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This is great cause soon nobody will believe any image is real.

by seydor 3y ago

krapp 3y ago
Why do people keep saying this? People believe far less convincing things now. People see After Effects flares and badly animated CGI on Youtube and photoshopped images and think aliens are real and cities appear in the skies over China. People will believe whatever confirms their biases, regardless of its quality. I don't think this is going to change much, one way or the other.
- anigbrowl 3y ago
  To cope with their discomfort at not having a good answer for any of the potential problems. Also, reflexive denial is a very common tactic for avoiding responsibility. In an increasingly networked world, people can rely on others with the same personality type to back up their denials.
  - pessimizer 3y ago
    The only real problem is the problem of proof. People won't believe real images when deepfakes are common. How are you going to prove what you say is true? How are you going to convince people to act on what would be impossible to verify? Not only is is a bigger problem than a bit of puritanism, but it's one that doesn't completely solve itself.
- pessimizer 3y ago
  > Why do people keep saying this? Because there's no reasonable argument against it. What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. I can't imagine a person so stupid that they would be aware that they can make a 1-click deepfake, but also be totally convinced by every photo they see. This would be somebody who runs away screaming when they see a train coming towards them on television (which people actually did at the dawn of film, but they got used to the new situation.) > People believe far less convincing things now. People see After Effects flares and badly animated CGI on Youtube and photoshopped images and think aliens are real and cities appear in the skies over China. People will believe whatever confirms their biases, regardless of its quality. People believe it because it is harder to do now. They use a very sensible heuristic (often badly) that nobody would go through the trouble to fake X images for Y reason. The question is explicitly about what happens when you don't have to go through any trouble to create convincing fake images.
  - IanCal 3y ago
    People read text and trust it, yet know it was just written by a person. Many people fall for made up bullshit all the time. Why would realistic images suddenly be less convincing than written rumour?
    - pessimizer 3y ago
      They wouldn't be less convincing than an anonymous denunciation, and nobody made that claim. They would be equally unconvincing. If you don't want people fired for anonymous denunciations, you should concentrate on labor rights.
  - jrflowers 3y ago
    > Because there's no reasonable argument against it. This is a good point. Nobody believes that any text is real and as a result nobody has been harmed by text since the advent of the typewriter (the point in history when it became difficult to ascertain the true writer of a piece of text). Surely images will follow in this vein.
  - maximus-decimus 3y ago
    > What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. We're literally commenting on a thread about a teacher being fired because parents are too stupid to understand that deepfakes aren't real. > People believe it because it is harder to do now. Define harder. Here's how to make a deepfake using stable diffusion (9 month old tutorial): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJEHJXiwGVU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJEHJXiwGVU and here's how to train the model to make whoever you want given you have about 8 pictures: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Nu5tUl2zQw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Nu5tUl2zQw You don't even need your own gpu if you use Google Collabs, really. Hell, it requires such low grade hardware that you can do it with Collabs' free tier.
  - BoiledCabbage 3y ago
    > What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. I can't imagine a person so stupid that they would be aware that they can make a 1-click deepfake, but also be totally convinced by every photo they see. Honestly, because there are a lot of people out there like you. No matter how much evidence there is out there to the contrary, they'll still keep believing what they want to believe. In a world we're we've gone through blatant political spoken lies having enormous consequences due to people believing them, books of fake text people believing, entirely absurd doctored images people believing some people some people are unable to believe that people will fall for faked videos. As in regardless of what the evidence is, and how obviously it may point to a conclusion, some people will believe what they want to believe to maintain their world view - even if it's entirely counter-factual. And whether their belief is "xyz people are lizard people", "aliens are real", or "people will never believe faked forms of media" they will continue to believe it no matter what is shown to them throughout their lifetime.
- seydor 3y ago
  People believe whatever other people that they trust tell them. There will still be "reputable" sources to tell people what is real.
- HDMI_Cable 3y ago
  Yeah, its much more likely that people will use deepfakes and AI-generated photos/video to reconfirm their pre-existing biases, just as how we use manipulative news articles to confirm our opinions on topics. All that this will do if cement the death of an objective fact—at least for fields without strong empirical verification mechanisms.
- singleshot_ 3y ago
  I think you might gain better insight into why people keep saying that if you think about your telephone. Twenty years ago when your phone rang, it was probably one of your friends or family. Today, when your phone rings, you just assume it’s a telemarketer, right? I think I’m the future when you see a digital image or video you’ll think the same thing: here comes some jerk to scam me.
- thebruce87m 3y ago
  We’re not talking about outlandish things being faked. We’re talking about mundane things being faked with no way to prove otherwise. From the article: > The parents at the school didn’t understand how that could be possible These people will vote on what they see.

This is great cause soon nobody will believe any image is real.

by seydor 3y ago

This is great cause soon nobody will believe any image is real.

Why do people keep saying this? People believe far less convincing things now. People see After Effects flares and badly animated CGI on Youtube and photoshopped images and think aliens are real and cities appear in the skies over China. People will believe whatever confirms their biases, regardless of its quality. I don't think this is going to change much, one way or the other.

anigbrowl 3y ago
To cope with their discomfort at not having a good answer for any of the potential problems. Also, reflexive denial is a very common tactic for avoiding responsibility. In an increasingly networked world, people can rely on others with the same personality type to back up their denials.
- pessimizer 3y ago
  The only real problem is the problem of proof. People won't believe real images when deepfakes are common. How are you going to prove what you say is true? How are you going to convince people to act on what would be impossible to verify? Not only is is a bigger problem than a bit of puritanism, but it's one that doesn't completely solve itself.
pessimizer 3y ago
> Why do people keep saying this? Because there's no reasonable argument against it. What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. I can't imagine a person so stupid that they would be aware that they can make a 1-click deepfake, but also be totally convinced by every photo they see. This would be somebody who runs away screaming when they see a train coming towards them on television (which people actually did at the dawn of film, but they got used to the new situation.) > People believe far less convincing things now. People see After Effects flares and badly animated CGI on Youtube and photoshopped images and think aliens are real and cities appear in the skies over China. People will believe whatever confirms their biases, regardless of its quality. People believe it because it is harder to do now. They use a very sensible heuristic (often badly) that nobody would go through the trouble to fake X images for Y reason. The question is explicitly about what happens when you don't have to go through any trouble to create convincing fake images.
- IanCal 3y ago
  People read text and trust it, yet know it was just written by a person. Many people fall for made up bullshit all the time. Why would realistic images suddenly be less convincing than written rumour?
  - pessimizer 3y ago
    They wouldn't be less convincing than an anonymous denunciation, and nobody made that claim. They would be equally unconvincing. If you don't want people fired for anonymous denunciations, you should concentrate on labor rights.
- jrflowers 3y ago
  > Because there's no reasonable argument against it. This is a good point. Nobody believes that any text is real and as a result nobody has been harmed by text since the advent of the typewriter (the point in history when it became difficult to ascertain the true writer of a piece of text). Surely images will follow in this vein.
- maximus-decimus 3y ago
  > What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. We're literally commenting on a thread about a teacher being fired because parents are too stupid to understand that deepfakes aren't real. > People believe it because it is harder to do now. Define harder. Here's how to make a deepfake using stable diffusion (9 month old tutorial): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJEHJXiwGVU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJEHJXiwGVU and here's how to train the model to make whoever you want given you have about 8 pictures: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Nu5tUl2zQw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Nu5tUl2zQw You don't even need your own gpu if you use Google Collabs, really. Hell, it requires such low grade hardware that you can do it with Collabs' free tier.
- BoiledCabbage 3y ago
  > What I want to understand is why people have such a low opinion of the intelligence of the people around them. I can't imagine a person so stupid that they would be aware that they can make a 1-click deepfake, but also be totally convinced by every photo they see. Honestly, because there are a lot of people out there like you. No matter how much evidence there is out there to the contrary, they'll still keep believing what they want to believe. In a world we're we've gone through blatant political spoken lies having enormous consequences due to people believing them, books of fake text people believing, entirely absurd doctored images people believing some people some people are unable to believe that people will fall for faked videos. As in regardless of what the evidence is, and how obviously it may point to a conclusion, some people will believe what they want to believe to maintain their world view - even if it's entirely counter-factual. And whether their belief is "xyz people are lizard people", "aliens are real", or "people will never believe faked forms of media" they will continue to believe it no matter what is shown to them throughout their lifetime.
seydor 3y ago
People believe whatever other people that they trust tell them. There will still be "reputable" sources to tell people what is real.
HDMI_Cable 3y ago
Yeah, its much more likely that people will use deepfakes and AI-generated photos/video to reconfirm their pre-existing biases, just as how we use manipulative news articles to confirm our opinions on topics. All that this will do if cement the death of an objective fact—at least for fields without strong empirical verification mechanisms.
singleshot_ 3y ago
I think you might gain better insight into why people keep saying that if you think about your telephone. Twenty years ago when your phone rang, it was probably one of your friends or family. Today, when your phone rings, you just assume it’s a telemarketer, right? I think I’m the future when you see a digital image or video you’ll think the same thing: here comes some jerk to scam me.
thebruce87m 3y ago
We’re not talking about outlandish things being faked. We’re talking about mundane things being faked with no way to prove otherwise. From the article: > The parents at the school didn’t understand how that could be possible These people will vote on what they see.