4 ms·

I'm one of the most skeptical people when it comes to these types of claims. I think the effects are being exaggerated. However, I've recently begun to replace

I'm one of the most skeptical people when it comes to these types of claims. I think the effects are being exaggerated. However, I've recently begun to replace all plastic containers and dishware from my kitchen with stainless steel and glass. Drinks taste better in glass anyways, and steel is a good non-fragile alternative. And I cook in cast iron. It's almost impossible to avoid plastic, and I'm not religious about it, but I figure I'm replacing fragile disposable junk with more robust alternatives anyways.

layoric 3y ago
On the exact same journey as well. Ceramic, glass and cast iron, but still avoiding non-stick coating. My partner has IBD, and various gastro issues. Probably not related, but doing what we can to avoid anything that can make things worse. Still end up nuking plastics though tbh, trying to form better buying + cooking habits, but takes time.
- Dah00n 3y ago
  Can't you just use the ceramic or glass in the microwave?
autoexec 3y ago
Yeah, this is one of those cases where I think it's better to take the cautious route. Now that we know we're ingesting massive amounts of plastics and it's been found in every human organ, and in blood, and in breast milk, etc I think it's probably a good idea to take what steps we can to cut down on it until things are more clear about the harms. Avoiding this exposure will be easy for me, because I was never very comfortable microwaving plastic. I've seen companies lie about their stuff being "microwave safe" too many times. I thought cast iron would be too much work and got a decent carbon steel pan to replace the non-stick crap I was always replacing, and I don't mind the extra care. I'm not sure that cast iron would take any more effort than what I'm doing now.
- chrisco255 3y ago
  Cast iron is not bad at all to clean if you have a chain link steel scrubber (The Lodge sells these, other companies too). Ideally you scrub it when the pan is still warm. If you've let something sit in there that hardens, like cheese, you may have to let it soak in some warm water for a bit and apply elbow grease with the scrubber. You can even fill it with water and set it on the stove to warm the water up a bit to break down anything that's hardened. Most of the foods I cook are basic meats and veggies so it's usually quite easy to clean for those.
  - balls187 3y ago
    I wouldn’t soak a cast iron pan. Just apply a little heat, then use a bamboo/wood spatula to scrape the stuck food, then rinse (if needed) and wipe clean. For me, the biggest problem with Cast iron is the weight. I’m a big guy, with physical strength commensurate to my size, and cast iron pans are cumbersome to deal with. I have a 9” pan that I leave on the stove for daily use, but I don’t want to have cast iron cookware exclusively.
    - bbatha 3y ago
      Carbon steel has much the same cooking properties as cast iron but is like half the weight. You can get a good pan very cheap if you want to try something more wieldy.
    - throwawayiron 3y ago
      >For me, the biggest problem with Cast iron is the weight Seek out better cast iron cookware. For example, Lodge brand stuff is very heavy and poorly balanced. Compare to a Wagner cast iron pan of similar size made a century ago: it is significantly lighter, and well-balanced. I'm sure there must be modern cast iron cookware that can offer the same experience, but probably not new for $30. I have problems with my hands and those heavy Lodge pans are annoying (good value though). My old Wagner stuff is no more cumbersome than my nice stainless steel pans, and, for meats at least, is a pleasure to cook with.
  - deleted 3y ago
Semaphor 3y ago
Same. I have some plastic containers left, but I make sure only cold food goes in there. Otherwise, SS/Glass cups, SS mixing and salad bowls, glass storage containers, SS sieves, ceramic coated pans.
epolanski 3y ago
> I think the effects are being exaggerated. Are they? The article points out that effects of nanoplastics on humans are still unclear.
- XorNot 3y ago
  Unclear means no one's got a plausible mechanism, which for the widespread existence of them being implied is a bit of a problem. They're inert long chain polymers, and amongst other things you need to show bioavailability in the area t you propose would cause damage at sufficient concentrations. In the current case: how efficiently do nanoplastics cross from the digestive system to the blood stream, how long do they persist before being filtered out by the kidneys, do they retain their structure in the blood stream unchanged, is their a lower limit on toxicity. i.e. injecting someone with enough pure water will also damage their organs, exposing kidney cells to silica dust in solution in huge concentration would also kill them but there's no way for it to get there in vivo.
  - Dah00n 3y ago
    But micro plastic have been found in newborns, so why not avoid it until science isn't unclear? Seems to be the smart way but I'm no expert.
    - XorNot 3y ago
      Here's the thing about that: lots of particles have been found in the placenta[1]. In the case of the study that found microplastics[2], they found 12 particles in 4% of the volume. 12 - total. So maybe 300 total particles. In about 600 total grams of placenta. It's difficult to put a scale on how few that actually is. So the issue here is we're not really talking about a unique threat, just a vector of an existing one. In terms of bioactive compounds which could find their way to the placenta, metals and carbonaceous soot are going to be a lot worse then inert plastics (of note: the paper involved notes that the primary possible mechanism is the microplastic acting as a carrier delivering bioactive molecule - not the material itself). It is also worth noting that in the same study, 2 of the studied placental samples showed no microplastic contamination. Which is to say, given the transport mechanism proposed - inhalation of particles - it's quite likely that the medium is not things ingested in the GI tract, but rather airborne contaminants. Which would make a lot more sense, seeing as how if micro or nanoparticles were routingly migrating through the gut, we'd suffer serious problems with bacterial infection, or just dealing with something like soluble fiber (which is essentially a plastic - long chain cellulose - that isn't digested). So the question isn't "why not avoid it?" it's, "are you even avoiding it?" The GI tract is a relatively robust system that's very good at rejecting the external world from it. Whereas your lungs are pretty much a direct link to the blood from the atmosphere. [1] https://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/2020/smd/air-pollution-particles-and-metals-found-in-the-placenta.html https://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/2020/smd/air-pollution-par... [2] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412020322297 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016041202...
chaxor 3y ago
What about the heavy metals that are part of the cast iron and steel though? What about the heavy metals in ceramics? The list is pretty endless, but very specific types of glass (boron silicate or pyrex) and titanium can be good to switch to, as long as you are very careful about not getting lead or uranium glass. Or you could just not buy that lead testing kit or Geiger counter and live in ignorant bliss. People lived without them for quite some time.
- flavius29663 3y ago
  But there isn't lead or other heavy metal in the cast iron itself. If there are heavy metals, they are found in the glazing, so the best thing to do is buy pure cast iron, not glazed cast iron. The same goes for ceramics, but you can't really buy ceramics without glazing, because the ceramic itself is porous - I personally replaced all ceramics with glass and stainless. Just as a single data point, all our kitchenware today is: glass, borosilicate glass, pyrex(the US made ones are not borosilicate), stainless, titanium, cast iron (that we season ourselves), wood (but not bamboo -- too much glue in there), silicone (for mats and mittens). Almost no plastic anywhere.
  - droopyEyelids 3y ago
    Stainless does have problems leeching nickel (and sometimes chromium), especially after being cleaned by an abrasive, or cooking acidic foods, which is common. This happens to an extent to cause allergic reactions in people. Also silicone products are commonly mixed with plastic fillers that have the same issues as normal plastics. Pure platinum cured silicone products are premium products and somewhat rare.
    - flavius29663 3y ago
      It's very hard to stay away from everything that is bad for you...We do use some stainless pots for cooking, because really there is no 100% good alternative: cast iron pots are waay too heavy, ceramic can contain heavy metals in the glazing, glass can explode if not handled properly...and there isn't a pot-like glass option anyway (something you need for a soup or stew). Our cutlery and cooking utensils are stainless, but when possible we use plain wood spoons (not the kind that is glued). Is there a good alternative to stainless for these things? let me know. I am aware of silicone issues, it's usually not in contact with our food.
surge 3y ago
My wife pointed out that the 3 minutes at highest setting they used in this study is not something you'd ever do for baby food. The goal of microwaving it is to simply knock the chill off and get the food/milk up to room-body temp. You wouldn't go further cause baby's are sensitive and you don't want to risk hot spots or burns. This means the food is never heated for much more than 30 seconds at most.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
sizzle 3y ago
To-go food containers are impregnated with plastic lining, leeching all sorts of crap into heated, acidic food.
sizzle 3y ago
Can you cook eggs or stir fry on cast iron? Or should I get ceramic pans? I’m wanting to get rid of my “forever chemical” Teflon coated pans. Anyone knowledgeable please chime in.

layoric 3y ago

On the exact same journey as well. Ceramic, glass and cast iron, but still avoiding non-stick coating. My partner has IBD, and various gastro issues. Probably not related, but doing what we can to avoid anything that can make things worse. Still end up nuking plastics though tbh, trying to form better buying + cooking habits, but takes time.

Dah00n 3y ago
Can't you just use the ceramic or glass in the microwave?

autoexec 3y ago

Yeah, this is one of those cases where I think it's better to take the cautious route. Now that we know we're ingesting massive amounts of plastics and it's been found in every human organ, and in blood, and in breast milk, etc I think it's probably a good idea to take what steps we can to cut down on it until things are more clear about the harms. Avoiding this exposure will be easy for me, because I was never very comfortable microwaving plastic. I've seen companies lie about their stuff being "microwave safe" too many times. I thought cast iron would be too much work and got a decent carbon steel pan to replace the non-stick crap I was always replacing, and I don't mind the extra care. I'm not sure that cast iron would take any more effort than what I'm doing now.

chrisco255 3y ago
Cast iron is not bad at all to clean if you have a chain link steel scrubber (The Lodge sells these, other companies too). Ideally you scrub it when the pan is still warm. If you've let something sit in there that hardens, like cheese, you may have to let it soak in some warm water for a bit and apply elbow grease with the scrubber. You can even fill it with water and set it on the stove to warm the water up a bit to break down anything that's hardened. Most of the foods I cook are basic meats and veggies so it's usually quite easy to clean for those.
- balls187 3y ago
  I wouldn’t soak a cast iron pan. Just apply a little heat, then use a bamboo/wood spatula to scrape the stuck food, then rinse (if needed) and wipe clean. For me, the biggest problem with Cast iron is the weight. I’m a big guy, with physical strength commensurate to my size, and cast iron pans are cumbersome to deal with. I have a 9” pan that I leave on the stove for daily use, but I don’t want to have cast iron cookware exclusively.
  - bbatha 3y ago
    Carbon steel has much the same cooking properties as cast iron but is like half the weight. You can get a good pan very cheap if you want to try something more wieldy.
  - throwawayiron 3y ago
    >For me, the biggest problem with Cast iron is the weight Seek out better cast iron cookware. For example, Lodge brand stuff is very heavy and poorly balanced. Compare to a Wagner cast iron pan of similar size made a century ago: it is significantly lighter, and well-balanced. I'm sure there must be modern cast iron cookware that can offer the same experience, but probably not new for $30. I have problems with my hands and those heavy Lodge pans are annoying (good value though). My old Wagner stuff is no more cumbersome than my nice stainless steel pans, and, for meats at least, is a pleasure to cook with.
- deleted 3y ago

Semaphor 3y ago

Same. I have some plastic containers left, but I make sure only cold food goes in there. Otherwise, SS/Glass cups, SS mixing and salad bowls, glass storage containers, SS sieves, ceramic coated pans.

epolanski 3y ago

> I think the effects are being exaggerated. Are they? The article points out that effects of nanoplastics on humans are still unclear.

XorNot 3y ago
Unclear means no one's got a plausible mechanism, which for the widespread existence of them being implied is a bit of a problem. They're inert long chain polymers, and amongst other things you need to show bioavailability in the area t you propose would cause damage at sufficient concentrations. In the current case: how efficiently do nanoplastics cross from the digestive system to the blood stream, how long do they persist before being filtered out by the kidneys, do they retain their structure in the blood stream unchanged, is their a lower limit on toxicity. i.e. injecting someone with enough pure water will also damage their organs, exposing kidney cells to silica dust in solution in huge concentration would also kill them but there's no way for it to get there in vivo.
- Dah00n 3y ago
  But micro plastic have been found in newborns, so why not avoid it until science isn't unclear? Seems to be the smart way but I'm no expert.
  - XorNot 3y ago
    Here's the thing about that: lots of particles have been found in the placenta[1]. In the case of the study that found microplastics[2], they found 12 particles in 4% of the volume. 12 - total. So maybe 300 total particles. In about 600 total grams of placenta. It's difficult to put a scale on how few that actually is. So the issue here is we're not really talking about a unique threat, just a vector of an existing one. In terms of bioactive compounds which could find their way to the placenta, metals and carbonaceous soot are going to be a lot worse then inert plastics (of note: the paper involved notes that the primary possible mechanism is the microplastic acting as a carrier delivering bioactive molecule - not the material itself). It is also worth noting that in the same study, 2 of the studied placental samples showed no microplastic contamination. Which is to say, given the transport mechanism proposed - inhalation of particles - it's quite likely that the medium is not things ingested in the GI tract, but rather airborne contaminants. Which would make a lot more sense, seeing as how if micro or nanoparticles were routingly migrating through the gut, we'd suffer serious problems with bacterial infection, or just dealing with something like soluble fiber (which is essentially a plastic - long chain cellulose - that isn't digested). So the question isn't "why not avoid it?" it's, "are you even avoiding it?" The GI tract is a relatively robust system that's very good at rejecting the external world from it. Whereas your lungs are pretty much a direct link to the blood from the atmosphere. [1] https://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/2020/smd/air-pollution-particles-and-metals-found-in-the-placenta.html https://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/2020/smd/air-pollution-par... [2] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412020322297 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016041202...

chaxor 3y ago

What about the heavy metals that are part of the cast iron and steel though? What about the heavy metals in ceramics? The list is pretty endless, but very specific types of glass (boron silicate or pyrex) and titanium can be good to switch to, as long as you are very careful about not getting lead or uranium glass. Or you could just not buy that lead testing kit or Geiger counter and live in ignorant bliss. People lived without them for quite some time.

flavius29663 3y ago
But there isn't lead or other heavy metal in the cast iron itself. If there are heavy metals, they are found in the glazing, so the best thing to do is buy pure cast iron, not glazed cast iron. The same goes for ceramics, but you can't really buy ceramics without glazing, because the ceramic itself is porous - I personally replaced all ceramics with glass and stainless. Just as a single data point, all our kitchenware today is: glass, borosilicate glass, pyrex(the US made ones are not borosilicate), stainless, titanium, cast iron (that we season ourselves), wood (but not bamboo -- too much glue in there), silicone (for mats and mittens). Almost no plastic anywhere.
- droopyEyelids 3y ago
  Stainless does have problems leeching nickel (and sometimes chromium), especially after being cleaned by an abrasive, or cooking acidic foods, which is common. This happens to an extent to cause allergic reactions in people. Also silicone products are commonly mixed with plastic fillers that have the same issues as normal plastics. Pure platinum cured silicone products are premium products and somewhat rare.
  - flavius29663 3y ago
    It's very hard to stay away from everything that is bad for you...We do use some stainless pots for cooking, because really there is no 100% good alternative: cast iron pots are waay too heavy, ceramic can contain heavy metals in the glazing, glass can explode if not handled properly...and there isn't a pot-like glass option anyway (something you need for a soup or stew). Our cutlery and cooking utensils are stainless, but when possible we use plain wood spoons (not the kind that is glued). Is there a good alternative to stainless for these things? let me know. I am aware of silicone issues, it's usually not in contact with our food.

surge 3y ago

My wife pointed out that the 3 minutes at highest setting they used in this study is not something you'd ever do for baby food. The goal of microwaving it is to simply knock the chill off and get the food/milk up to room-body temp. You wouldn't go further cause baby's are sensitive and you don't want to risk hot spots or burns. This means the food is never heated for much more than 30 seconds at most.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

sizzle 3y ago

To-go food containers are impregnated with plastic lining, leeching all sorts of crap into heated, acidic food.

sizzle 3y ago

Can you cook eggs or stir fry on cast iron? Or should I get ceramic pans? I’m wanting to get rid of my “forever chemical” Teflon coated pans. Anyone knowledgeable please chime in.