4 ms·

File Transfer: https://xkcd.com/949/ https://xkcd.com/949/

johnwalkr 3y ago
I have a few qualms with this webcomic: 1. For a Linux user, you can already build such a system yourself quite trivially by getting an FTP account, mounting it locally with curlftpfs, and then using SVN or CVS on the mounted filesystem. From Windows or Mac, this FTP account could be accessed through built-in software. 2. It doesn't actually replace a USB drive. Most people I know e-mail files to themselves or host them somewhere online to be able to perform presentations, but they still carry a USB drive in case there are connectivity problems. This does not solve the connectivity issue. 3. It does not seem very "viral" or income-generating. I know this is premature at this point, but without charging users for the service, is it reasonable to expect to make money off of this?
nerdponx 3y ago
This is still an issue in 2023. Dropbox and Google Drive aren't new, and ironically Megaupload is now a Dropbox/Drive competitor Mega + Rapidshare is long dead. But emailing files or physically sharing on a USB drive is still the best way to share files ad-hoc. Dropbox etc does work, but you have to make a new account and mess around with settings and permissions.
- NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
  I was almost going to mention Drive and OneDrive and iCloud, but I realized that these are not secure sharing methods, unless your target audience also has accounts on the same cloud service. You can share to "anyone with the link", and practice security through obscurity.
  - dtech 3y ago
    This isn't security through obscurity at all, the links contain a random secret and aren't public. You might as well say a password is security through obscurity because it can be guessed...
    - NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
      [Google Drive] Anyone who has the link can access the file. There is no authentication. It's only as "secret" as the email you put it in, or the Zoom chat room it was dropped into, or the web page it is published in. The shared links do not contain a secret at all. The base64-encoded part of the link is the file object's UUID! Look at it as you copy a shared link, vs. seeing it in the URL bar. It doesn't change as you edit the file, move it to another folder, or share it out. It won't go away until you've deleted the file! If you notice that someone has a link and they shouldn't have it, then you'll just have to copy-paste the content into a new document, and throw the compromised one in the Trash. Goodbye, revision history and all metadata. Common use cases involve sharing to groups of people, you know, more than one person who might keep a "secret"? What if you've shared a link to 30 people, how do you ensure that 31 can't open it? "Three men can keep a secret, if two of them are dead." As opposed to passwords, which people know are secret[citation needed], links are shared. I mean, Google Drive literally calls it "Sharing", so who will stop sharing after the intended recipients have got it?
      - csydas 3y ago
        I think this is my biggest issue with the enterprise file sharing solutions; it's way too hard to manage access to files and to do simple sharing. like at face value it seems easy if you just want to drop a file to a friend or coworker, but it gets much more difficult when you want to actually enforce any controls on it. Sharepoint and Google drive really feel like they have gone out of their way to make the permissions scheme as convoluted as possible, and it's never clear for me whether I've shared it in a way that permissions can propagate from those I shared it with or not. sometimes I can further share a received Sharepoint document without issue, other times I cannot, and I don't know what the difference is. some of my shared docs that are only shared with specific users can be shared freely apparently, other times when it gets shared further I get automated emails with access requests, even though the public access list is disabled/empty on both cases. I really wish that the user:group:world wide model was the basis for these permission schemes and it was easier to just set people/groups and the specific actions they can take on a shared file/document. I get why the companies call it sharing, but it shouldn't be thought of as sharing, it should be Grant Access. I think it gives a better mindset for what you're actually doing, and the design should be around the idea you're giving access, not sharing, which is not the same thing to me.
- tinus_hn 3y ago
  Wetransfer is exactly made for this purpose. Or if you have Apple and the file is not larger than 5GB, it’s sent through Mail Drop which does the same thing but seamless.
- RunSet 3y ago
  > This is still an issue in 2023. Because its remaining an issue enables "value extraction". Magic wormhole would work if people knew about it but somehow software that promotes itself by honest word-of-mouth has difficulty competing with software that is bundled with Windows or is made by the world's largest advertising corporation. https://github.com/magic-wormhole/magic-wormhole https://github.com/magic-wormhole/magic-wormhole https://github.com/sneakypete81/wormhole-ui https://github.com/sneakypete81/wormhole-ui
  - sigmonsays 3y ago
    I would argue the installation of magic wormhole is hard. Python is a pain and usually scares me away from installing it. I dont want python pooping all over my system. There is no release artifact that I can easily open and run on the github page.
    - specproc 3y ago
      If you're interested in trying python without it interfering with existing installs, Anaconda and Miniconda are great places to start.
    - psanford 3y ago
      https://github.com/psanford/wormhole-william/releases/tag/v1.0.6 https://github.com/psanford/wormhole-william/releases/tag/v1...
- wackget 3y ago
  WebRTC has been supported in browsers for at least 10 years. To that end you can use a website like https://www.toffeeshare.com/ https://www.toffeeshare.com/ to send files directly to another person via your browser via a P2P connection, without an account.
  - anothermoron 3y ago
    I love how they literally use the XKCD comics in their about page. https://toffeeshare.com/about https://toffeeshare.com/about
nurettin 3y ago
I broke this cycle by teaching my 8year old how to use DirectoryIndex

I have a few qualms with this webcomic: 1. For a Linux user, you can already build such a system yourself quite trivially by getting an FTP account, mounting it locally with curlftpfs, and then using SVN or CVS on the mounted filesystem. From Windows or Mac, this FTP account could be accessed through built-in software. 2. It doesn't actually replace a USB drive. Most people I know e-mail files to themselves or host them somewhere online to be able to perform presentations, but they still carry a USB drive in case there are connectivity problems. This does not solve the connectivity issue. 3. It does not seem very "viral" or income-generating. I know this is premature at this point, but without charging users for the service, is it reasonable to expect to make money off of this?

nerdponx 3y ago

This is still an issue in 2023. Dropbox and Google Drive aren't new, and ironically Megaupload is now a Dropbox/Drive competitor Mega + Rapidshare is long dead. But emailing files or physically sharing on a USB drive is still the best way to share files ad-hoc. Dropbox etc does work, but you have to make a new account and mess around with settings and permissions.

NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
I was almost going to mention Drive and OneDrive and iCloud, but I realized that these are not secure sharing methods, unless your target audience also has accounts on the same cloud service. You can share to "anyone with the link", and practice security through obscurity.
- dtech 3y ago
  This isn't security through obscurity at all, the links contain a random secret and aren't public. You might as well say a password is security through obscurity because it can be guessed...
  - NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
    [Google Drive] Anyone who has the link can access the file. There is no authentication. It's only as "secret" as the email you put it in, or the Zoom chat room it was dropped into, or the web page it is published in. The shared links do not contain a secret at all. The base64-encoded part of the link is the file object's UUID! Look at it as you copy a shared link, vs. seeing it in the URL bar. It doesn't change as you edit the file, move it to another folder, or share it out. It won't go away until you've deleted the file! If you notice that someone has a link and they shouldn't have it, then you'll just have to copy-paste the content into a new document, and throw the compromised one in the Trash. Goodbye, revision history and all metadata. Common use cases involve sharing to groups of people, you know, more than one person who might keep a "secret"? What if you've shared a link to 30 people, how do you ensure that 31 can't open it? "Three men can keep a secret, if two of them are dead." As opposed to passwords, which people know are secret[citation needed], links are shared. I mean, Google Drive literally calls it "Sharing", so who will stop sharing after the intended recipients have got it?
    - csydas 3y ago
      I think this is my biggest issue with the enterprise file sharing solutions; it's way too hard to manage access to files and to do simple sharing. like at face value it seems easy if you just want to drop a file to a friend or coworker, but it gets much more difficult when you want to actually enforce any controls on it. Sharepoint and Google drive really feel like they have gone out of their way to make the permissions scheme as convoluted as possible, and it's never clear for me whether I've shared it in a way that permissions can propagate from those I shared it with or not. sometimes I can further share a received Sharepoint document without issue, other times I cannot, and I don't know what the difference is. some of my shared docs that are only shared with specific users can be shared freely apparently, other times when it gets shared further I get automated emails with access requests, even though the public access list is disabled/empty on both cases. I really wish that the user:group:world wide model was the basis for these permission schemes and it was easier to just set people/groups and the specific actions they can take on a shared file/document. I get why the companies call it sharing, but it shouldn't be thought of as sharing, it should be Grant Access. I think it gives a better mindset for what you're actually doing, and the design should be around the idea you're giving access, not sharing, which is not the same thing to me.
tinus_hn 3y ago
Wetransfer is exactly made for this purpose. Or if you have Apple and the file is not larger than 5GB, it’s sent through Mail Drop which does the same thing but seamless.
RunSet 3y ago
> This is still an issue in 2023. Because its remaining an issue enables "value extraction". Magic wormhole would work if people knew about it but somehow software that promotes itself by honest word-of-mouth has difficulty competing with software that is bundled with Windows or is made by the world's largest advertising corporation. https://github.com/magic-wormhole/magic-wormhole https://github.com/magic-wormhole/magic-wormhole https://github.com/sneakypete81/wormhole-ui https://github.com/sneakypete81/wormhole-ui
- sigmonsays 3y ago
  I would argue the installation of magic wormhole is hard. Python is a pain and usually scares me away from installing it. I dont want python pooping all over my system. There is no release artifact that I can easily open and run on the github page.
  - specproc 3y ago
    If you're interested in trying python without it interfering with existing installs, Anaconda and Miniconda are great places to start.
  - psanford 3y ago
    https://github.com/psanford/wormhole-william/releases/tag/v1.0.6 https://github.com/psanford/wormhole-william/releases/tag/v1...
wackget 3y ago
WebRTC has been supported in browsers for at least 10 years. To that end you can use a website like https://www.toffeeshare.com/ https://www.toffeeshare.com/ to send files directly to another person via your browser via a P2P connection, without an account.
- anothermoron 3y ago
  I love how they literally use the XKCD comics in their about page. https://toffeeshare.com/about https://toffeeshare.com/about

nurettin 3y ago

I broke this cycle by teaching my 8year old how to use DirectoryIndex