh. https://www.discovermagazine.com/environment/weve-lost-35-percent-of-forests-in-the-past-300-years https://www.discovermagazine.com/environment/weve-lost-35-pe... The Southern Brazilian Amazon has lost 30 percent of its forests, and if the destruction doesn’t stop, the area will lose 56 percent of its forests by 2050. Environmental scientists argue the loss of the Amazon will have a global impact ... https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/feb/19/colombia-cattle-ranching-coca-amazon-deforestation https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/feb/19/colombia... Cattle, not coca, drive deforestation of the Amazon in Colombia – report https://phys.org/news/2022-08-global-forest-area-capita-decreased.html https://phys.org/news/2022-08-global-forest-area-capita-decr... New study finds global forest area per capita has decreased by over 60% https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/02/the-multinational-companies-that-industrialised-the-amazon-rainforest https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/jun/02/t... The multinational companies that industrialised the Amazon rainforest Ranching is the biggest driver of deforestation and greenhouse gas emissions after land grabbing, with which it is often closely associated. By 2018, the Brazilian Amazon had lost 741,759 sq km (about 286,000 sq miles) of its original forest cover, mainly due to agricultural expansion. This accelerated during the presidency of Jair Bolsonaro, when forest clearance increased by 59.5%, the fastest rate since at least 1988. More than 2bn trees were cut or burned. The soya sector is another powerhouse in the region. Between 2014 and 2020, five multinational food companies – Bunge, Cargill, ADM, Amaggi and Louis Dreyfus – extracted soya worth $18bn on global markets ... https://earth.org/major-companies-responsible-for-deforestation/ https://earth.org/major-companies-responsible-for-deforestat... 13 Major Companies Responsible for Deforestation 1. Cargill (soy & beef) 3. Wilmar International Ltd. (soy) 4. Walmart (palm oil, pulp and paper, soy, and beef) 5. JBS (beef) 6. IKEA 9. Starbucks 10. McDonald’s 11. Yum! Brands (KFC, Pizza Hut and Taco Bell) 13. Ahold (meat) https://news.mongabay.com/2023/05/3-million-hectares-of-colombian-amazon-deforested-for-illegal-pasture-study/ https://news.mongabay.com/2023/05/3-million-hectares-of-colo... 3 million hectares of Colombian Amazon deforested for illegal pasture: Study https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/02/more-than-800m-amazon-trees-felled-in-six-years-to-meet-beef-demand https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/jun/02/more-tha... More than 800m Amazon trees felled in six years to meet beef demand https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26231772/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26231772/ Biodiversity conservation: The key is reducing meat consumption https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/11/15/4110/htm https://www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/11/15/4110/htm Which Diet Has the Least Environmental Impact on Our Planet? A Systematic Review of Vegan, Vegetarian and Omnivorous Diets https://ourworldindata.org/carbon-opportunity-costs-food https://ourworldindata.org/carbon-opportunity-costs-food What are the carbon opportunity costs of our food? https://www.wri.org/insights/without-changing-diets-agriculture-alone-could-produce-enough-emissions-surpass-15degc https://www.wri.org/insights/without-changing-diets-agricult... Without Changing Diets, Agriculture Alone Could Produce Enough Emissions to Surpass 1.5°C of Global Warming ... and many more ... > some how it's something I'm doing wrong? You have to answer that.

ChatGTP 3y ago
Yes I eat chicken and vegetarian meals 95% of the time. I'm building furniture myself and not using Ikea. I never go to Starbucks and I've had McDonalds probably 5 times in ten years. This reinforces my point, millions of other people go to McDonalds each day because it's cheap food, I can't judge them for it. So me never eating McDonalds and building my own furniture from recycled timber means hardly anything and the rain forest is still fucked. The US Government should do more about it. Not me.
- myshpa 3y ago
  > Yes I eat chicken, and vegetarian meals 95% of the time Soy it is then ;) https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fsufs.2019.00036/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fsufs.2019.0003... Soybean is one of the primary ingredients in poultry diets ... 77% of soy is for animal feed (source higher in the thread) > So me never eating it means hardly anything and the rain forest is still fucked. ... Not me. > The US Government should do more about it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance Be well.
  - ChatGTP 3y ago
    Chicken flesh, is food, whether you like it or not. So is Tofu, and this also comes for Brazil and other countries which have chopped down many of their forests, such as the USA. I'll assume you're a vegetarian, and you're probably eating legumes and the legumes you're eating are exported from a country where people cannot afford them. This was an issue I had with being vegetarian, one, I was hungry and tired a lot of the time and I needed a lot more time to prepare meals to feel better. Second, most legumes I had access too where taken from India, Mexico and South Amerca, thus people in those countries were going without. I'll continue to eat food...and if I can't get access to it readily, I'll take it by other means. So I get it, you're being smug, but you're dismissing the fact that people need to eat food. This should have priority over burning fossil fuels for energy. You've not refuted shit with your graphs. McDonalds isn't going to shut down for you. They' just drop their prices to lure people back. Be well.