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>Well, you need to justify your new cost to the rest of the company/other people. I mean, do they really? They already got the green-light to port to Rust; so

>Well, you need to justify your new cost to the rest of the company/other people. I mean, do they really? They already got the green-light to port to Rust; so the people whose opinions actually matter, the people responsible for the health of that company, have already been convinced. So what if you think their justification is weak? Do you believe the company is worse off because they're switching to Rust? Do you even have all the information to make that judgement call? Do you honestly even care?

serf 3y ago
>So what if you think their justification is weak? "so what if you think a for-profit company is making an extraneous decision and wasting the time of their employees?" you don't need to be a language fanboi to understand that superficially changing languages to meet the trend is wasteful/harmful/dangerous/stupid in nearly all cases when you already have a working (and bought) product -- if that is suspected here then it makes good sense to judge the decision-making capabilities of the organization.
- robot_no_421 3y ago
  >"so what if you think a for-profit company is making an extraneous decision and wasting the time of their employees?" Yea exactly, so what? Are you a share holder? Are you an employee? Do you even have evidence that what you're saying is in fact true? Do you even know what you're talking about? >you don't need to be a language fanboi Ah I see, you're one of those Rust haters. Nothing I said here had anything to do with Rust. They could have been porting to any other language and I'd say the exact same thing. >superficially changing languages to meet the trend is wasteful/ harmful/ dangerous/ stupid in nearly all cases In other words, only when the high and mighty serf agrees with a company's decisions is it a good idea. He doesn't even need to know anything about the company, he already knows from his omniscient powers when a company decision is the right or wrong one.
lossolo 3y ago
> so the people whose opinions actually matter, the people responsible for the health of that company, have already been convinced Are you new here? It's a VC company with multiple rounds of funding; they burn money like a locomotive burns coal. Do you know what's going on in tech VC companies? You should really work for a few of them to gain experience, it's eye-opening. You would be surprised at what people rewrite as internal tools when you have better open source/commercial products available for a fraction of the price of a rewrite. > So what if you think their justification is weak? Do you believe the company is worse off because they're switching to Rust? Do you even have all the information to make that judgement call? Do you honestly even care? Yes, I care, but for different reasons than you do. Seeing how emotionally connected you are to the responses you write (based on your responses to me and others, it seems like you get triggered when someone criticizes Rust). When I'm replying to you, I'm not actually trying to convince you. I don't actually care what you think. I write this so others who read this thread know that there are people wasting resources without any reasonable technical justification, and they do it in the majority of cases for personal reasons (boredom, to add a language to their CV, to justify their employment, etc.). As I said, I've seen it personally multiple times already, in different companies, and it was a waste of time, money, and resources, and in some cases, it even destroyed the product. So, the next time someone tries to convince them to rewrite their product in another language, maybe they will think twice and actually double-check the technical justification. And don't get me wrong, in some cases rewrite is actually justified. I personally decided/my team rewrote one module in one of the projects from Go to Rust where GC was a problem so I'm not some kind of language fundamentalist. Rust shines in the niche it was made for, it's a tool. If you are creating personal projects, then use whatever you like.
- robot_no_421 3y ago
  I'm simply of the opinion that a single blog post isn't enough info for you to make a judgement call on whether a rewrite or a port is a good idea or not. Criticizing an article without even pointing out any specific criticisms (saying their technical reasons are "weak" isn't actually pointing out a flaw in their explanation, it's just you voicing your personal opinion) just seems to me like people are disagreeing out of habit or principle rather than that they actually have a reason why this company is making a bad decision. Again, it's a blog post to announce their decision and explain their thought process. It wasn't a blog post meant to persuade lossolo that this port is required. For all you know, the decision making in the backroom might have been much more argumentative and demanding of a justification than what was written in a blog post. And yes, people who hate on Rust on principle do rub me the wrong way. The pendulum has swung too far the other way; there are more annoying people complaining about Rust these days than annoying people rewriting things in Rust.

serf 3y ago

>So what if you think their justification is weak? "so what if you think a for-profit company is making an extraneous decision and wasting the time of their employees?" you don't need to be a language fanboi to understand that superficially changing languages to meet the trend is wasteful/harmful/dangerous/stupid in nearly all cases when you already have a working (and bought) product -- if that is suspected here then it makes good sense to judge the decision-making capabilities of the organization.

robot_no_421 3y ago
>"so what if you think a for-profit company is making an extraneous decision and wasting the time of their employees?" Yea exactly, so what? Are you a share holder? Are you an employee? Do you even have evidence that what you're saying is in fact true? Do you even know what you're talking about? >you don't need to be a language fanboi Ah I see, you're one of those Rust haters. Nothing I said here had anything to do with Rust. They could have been porting to any other language and I'd say the exact same thing. >superficially changing languages to meet the trend is wasteful/ harmful/ dangerous/ stupid in nearly all cases In other words, only when the high and mighty serf agrees with a company's decisions is it a good idea. He doesn't even need to know anything about the company, he already knows from his omniscient powers when a company decision is the right or wrong one.

lossolo 3y ago

> so the people whose opinions actually matter, the people responsible for the health of that company, have already been convinced Are you new here? It's a VC company with multiple rounds of funding; they burn money like a locomotive burns coal. Do you know what's going on in tech VC companies? You should really work for a few of them to gain experience, it's eye-opening. You would be surprised at what people rewrite as internal tools when you have better open source/commercial products available for a fraction of the price of a rewrite. > So what if you think their justification is weak? Do you believe the company is worse off because they're switching to Rust? Do you even have all the information to make that judgement call? Do you honestly even care? Yes, I care, but for different reasons than you do. Seeing how emotionally connected you are to the responses you write (based on your responses to me and others, it seems like you get triggered when someone criticizes Rust). When I'm replying to you, I'm not actually trying to convince you. I don't actually care what you think. I write this so others who read this thread know that there are people wasting resources without any reasonable technical justification, and they do it in the majority of cases for personal reasons (boredom, to add a language to their CV, to justify their employment, etc.). As I said, I've seen it personally multiple times already, in different companies, and it was a waste of time, money, and resources, and in some cases, it even destroyed the product. So, the next time someone tries to convince them to rewrite their product in another language, maybe they will think twice and actually double-check the technical justification. And don't get me wrong, in some cases rewrite is actually justified. I personally decided/my team rewrote one module in one of the projects from Go to Rust where GC was a problem so I'm not some kind of language fundamentalist. Rust shines in the niche it was made for, it's a tool. If you are creating personal projects, then use whatever you like.

robot_no_421 3y ago
I'm simply of the opinion that a single blog post isn't enough info for you to make a judgement call on whether a rewrite or a port is a good idea or not. Criticizing an article without even pointing out any specific criticisms (saying their technical reasons are "weak" isn't actually pointing out a flaw in their explanation, it's just you voicing your personal opinion) just seems to me like people are disagreeing out of habit or principle rather than that they actually have a reason why this company is making a bad decision. Again, it's a blog post to announce their decision and explain their thought process. It wasn't a blog post meant to persuade lossolo that this port is required. For all you know, the decision making in the backroom might have been much more argumentative and demanding of a justification than what was written in a blog post. And yes, people who hate on Rust on principle do rub me the wrong way. The pendulum has swung too far the other way; there are more annoying people complaining about Rust these days than annoying people rewriting things in Rust.