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He condemned accurately. The soviet system sounds pointlessly overloaded with middle men. Why not abandon the "official system with middle men bribes" and desc

He condemned accurately. The soviet system sounds pointlessly overloaded with middle men. Why not abandon the "official system with middle men bribes" and descend all the way into mafia families and protection rackets? No matter the empathy I have for the suffering. What is the point of offering a bribe, to bully the system, in the same way the receiver intends to break the rules? Just tell the truth and say the system sucks. You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours done en masse, hardens society for everyone and then you have to bribe, like the Soviets did.

ClumsyPilot 3y ago
> What is the point of offering a bribe, to bully the system Imagine your grandma needs urgent surgery and it is customary to give the doctor some money to 'ensure best results'. Will you refuse? > descend all the way into mafia families and protection rackets? You mean like some monopolized industries in the US have done? > then you have to bribe, like the Soviets did. Why Soviets, Bribing is the default way of society - Imperial Russia has no concept of bribery, if you wanted a government official to do their job, you had to pay them, and they set the price, thats just how the system worked. Victorian britain was insanely corrupt too. Absence of corruption is unusual.
- barrysteve 3y ago
  It is not a binary choice. My grandma can get the care via a bribe and the next day I can go join the local mafia. Not like a US corporation, the machine of machines, systems of systems. An actual mafia that breaks down the government and replaces official services with a protection racket around people's families and uses physical violence to enforce arbitrary mafia business norms. The real criminal mafia does not answer to a doctor who takes the wrong bribes and that doctor may go home that evening to find his house/family/prized thing to be in jeopardy. The mafia built on family and religious connections that can't be bought out, and will balance out a non-working government when it fails. The Soviet system props up the normal structure just enough to leech off it. That is a luxury of Russian culture that doesn't survive elsewhere, for very good reason. Suffering isn't an excuse for corruption that hurts basic services for the middle/lower class. Lie, bribe, cheat and steal for all the yacht money and control over steel mills, between upper class toffs, I don't care. When your corruption stops society from working for the majority, or oppresses the majority, then you have become the problem.
sofixa 3y ago
> The soviet system sounds pointlessly overloaded with middle men I find this conclusion hilarious (if not untrue) - you can say absolutely the same for the USA system. So many things require a useless middleman that only takes their cut and adds friction - car dealerships, "value added" resellers, health insurance, etc.

ClumsyPilot 3y ago

> What is the point of offering a bribe, to bully the system Imagine your grandma needs urgent surgery and it is customary to give the doctor some money to 'ensure best results'. Will you refuse? > descend all the way into mafia families and protection rackets? You mean like some monopolized industries in the US have done? > then you have to bribe, like the Soviets did. Why Soviets, Bribing is the default way of society - Imperial Russia has no concept of bribery, if you wanted a government official to do their job, you had to pay them, and they set the price, thats just how the system worked. Victorian britain was insanely corrupt too. Absence of corruption is unusual.

barrysteve 3y ago
It is not a binary choice. My grandma can get the care via a bribe and the next day I can go join the local mafia. Not like a US corporation, the machine of machines, systems of systems. An actual mafia that breaks down the government and replaces official services with a protection racket around people's families and uses physical violence to enforce arbitrary mafia business norms. The real criminal mafia does not answer to a doctor who takes the wrong bribes and that doctor may go home that evening to find his house/family/prized thing to be in jeopardy. The mafia built on family and religious connections that can't be bought out, and will balance out a non-working government when it fails. The Soviet system props up the normal structure just enough to leech off it. That is a luxury of Russian culture that doesn't survive elsewhere, for very good reason. Suffering isn't an excuse for corruption that hurts basic services for the middle/lower class. Lie, bribe, cheat and steal for all the yacht money and control over steel mills, between upper class toffs, I don't care. When your corruption stops society from working for the majority, or oppresses the majority, then you have become the problem.

sofixa 3y ago

> The soviet system sounds pointlessly overloaded with middle men I find this conclusion hilarious (if not untrue) - you can say absolutely the same for the USA system. So many things require a useless middleman that only takes their cut and adds friction - car dealerships, "value added" resellers, health insurance, etc.