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> You realize that the "rent" you pay includes the cost of the land, as well as the actual building on top. My point is that comparing whatever serfs paid and g

by rcarr 3y ago

> You realize that the "rent" you pay includes the cost of the land, as well as the actual building on top. My point is that comparing whatever serfs paid and got in return (ie. only access to the land) and what the typical renter today gets (ie. access to the land and a finished building) isn't comparable. I'm pretty sure most serfs were renting pre-existing dwellings. And I'm not sure what you're getting at with this welfare state stuff. Yes we get taxed and receive things in return but so did the serf. The only difference is the serf typically only paid one tax for everything that also included his rent. Currently, people are paying the same amount as the serf did just for rent (30-50% or more) yet the landlord has no responsibility to maintain roads and any of the other basic services he did back in the day. Instead the worker has to pay for these things on top of what he is already paying the landlord. The only benefit the modern worker is getting over his medieval counterpart is better quality housing.

gruez 3y ago
>I'm pretty sure most serfs were renting pre-existing dwellings. Who built the pre-existing buildings? I somehow doubt that the feudal lords were pre-building the houses landlord style. Also, after the building is built, there's the cost of maintenance. Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord. I doubt that back in the day the serfs would be contacting the lord if they had a leaky roof. >And I'm not sure what you're getting at with this welfare state stuff That was brought up because the original commenter was talking about all the taxes that people have to pay. >The only benefit the modern worker is getting over his medieval counterpart is better quality housing. That's exactly the contention. Renters today are getting access to the land and a living unit that costs a non-trivial amount of resources to build. Serfs get access to the land and a mud hut. Sure, maybe if you work out the numbers the "living unit" part of the rent is actually trivial, but as it stands right now the numbers aren't directly comparable.
- rcarr 3y ago
  > Who built the pre-existing buildings? I somehow doubt that the feudal lords were pre-building the houses landlord style. Yeah some building is going on. But a lot is getting passed down or rented out to other people when people die. If I remember correctly the Crown essentially seized all land with the Magna Carta and then diced it up as they saw fit and anyone in any existing dwelling was forced to pay or booted out. > Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord Er no it's not. The developer builds the property. The landlord buys it and rents it. > Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord. I doubt that back in the day the serfs would be contacting the lord if they had a leaky roof. Yes, this is true. But many landlords will also refuse to pay out to get certain things fixed. On top of that, you're also not allowed to modify the dwelling you live in if you want to see your deposit again. Which you probably won't because they'll make up some kind of reason not to give it back to you. If you can't see the similarities to how medieval aristocracy and modern day landlords are bullying the rest of society for their own benefit and extracting the same proportion of money from them, then I can't be arsed to convince you.
- DropInIn 3y ago
  Keep moving those posts /s Also, you sure do look like a sealion to me.... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning

by rcarr 3y ago

gruez 3y ago

>I'm pretty sure most serfs were renting pre-existing dwellings. Who built the pre-existing buildings? I somehow doubt that the feudal lords were pre-building the houses landlord style. Also, after the building is built, there's the cost of maintenance. Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord. I doubt that back in the day the serfs would be contacting the lord if they had a leaky roof. >And I'm not sure what you're getting at with this welfare state stuff That was brought up because the original commenter was talking about all the taxes that people have to pay. >The only benefit the modern worker is getting over his medieval counterpart is better quality housing. That's exactly the contention. Renters today are getting access to the land and a living unit that costs a non-trivial amount of resources to build. Serfs get access to the land and a mud hut. Sure, maybe if you work out the numbers the "living unit" part of the rent is actually trivial, but as it stands right now the numbers aren't directly comparable.

rcarr 3y ago
> Who built the pre-existing buildings? I somehow doubt that the feudal lords were pre-building the houses landlord style. Yeah some building is going on. But a lot is getting passed down or rented out to other people when people die. If I remember correctly the Crown essentially seized all land with the Magna Carta and then diced it up as they saw fit and anyone in any existing dwelling was forced to pay or booted out. > Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord Er no it's not. The developer builds the property. The landlord buys it and rents it. > Today, that's the responsibility of the landlord. I doubt that back in the day the serfs would be contacting the lord if they had a leaky roof. Yes, this is true. But many landlords will also refuse to pay out to get certain things fixed. On top of that, you're also not allowed to modify the dwelling you live in if you want to see your deposit again. Which you probably won't because they'll make up some kind of reason not to give it back to you. If you can't see the similarities to how medieval aristocracy and modern day landlords are bullying the rest of society for their own benefit and extracting the same proportion of money from them, then I can't be arsed to convince you.
DropInIn 3y ago
Keep moving those posts /s Also, you sure do look like a sealion to me.... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning