5 ms·

I think the point he was making was more ...just like mining (used to be in developed countries but still is in developing countries). For every advanced, safe

I think the point he was making was more ...just like mining (used to be in developed countries but still is in developing countries). For every advanced, safe, automated mine like you describe there is another that's exactly the opposite. They still have giant open pit asbestos Minesin some countries for Gods sake. I'm not trying to dog on mining. I went to the Colorado school of Mines, many of my fellow students and teachers had bumper stickers that said "the car you're sitting in and the road its driving on brought to you by mining". It's (mining's) not bad, it's just your comment misses the point.

defrost 3y ago
> I went to the Colorado school of Mines Good for you, I just went straight from working on a minesite as a teenager (late 1970s) into geophysical coding for global exploration surveys after writing fleet optimisation and pit design software with a segue between in multichannel marine seismic aquisition | processing .. and then worked on the backend of the pre S&P version of https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/campaigns/metals-mining https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/campaigns/met... > For every advanced, safe, automated mine like you describe there is another that's exactly the opposite. Sure, by number, in fact I'd say there's more than one - shitty mines outnumber 'good' mines. Now, how's that go by mining volume and percentage contribution to the global resource demand? The Rio Tinto and other Anglo Australian iron ore mines in Western Australia alone put out some 800 million tonnes per annum - other mine sites for iron ore on that scale are few but equally modern - they don't hit that scale by having grubby faced children walk material out via hessian sacks across their backs. Even the high volume coal mines are open cuts with Bagger 288 scale machines. When you look at the bulk volume of global scale resource supply would you say that a large percentage of that material comes from "modern mines" or from mines such as Brazil's Serra Pelada [1] ? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOdhKYj8Bc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOdhKYj8Bc
- iancmceachern 3y ago
  Russia pulls 500 million tons of asbestos out of a single open pit mine per year. https://www.icij.org/investigations/dangers-dust/russia-worlds-asbestos-behemoth/#:~:text=Nearly%20half%20a%20million%20metric,from%20the%20mine%20each%20year https://www.icij.org/investigations/dangers-dust/russia-worl.... I'd be willing to bet that mine isn't terribly automated, and they're pulling serious amounts out. The mine you mention in Australia sounds cool. It's not on this top 10 list, which has many other, seemingly larger, open pit Mines in places like Russia, etc. That again, are likely not very automated. https://www.mining-technology.com/features/feature-top-ten-deepest-open-pit-mines-world/ https://www.mining-technology.com/features/feature-top-ten-d... It really depends on what resources you are talking about and where in the world. I agree with you for things like copper. I don't at all agree with you for things like diamonds, gold, most gems, rare earth metals, titanium, asbestos, etc.
  - defrost 3y ago
    Ural Asbest, Russia isn't running semi autonomus trucks, no - that's the current wave that hasn't yet tounched there .. but they are hitting a half billion tonne / annum target and that does take skills - planning , blasting, maintaining 100 tonne haulpaks, city scale power stations, etc. https://www.uralasbest.ru/index.php?q=en/about-company https://www.uralasbest.ru/index.php?q=en/about-company I'm chasing the grandparent comment that mining is "low skill" work to point out that some actual focused effort is required. Diamonds come either direct from Kimberlite pipes or from the downwash from their erosion. As you likely know from your school of mines it takes some not low skill level magnetic surveying to find and identify good kimberlite pipes. While we all know stories of conflict diamonds and the related dubious conditions there remains many diamond mines underpinned by skilled techniques; - machine use and maintenaince to remove the overburden and core deep into the earth without collapse, often in severe environments ("trad" mining) and of course the new (well, a few decades old) techniques of marine vacuum mining https://www.wsj.com/articles/de-beers-harvests-diamonds-at-the-bottom-of-the-sea-1476973582 https://www.wsj.com/articles/de-beers-harvests-diamonds-at-t... Custom build floating exploration | extraction plants don't roll cheap so you know the volume is there for the profit to foot those bills. Gold, bulk gold, comes mainly from superpits ( eg: https://www.superpit.com.au/ https://www.superpit.com.au/ ) that return ~ $billion per annum, rare earths like lithium are another local resource and again from modern mines like Greenbushes .. there's a hard rock engineer from there commenting on HN and maybe you can make the case that their work is low skilled. (I'll stand clear). With demand growing at numbers that hit billions of tonnes per year it takes applied technology to reach the goals expected, it's not exactly easy. With massive fuel demands we also see miners leading the way in advancing new green (and cheaper, less polluting) technologies (eg: https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green-ammonia https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green... | https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green-hydrogen https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green... )
    - iancmceachern 3y ago
      You are clearly on a mission. The key thing that I think you are missing is that you are conflating miners with mining engineers. You have very specific experiences and are close to mining in a way that the broader public isn't. To lost of the broader public, when they say miner they mean a guy that's all black from digging coal carrying a pick axe. The grandparent comment was referring to that, old, industrial revolution image of a miner. You shouldn't take offense.

defrost 3y ago

> I went to the Colorado school of Mines Good for you, I just went straight from working on a minesite as a teenager (late 1970s) into geophysical coding for global exploration surveys after writing fleet optimisation and pit design software with a segue between in multichannel marine seismic aquisition | processing .. and then worked on the backend of the pre S&P version of https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/campaigns/metals-mining https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/campaigns/met... > For every advanced, safe, automated mine like you describe there is another that's exactly the opposite. Sure, by number, in fact I'd say there's more than one - shitty mines outnumber 'good' mines. Now, how's that go by mining volume and percentage contribution to the global resource demand? The Rio Tinto and other Anglo Australian iron ore mines in Western Australia alone put out some 800 million tonnes per annum - other mine sites for iron ore on that scale are few but equally modern - they don't hit that scale by having grubby faced children walk material out via hessian sacks across their backs. Even the high volume coal mines are open cuts with Bagger 288 scale machines. When you look at the bulk volume of global scale resource supply would you say that a large percentage of that material comes from "modern mines" or from mines such as Brazil's Serra Pelada [1] ? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOdhKYj8Bc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOdhKYj8Bc

iancmceachern 3y ago
Russia pulls 500 million tons of asbestos out of a single open pit mine per year. https://www.icij.org/investigations/dangers-dust/russia-worlds-asbestos-behemoth/#:~:text=Nearly%20half%20a%20million%20metric,from%20the%20mine%20each%20year https://www.icij.org/investigations/dangers-dust/russia-worl.... I'd be willing to bet that mine isn't terribly automated, and they're pulling serious amounts out. The mine you mention in Australia sounds cool. It's not on this top 10 list, which has many other, seemingly larger, open pit Mines in places like Russia, etc. That again, are likely not very automated. https://www.mining-technology.com/features/feature-top-ten-deepest-open-pit-mines-world/ https://www.mining-technology.com/features/feature-top-ten-d... It really depends on what resources you are talking about and where in the world. I agree with you for things like copper. I don't at all agree with you for things like diamonds, gold, most gems, rare earth metals, titanium, asbestos, etc.
- defrost 3y ago
  Ural Asbest, Russia isn't running semi autonomus trucks, no - that's the current wave that hasn't yet tounched there .. but they are hitting a half billion tonne / annum target and that does take skills - planning , blasting, maintaining 100 tonne haulpaks, city scale power stations, etc. https://www.uralasbest.ru/index.php?q=en/about-company https://www.uralasbest.ru/index.php?q=en/about-company I'm chasing the grandparent comment that mining is "low skill" work to point out that some actual focused effort is required. Diamonds come either direct from Kimberlite pipes or from the downwash from their erosion. As you likely know from your school of mines it takes some not low skill level magnetic surveying to find and identify good kimberlite pipes. While we all know stories of conflict diamonds and the related dubious conditions there remains many diamond mines underpinned by skilled techniques; - machine use and maintenaince to remove the overburden and core deep into the earth without collapse, often in severe environments ("trad" mining) and of course the new (well, a few decades old) techniques of marine vacuum mining https://www.wsj.com/articles/de-beers-harvests-diamonds-at-the-bottom-of-the-sea-1476973582 https://www.wsj.com/articles/de-beers-harvests-diamonds-at-t... Custom build floating exploration | extraction plants don't roll cheap so you know the volume is there for the profit to foot those bills. Gold, bulk gold, comes mainly from superpits ( eg: https://www.superpit.com.au/ https://www.superpit.com.au/ ) that return ~ $billion per annum, rare earths like lithium are another local resource and again from modern mines like Greenbushes .. there's a hard rock engineer from there commenting on HN and maybe you can make the case that their work is low skilled. (I'll stand clear). With demand growing at numbers that hit billions of tonnes per year it takes applied technology to reach the goals expected, it's not exactly easy. With massive fuel demands we also see miners leading the way in advancing new green (and cheaper, less polluting) technologies (eg: https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green-ammonia https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green... | https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green-hydrogen https://fortescue.com/what-we-do/green-energy-research/green... )
  - iancmceachern 3y ago
    You are clearly on a mission. The key thing that I think you are missing is that you are conflating miners with mining engineers. You have very specific experiences and are close to mining in a way that the broader public isn't. To lost of the broader public, when they say miner they mean a guy that's all black from digging coal carrying a pick axe. The grandparent comment was referring to that, old, industrial revolution image of a miner. You shouldn't take offense.