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Death Valley Just Had the Hottest Midnight on Record
- genter 3y agoSave you a click: > From 12 a.m. to 1 a.m. on July 17, Death Valley hit a record 120°F. The advertisements to buy a new car are a nice touch.
- barbazoo 3y ago120°F = 48.88°C
- PartiallyTyped 3y agoWe are doomed, aren't we?
- f6v 3y agoHumanity survived ice age(s) with much less technology. It’s going to take much more than that.
- PartiallyTyped 3y agoA couple of problems: 1. We no longer have access to easy to mine resources, which is also how we know that there weren't any really advanced civilizations prior us. 2. A lot of knowledge has been lost on how to do the incremental steps between ice age to here. 3. Lots of people will die. 4. We have very little genetic diversity as a consequence of the previous ice-ages, and we haven't actually recovered.
- 6D794163636F756 3y ago1.) It's easier to contain or add energy that remove it from a system 2.) The ice ages occured more gradually so didn't disrupt food systems as much 3.) Ice age wood is great for instrument making so we got sweet string instruments out of it 4.) Most hominems died in the last ice age. It's speculated that all non homosapien species were wiped out during or due to the ice age.
- fabrice_d 3y agoSo far we mostly used technology to fuck things up.
- irrational 3y agoEspecially Tinder and Grindr.
- anigbrowl 3y agoI think you're making the mistake of equating 'humanity' with 'the vast majority of people' rather than 'human survivors in a specific geographic zone', as well as underestimating the speed of change relative to historical fluctuations.
- mupuff1234 3y agoPerhaps, but I'm not exactly looking forward to a future where surviving is the main objective.
- delecti 3y agoIf there were only 1 million people alive in 2030, you could reasonably say humanity had "survived", but also say that most people today in 2023 are "doomed". The prognosis is certainly much better than that, but "humanity survived" is a very low bar.
- sixothree 3y agoWe’re one tipping point away from really bad days.
- pc86 3y agoI remember hearing this 20 years ago, and we've certainly hit at least one tipping point since then, no? I'm not saying you're wrong, but when someone predicts a calamity for decades, they don't get credit when they happen to be right the 500th time.
- somenameforme 3y agoThe highest temperature ever recorded was in Death Valley, in 1913. [1] Hence the reason for this weird 'at midnight' metric. It also holds another pretty neat record of having 43 days with temperature over 120 each day. That was in 1917. The planet's definitely warming up, but seeing every single freak weather occurrence, let alone in an area uniquely geographically situated for such, as a 'sign' of the end times isn't going to serve much purpose. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_Valley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_Valley
- fullshark 3y agoThe purpose is people are swayed by compelling anecdotes, not data. These types of anecdotes will continue to get pubished for the foreseeable future partially for political purposes, partly because data is dry and these types of things are compelling.
- basisword 3y ago>> The purpose is people are swayed by compelling anecdotes, not data. The purpose is people are swayed by fear and these anecdotes create fear. As much as I want us to do much more to tackle climate change, scaring ordinary people whose individual actions don't count for much is simply the media trying to make money. It's getting tired and annoying.
- squirtlebonflow 3y agoEveryone being afraid is WAY better than people being convinced climate change is a non-issue.
- Timon3 3y agoBut it's those same ordinary people who have to change their voting patterns to do something against climate change. What if creating fear is the only way to sway them towards saving most of humanity?
- aodin 3y ago> A higher reading of 134F, or 56.6C a century earlier, also in Death Valley, is disputed. It is believed by some modern weather experts to have been erroneous, along with several other searing temperatures recorded that summer. > According to a 2016 analysis from weather historian Christopher Burt, other temperatures in the region recorded in 1913 do not corroborate the Death Valley reading https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53788018 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53788018
- fshbbdssbbgdd 3y agoDepends on who you mean by “we”. Air conditioning and insulation can protect you from high temperatures when you’re inside. Solar and storage can provide the electricity to power it. The problem is it’s going to take decades at best to get that tech into the hands of everyone who needs it in many parts of the world. And that’s assuming economic development and international cooperation go the right way to make that happen (which seems doubtful). Realistically, the world will contain many millions of people whose lives are improving dramatically even as millions of others are suffering in new ways. Same as it ever was.
- bwestergard 3y agoHuman beings are just one species in the many ecosystems that make up the planet's biosphere. We cannot exist without those other species. Our understanding of the interconnections is extremely poor (see: "Half Earth" by E.O. Wilson). We are on track to change the climate so abruptly that the species we depend on will not adapt quickly enough. Jellyfish, for example, might thrive. Large mammals like ourselves will not. Let me reiterate: If these other forms of life go extinct, homo sapiens will go extinct. What point is there in air conditioning if agricultural yields plummet over a huge portion of the earth's surface? Consider birds for a moment, because they are familiar to most people and widespread. Bird populations have decline by a third during my father's lifetime. This is a multi-factor problem, but we know climate change and sea level rise leads to excess migratory bird mortality. For more, see: https://wwnorton.com/books/9780393608908 https://wwnorton.com/books/9780393608908
- gwright 3y ago> We are on track to change the climate so abruptly that the species we depend on will not adapt quickly enough. Jellyfish, for example, might thrive. Large mammals like ourselves will not. The notion that humans, as a species, will not adapt seems farfetched to me. Humans have perpetuated themselves in a wide variety of climates for thousands of years. I don't say that to discredit concerns about environmental change, its impact on future populations, or its near term impact on existing individuals. All I'm saying is that arguments based on existential threats are not persuasive to me and they tend to be used to assert power over others than to mitigate risk or improve the lives of people on the earth today.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- stevenwoo 3y agoThere was a Radiolab podcast two weeks ago that covered how tree ring width patterns could be decoded to match hurricane season intensity and this was matched to sun spot activity. They pinpoint a lull that allowed sugar to become a cash crop in Caribbean, allow chattel slavery and later piracy to flourish and noted that right now is a similar inflection point for an end to a lull and start of worse weather via the sun’s cyclical activities. We’ve only just begun.
- gwright 3y ago[flagged]
- stevenwoo 3y agoSorry, I meant that the implication is human induced changes causing bigger swings in extremes will be pushed a little further by the natural cycles of the sun that is the baseline perturbing the weather - we are exiting a relative lull and like a pendulum that is pushed a little bit further, the swings in weather will be even more extreme than predicted.
- kyleblarson 3y ago[flagged]
- PartiallyTyped 3y agoWith all due respect, read some research on weather science.
- freedude 3y agoDo you think they don't believe what they are saying? They seem pretty convincing.
- pc86 3y agoI think they're pointing out the disconnect between espousing the idea that we're on the verge of rapid, irrevocable, global calamity on one hand, and both directly contributing to that and buying beachfront property. It's easy to see why someone already predisposed to believe misinformation around science might look at that assume that it's all a scam of one form or another.
- freedude 3y agoAs AnimalMuppet said actions speak louder than words. “Your actions speak so loudly, I can not hear what you are saying.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson
- AnimalMuppet 3y agoA quote I heard just today: "I see better than I hear." That is, show me by your actions. If the words don't match the actions, I'll believe the actions. (The quote was from T. J. Houshmandzadeh.)
- Timon3 3y agoIf you use this logic to "disprove the elites", could you answer the question I posed to GP? Why do you think the elites care about their properties? Why wouldn't they buy them to get another good 10, 20, 30 years out of them before it's too late?
- froggychairs 3y agoWe are not doomed. The climate is changing but we can still adapt. We can still lower emissions. We can still remove GHG from the atmosphere Doomerism is an awful mindset to have. It’s difficult to feel this way but there’s still a lot of hope and a lot of amazing people working on this. There is certainly lots of pain ahead. My home nation will be underwater by 2100s, lots of animal species will go extinct, but we are not doomed.
- susanasj 3y agoah I think even that is a bit pessimistic. I'm optimistic that we can figure out carbon sequestration and transition to renewables in the next few decades and prevent any catastrophic sea level rise. I fully admit that the global North will not give a shit if some peripheral nations are destroyed by climate change, but I think this summer is starting to show people living in Vegas and Phoenix that their days there are numbered if we don't do something. Maybe I'm being optimistic though.
- axus 3y agoThe recent news that Greenland was ice-free at +1.5C has increased my pessimism again.
- susanasj 3y agoyeah I think it's becoming clear that stopping emissions isn't enough and we will have to do carbon capture but Iceland has a functional carbon removal plant up and running and Exxon apparently sees it as part of their economic future. Lots of bad news out there and we need to accelerate the pace but optimism gives us energy for pushing the political front. https://www.semafor.com/article/07/21/2023/exxon-carbon-denbury https://www.semafor.com/article/07/21/2023/exxon-carbon-denb...
- sillywalk 3y agoThe Iceland plant will pull 4000 metric tons of CO2 / year, so my toilet-paper math says we're going to need at least 9 million more of these plants to achieve net zero.
- paulcole 3y agoYes, but the good news is that the majority of people reading this are both old enough and rich enough to be insulated from the worst effects during their lifetimes. This makes it very easy for them to say, “No we’re not doomed, the smartest people are working on this and will figure it out.” Once they do that they can go on living their lives without really caring about whether we are doomed or not.
- fluoridation 3y agoI mean, we're all going to die and humanity is going to go extinct. One climate or another doesn't have much bearing on either fact.
- danielovichdk 3y agoYes
- vixen99 3y ago48 degrees - the temperature record for Europe set in Greece in 1977 at least until any current records are confirmed.
- csomar 3y agoIt’s worth reminding this is at midnight. Many parts of the worlds are hitting 48 and 50+ temperatures these days.
- fuzztester 3y agoKerala had 50 degrees C a few years ago. Kerala! the state they call "God's own country" in tourism ads. It is anyway a hot state, being right down south in India, but 50 was crazy. Then what will hell be like, I wonder. Edit: And Kerala also had abnormally disastrous floods around the same period, +/- a few years. Some people got leptospirosis. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leptospirosis https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leptospirosis >It is estimated that one million severe cases of leptospirosis in humans occur every year, causing about 58,900 deaths.[11] The disease is most common in tropical areas of the world but may occur anywhere.[7] Outbreaks may arise after heavy rainfall.[7]
- layer8 3y agoPakistan recorded 54°C several times over the past few years.
- fuzztester 3y agoShit. I heard from someone who had been there, that Gulf countries such as Dubai routinely touch 50 or more.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- brrtbrrt 3y ago[flagged]
- mekal 3y agoAnd here's a little extra for those that are about to walk away thinking a meaningful record was set: 1. "But before we get ahead of ourselves, it hasn’t quite been confirmed yet. These claims of record-breaking heat are based on preliminary readings that will soon be subject to further analysis." 2. "That being said, it’s also important to remember that statistics on maximum nighttime temperature simply aren’t kept, and hourly temperature data has only been kept for about a decade or so. The record may still stand, but it also may not have much to be compared to."
- nathancahill 3y agoThe low would be more interesting than the midnight temp. Low would be around 4-5am.
- brucethemoose2 3y agoTo be fair, all the cars I got in the ad were EVs
- happytiger 3y agoThey do operate most efficiently in warmer temperatures — to be fair.
- bcrosby95 3y agoUp to a point. At 120F you're performing pretty poorly.
- happytiger 3y agoI definitely am performing poorly at 120F, but it’s probably a lower temperature than that to be honest.
- yowlingcat 3y agoHow close is this to the max wet bulb temperature? I remember reading about temperatures hitting close to or beyond that in Pakistan a while back but that accounts for humidity and so it may not be as close given how arid Death Valley is.
- boringg 3y agoHey what about the hottest 10 PM ?
- zgluck 3y agoI'll bet you $10 that the hottest 10 PM will happen after the hottest 5 AM on record.
- ActorNightly 3y ago[flagged]
- vegetablepotpie 3y agoThe planet is heating and you’re asking how you can profit from this? Research companies and buy shares. Don’t limit your self to AC companies either, lots of opportunities abound, look at renewable energy build out, mineral exploration. deep sea mining, and I feel like defense companies are going to see more growth too. Climate change will shrink the pie, but you can have a larger share of it.
- Kye 3y agoConsidering how well someone survives the coming decades depends on how wealthy they are (more than in the past), it makes sense. It is a little callous of them, but sometimes survival and being nice are at odds.
- voisin 3y agoMerely surviving is different from being happy you survived. I am not sure it will feel like much of a victory when you survive to bake in intense heat every summer and breath smoke filled air, or lose your mansion to a hurricane or tornado. This whole mindset of “at least I profited” seems to rely on the notion that there is somewhere on the planet that will still be safe and enjoyable to live in as the climate apocalypse settles in. I don’t see where that is.
- selestify 3y agoThere may not be an enjoyable place to live on earth when the climate apocalypse hits, but at least having more money will mean less personal suffering for yourself. Given how unlikely that the world will actually get its act together to prevent such an apocalypse from happening, you might as well assume it’s going to happen anyways and prepare accordingly
- 3y ago
- Tepix 3y ago120 F = 48.8889°C
- alde 3y agoThank you
- mkskm 3y agoDirect link: https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/a44580915/death-valley-hottest-midnight-ever/ https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/a445809...
- pengaru 3y agoFor those who don't know anything about it, Death Valley is a unique edge case for summer air temps largely due to its geography: > The depth and shape of Death Valley influence its summer temperatures. > The valley is a long, narrow basin 282 feet (86 m) below sea level, yet is > walled by high, steep mountain ranges. The clear, dry air and sparse plant > cover allow sunlight to heat the desert surface. Heat radiates back from the > rocks and soil, then becomes trapped in the valley's depths. Summer nights > provide little relief as overnight lows may only dip into the 85°F to 95°F > (30°C to 35°C) range. Heated air rises, cools before it can rise over the > valley's mountain walls, and is recycled back down to the valley floor. These > pockets of descending air are only slightly cooler than the surrounding hot > air. As they descend, they are compressed and heated even more by the low > elevation air pressure. These moving masses of super heated air blow through > the valley, creating extreme high temperatures. [0] Any number of random variables can have an amplified effect on temperature by what's described above... [0] https://www.nps.gov/deva/learn/nature/weather-and-climate.htm https://www.nps.gov/deva/learn/nature/weather-and-climate.ht...
- bloak 3y agoOf course, the definition of "hottest midnight" depends on time zone arbitrariness, unless they mean local astronomical midnight, which I doubt. (The definition of "hottest day" hardly depends on time zones in practice because the hottest time is very unlikely to be around the middle of the night. Perhaps they should have instead looked for the highest of the lowest temperatures reached between consecutive noons.)
- pc86 3y agoWon't this vary by less than an hour? Seems like a distinction without a difference to me.
- bloak 3y agoOf course this is just pedantry, but if you wanted to compare different places on Earth then the difference between civil midnight and solar midnight can be a lot more than one hour. China has a single time zone, for example, so solar noon in China can be anywhere between 11:27 and 15:10 (https://www.timeanddate.com/time/china/one-time-zone.html https://www.timeanddate.com/time/china/one-time-zone.html).
- Slava_Propanei 3y ago[dead]
- lnwlebjel 3y agoOne of my favorite things to do when the news is all about heat waves is monitor the weather at Furnace Creek, Death Valley: https://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?lat=36.44802000000004&lon=-116.86578999999995 https://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?lat=36.44802000000... The forecasted high on Saturday is 126°F.
- quirk 3y ago[flagged]
- paulcole 3y agoHow did people manage 55M years ago when it was 73F and 500M years ago when it was 80-90F?
- pc86 3y agoI think I know what you're trying to point out, but just for anyone who doesn't get it - humanity has been around for about 200,000 years.
- nciik 3y agoGuess I can help most people outside US reading these unfamiliar strange numbers; Earth first avg temp: 22,78c Then 26,67c, “even” 32,22c. Todays avg: 15,56c.
- isoprophlex 3y agoWell... I'm alive now, not 55M years ago.
- timeon 3y agoHow is this relevant?
- quirk 3y ago"Dumb" life has survived and flourished on Earth at much higher global temperatures. Smart life (humans) should certainly be able to figure it out.
- nonameiguess 3y agoIf you're gonna dig into the geological record, the Hadean eon was hot enough that rock at the Earth's crust was still entirely molten.
- tedmcory77 3y agoI'm a Florida native and have paced at Badwater. I think it was around 110F when we were in furnace creek in 2015; it was like being in a convection oven with the wind blowing. I can't fathom another 10 degrees while the sun is gone.
- paulcole 3y agoAlso a Florida native (grew up near Jacksonville — the swampy part not the beach part — WITHOUT air conditioning). I lived through the PNW heat dome a few years ago (also without air conditioning). 110+ all day long and 80+ at night was as close to hell as I’ve ever been. I’ve never been so glad to be 40 years old with a chronic illness as I am today. Good luck to anyone who’s going to be alive in 75+ years.
- godshatter 3y agoI'm a PNW native and made it through the heat dome. I had an old window unit AC in the bedroom that made it much more tolerable, though the walls in the rest of the house were hot to the touch (I had a terrible roof at the time). The entire time the scenario of everyone maxing out their AC and the power going out, though, plagued me to the point that I spent most of my time out of the bedroom, trying to make sure I would acclimatize a bit in case that happened. I think we can survive more than we think we can, but I really don't want to put that to the test. I did have some food around that didn't need refrigeration just in case. Next time I'll make sure I have some water squirreled away just in case the water goes out too for some reason.
- jcranmer 3y agoThere is a little bit of a misleading in the headline here. Even if 120°F was the temperature at midnight, the actual low for that night was 103°F. That itself is not even the highest low recorded in Death Valley, which Wikipedia reports to be 110°F.
- postalrat 3y agoDo you like new records or not?
- happytiger 3y agoI detest this kind of nonsensical sensationalism in the press. So what? It’s not a meaningful metric or temperature.
- timeon 3y ago> I detest It was recorder. It was reported. Not sure why they put it like this but why are you so emotional about that?
- happytiger 3y ago“I detest bad journalism” is now overly emotional? Where do you get off making someone feel bad about making an emotional statement anyways, even though it wasn’t?
- Galacta7 3y agoHaving read the article, I'm still confused ... are they saying Death Valley in particular had the hottest midnight on record? Or that it was the hottest midnight ever recorded on the planet? The article doesn't make this clear. Both interpretations are bad, but one is more frightening than the other.
- joenathanone 3y agoDeath Valley is considered to be the hottest place on earth by many sources.
- danielovichdk 3y agoFrom a factual point of view based on historic events by mankind - we are doomed. The last 200 years alone we have destroyed each other and the planet. The last 100 has been a catastrophe for he earth. The last 10 years has been curing symptoms. Realistically we are not looking into any bright future whatsoever. No tech is going to save us. Tech brought us here.
- moshun 3y agoTech didn’t bring us here, greedy business practices and decades long misinformation campaigns did that.
- CatWChainsaw 3y ago... that were enabled by tech....
- pvaldes 3y agoSo death valley will need a grid of points with a supply of extra water and shadow to rescue the area and improve our chances of avoiding the expensive collapse in the local plants and ecosystems. This doesn't seem technically complicated, just needs money. Here have a problem with a possible action to take. We only need to find the will.