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Places like Australia has some seriously large distances, with some of the most isolated populations on earth. Sure it's a small market (most Australians live

Places like Australia has some seriously large distances, with some of the most isolated populations on earth. Sure it's a small market (most Australians live in their state's capital city), but there needs to be some consideration for those that need serious range. The issue is frequently mentioned when talking about banning ICE vehicles. Toyota Landcruiser's with auxiliary fuel tanks (over 240 litres) are the workhorses in outback Australia.

valval 3y ago
Do these long distances require the driver to drive more than say 6 hours without stopping? If so, why? It’s a problem of charger infra, not range. We’ve already solved range.
sigmoid10 3y ago
Stuff like this is always brought up. And while it is true in principle, it doesn't change the above statement. Almost 90% of Australians live in cities and average distance driven per day by Australians is 30-40km. There will always be a small, single digit percentage market for long haul transport that needs alternatives. But the mass market doesn't need better EVs. That's why range has stagnated over the past years. Noone is willing to pay twice as much for slightly less inconvenience once every 6 months. Sure, if we had a working breakthrough battery that could deliver twice the performance for the same price it would be great, but in reality it would only be great for about 5% of personal traffic.
- XorNot 3y ago
  Yeah, more importantly: until cities are 100% EV, I wouldn't worry about rural. Realistically, we can probably just never worry about it: there are far more cars used in cities then in the country. In a case where you're trying to get emitted CO2 to zero, you'd probably prefer to just subsidize ethanol and renewable diesel to manage super-long haul to get their - too many tractors and other equipment we also need to run.
xtracto 3y ago
In Mexico and Singapore, Nissan introduced the Epower technology which is a hybrid in which the combustion part only serves as generator. All the driving machinery is electrical, and both the mpg and range are great. In hindsight I think it's an obvious technooogy: the conplexity of the combustion generator is pretty low, doesn't need gearbox, pistols, cylinders and whatnot. And the fuel tank still gives good range NY recharging the battery. Got a Kicks with this tech, and so far it has been pretty good for both city and the road (5 hr drives to the beach!)
- ianai 3y ago
  Or why can’t an EV drive up to a gas station and pick up a towable battery to get to the next stop. I’ve heard it’s done in China.
  - recursive 3y ago
    It's probably more trouble and cost than it's worth. How many thousands of dollars are you willing to deposit for the use of the battery?
    - ianai 3y ago
      You can rent a pretty near CDL sized truck from UHaul/etc for little trouble. This would represent less than the upfront cost of a truck from the companies POV. They’d only need to worry about the chance people don’t reuturn the batteries. That seems unlikely given the same people would have given all their info up front and are highly likely to need a battery in the future. Vehicle rentals are far more risky and still a daily occurrence. I’m 100% certain the market could exist. Probably the difficult part is car manufacturers supporting it and possibly some engineering problems (low probability of problems I think).
  - drewg123 3y ago
    I like the idea of one-way rentals of towable generators. Think a U-haul like model, where you pick one up at a gas station near your origin, and drop it at your destination. Now if EV makers would just allow charging while driving..
Olreich 3y ago
If the only ICE vehicles left are in the outback, we're doing okay.
- KingMob 3y ago
  > If the only ICE vehicles left are in the outback, we're doing okay. Are you sure? That sounds like Mad Max to me :)

valval 3y ago

Do these long distances require the driver to drive more than say 6 hours without stopping? If so, why? It’s a problem of charger infra, not range. We’ve already solved range.

sigmoid10 3y ago

Stuff like this is always brought up. And while it is true in principle, it doesn't change the above statement. Almost 90% of Australians live in cities and average distance driven per day by Australians is 30-40km. There will always be a small, single digit percentage market for long haul transport that needs alternatives. But the mass market doesn't need better EVs. That's why range has stagnated over the past years. Noone is willing to pay twice as much for slightly less inconvenience once every 6 months. Sure, if we had a working breakthrough battery that could deliver twice the performance for the same price it would be great, but in reality it would only be great for about 5% of personal traffic.

XorNot 3y ago
Yeah, more importantly: until cities are 100% EV, I wouldn't worry about rural. Realistically, we can probably just never worry about it: there are far more cars used in cities then in the country. In a case where you're trying to get emitted CO2 to zero, you'd probably prefer to just subsidize ethanol and renewable diesel to manage super-long haul to get their - too many tractors and other equipment we also need to run.

xtracto 3y ago

In Mexico and Singapore, Nissan introduced the Epower technology which is a hybrid in which the combustion part only serves as generator. All the driving machinery is electrical, and both the mpg and range are great. In hindsight I think it's an obvious technooogy: the conplexity of the combustion generator is pretty low, doesn't need gearbox, pistols, cylinders and whatnot. And the fuel tank still gives good range NY recharging the battery. Got a Kicks with this tech, and so far it has been pretty good for both city and the road (5 hr drives to the beach!)

ianai 3y ago
Or why can’t an EV drive up to a gas station and pick up a towable battery to get to the next stop. I’ve heard it’s done in China.
- recursive 3y ago
  It's probably more trouble and cost than it's worth. How many thousands of dollars are you willing to deposit for the use of the battery?
  - ianai 3y ago
    You can rent a pretty near CDL sized truck from UHaul/etc for little trouble. This would represent less than the upfront cost of a truck from the companies POV. They’d only need to worry about the chance people don’t reuturn the batteries. That seems unlikely given the same people would have given all their info up front and are highly likely to need a battery in the future. Vehicle rentals are far more risky and still a daily occurrence. I’m 100% certain the market could exist. Probably the difficult part is car manufacturers supporting it and possibly some engineering problems (low probability of problems I think).
- drewg123 3y ago
  I like the idea of one-way rentals of towable generators. Think a U-haul like model, where you pick one up at a gas station near your origin, and drop it at your destination. Now if EV makers would just allow charging while driving..

Olreich 3y ago

If the only ICE vehicles left are in the outback, we're doing okay.

KingMob 3y ago
> If the only ICE vehicles left are in the outback, we're doing okay. Are you sure? That sounds like Mad Max to me :)