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You think he wasted his co-investors (including Saudis themselves) about $20 billion and took on a $13 billion dollar loan himself, and was forced to sell billi

You think he wasted his co-investors (including Saudis themselves) about $20 billion and took on a $13 billion dollar loan himself, and was forced to sell billions in Tesla stock, to get a "payout". Like how large a "payout" that has to be for any of this to make a lick of sense? There's no payout. There's no conspiracy. Just a man and his arrogance and mental issues.

propogandist 3y ago
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KingMob 3y ago
I agree with you, but fwiw, the conspiracy is that the Saudis want to avoid a repeat of the Arab Spring that was heavily fueled by Twitter, so in that sense, $20 bil would be the price tag to destroy Twitter, not an investment that needs to be recouped.
- 3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago
  Surely they wouldn't pay $20 billion to a guy who purportedly is buying Twitter because he's a "free speech absolutist" and is "defending the future of democracy of the world". Even if it's just PR (and it is just PR, evidently), it's an additional burden to have your PR and your actions be consistently at 180 degrees. Also, $20 billion aren't the "price tag". That money didn't go to Elon. They went to Twitter's shareholders. Elon only ended up with losses and loans, so far, to the tune of another 20-30 billion at the very least. So where's the "payout"? If you "hired" Elon to do this for you, as a Saudi, and you spend $20 billion as a co-investor, and need to cover Elon's $20-30 billion loss, "the price tag" is now up to $50 billion, but we're still only at break even in the short term, and only when we don't consider opportunity cost of Tesla stock dropping last year and future losses to Elon's company brands and so on, because he's coming off as a lunatic and wasting his time on Twitter, instead of being at Tesla and SpaceX. So what's the price tag now? $80 billion? $100 billion? $150 billion? Reminder, the entire Saudi family, all of them, together, have about $1.4 trillion, and that's not cash in the bank, but assets, oil, real estate, all of it. Which means any such "price tag" would imply them giving up all their liquid assets and maybe liquidating more assets, in order to afford this "price tag" so quickly. It's just nonsense.
  - mosselman 3y ago
    Thanks for this delightful breakdown of how dumb this theory is. By now I am very much aware that there are lots of people who believe conspiracy theories, yet I am still surprised when those people are from the tech scene. A developer who believes in the dumbest conspiracies is such an odd thing to me. It is so odd to me that someone who supposedly things about problems in a systematic way and has to break them down into their parts, can fall for something as dumb as the richest man in the world taking some sort of payoff to kill twitter. I should know better by now, but it still takes me by surprise sometimes
    - 3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago
      I don't want to insult anyone, and I see your logic about systematic thought. But being a programmer doesn't mean you're good at it. Shrug.
    - code_duck 3y ago
      Elon seems strangely desperate for money sometimes though. Despite his vast stock holdings, he feels compelled to play games with announcements that manipulate stock prices, and try pump-and-dump schemes on minor crypto.
    - mikrotikker 3y ago
      Come on, conspiracy theories are fun. It's fun to engage in thought experiments about what could be going on behind the scenes and even more fun to throw them out there to see what other people think. The original guy didn't even say he 100% believed it as fact. It's just a thought experiment
    - LexiMax 3y ago
      The conspiracy theory does not exist in a vacuum. People simply don’t want to admit to themselves that they were wrong for idolizing him, or they have a distaste for the kinds of people who attack him, so they choose to believe in the 5D chess game as a way of saving face or refusing to give ground.
  - hnbad 3y ago
- jimbob45 3y ago
  There's no way this is true but this is going to live on forever in my headcanon. I fucking love it when /pol/ gets this creative.
- spacebanana7 3y ago
  I don’t think they intend to destroy Twitter, but rather influence content and moderation policies towards more favourable outcome. Twitter is extremely popular in Saudi, more so than the US/Europe, so some level of influence is extremely valuable.
  - cjrp 3y ago
    The equivalent of sportswashing.
- whywhywhywhy 3y ago
  >would be the price tag to destroy Twitter, How would destroying it prevent that again, people would just go elsewhere. You’d prevent it by Twitter thriving then clever use of algorithm suppression and shadow bans. Conspiracy doesn’t add up.
simonklitj 3y ago
I don’t ascribe to the theory, it was in jest. However, he’s just so unfathomably bad at managing Twitter that I almost can’t imagine any other reason.

propogandist 3y ago

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KingMob 3y ago

I agree with you, but fwiw, the conspiracy is that the Saudis want to avoid a repeat of the Arab Spring that was heavily fueled by Twitter, so in that sense, $20 bil would be the price tag to destroy Twitter, not an investment that needs to be recouped.

3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago
Surely they wouldn't pay $20 billion to a guy who purportedly is buying Twitter because he's a "free speech absolutist" and is "defending the future of democracy of the world". Even if it's just PR (and it is just PR, evidently), it's an additional burden to have your PR and your actions be consistently at 180 degrees. Also, $20 billion aren't the "price tag". That money didn't go to Elon. They went to Twitter's shareholders. Elon only ended up with losses and loans, so far, to the tune of another 20-30 billion at the very least. So where's the "payout"? If you "hired" Elon to do this for you, as a Saudi, and you spend $20 billion as a co-investor, and need to cover Elon's $20-30 billion loss, "the price tag" is now up to $50 billion, but we're still only at break even in the short term, and only when we don't consider opportunity cost of Tesla stock dropping last year and future losses to Elon's company brands and so on, because he's coming off as a lunatic and wasting his time on Twitter, instead of being at Tesla and SpaceX. So what's the price tag now? $80 billion? $100 billion? $150 billion? Reminder, the entire Saudi family, all of them, together, have about $1.4 trillion, and that's not cash in the bank, but assets, oil, real estate, all of it. Which means any such "price tag" would imply them giving up all their liquid assets and maybe liquidating more assets, in order to afford this "price tag" so quickly. It's just nonsense.
- mosselman 3y ago
  Thanks for this delightful breakdown of how dumb this theory is. By now I am very much aware that there are lots of people who believe conspiracy theories, yet I am still surprised when those people are from the tech scene. A developer who believes in the dumbest conspiracies is such an odd thing to me. It is so odd to me that someone who supposedly things about problems in a systematic way and has to break them down into their parts, can fall for something as dumb as the richest man in the world taking some sort of payoff to kill twitter. I should know better by now, but it still takes me by surprise sometimes
  - 3cats-in-a-coat 3y ago
    I don't want to insult anyone, and I see your logic about systematic thought. But being a programmer doesn't mean you're good at it. Shrug.
  - code_duck 3y ago
    Elon seems strangely desperate for money sometimes though. Despite his vast stock holdings, he feels compelled to play games with announcements that manipulate stock prices, and try pump-and-dump schemes on minor crypto.
  - mikrotikker 3y ago
    Come on, conspiracy theories are fun. It's fun to engage in thought experiments about what could be going on behind the scenes and even more fun to throw them out there to see what other people think. The original guy didn't even say he 100% believed it as fact. It's just a thought experiment
  - LexiMax 3y ago
    The conspiracy theory does not exist in a vacuum. People simply don’t want to admit to themselves that they were wrong for idolizing him, or they have a distaste for the kinds of people who attack him, so they choose to believe in the 5D chess game as a way of saving face or refusing to give ground.
- hnbad 3y ago
jimbob45 3y ago
There's no way this is true but this is going to live on forever in my headcanon. I fucking love it when /pol/ gets this creative.
spacebanana7 3y ago
I don’t think they intend to destroy Twitter, but rather influence content and moderation policies towards more favourable outcome. Twitter is extremely popular in Saudi, more so than the US/Europe, so some level of influence is extremely valuable.
- cjrp 3y ago
  The equivalent of sportswashing.
whywhywhywhy 3y ago
>would be the price tag to destroy Twitter, How would destroying it prevent that again, people would just go elsewhere. You’d prevent it by Twitter thriving then clever use of algorithm suppression and shadow bans. Conspiracy doesn’t add up.

simonklitj 3y ago

I don’t ascribe to the theory, it was in jest. However, he’s just so unfathomably bad at managing Twitter that I almost can’t imagine any other reason.