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Freeman Dyson's expansive 1997 interview for "Web of Stories" has his opinions. Starts off around Episode 78 and several subsequent fragments. Dyson describes

Freeman Dyson's expansive 1997 interview for "Web of Stories" has his opinions. Starts off around Episode 78 and several subsequent fragments. Dyson describes a very dogmatic man that resisted what the young people at the time were doing, who didn't even believe in his own (Oppenheimer's) landmark results in black holes, and who needed the limelight (Episode 83). Dyson even says Oppenheimer may have been better off for having had his clearance revoked (Episode 96). Despite all that, he was ready to leave the IAS if Oppenheimer had been fired as its Director (Episode 97). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N44DZJW4LSw&list=PLVV0r6CmEsFzDA6mtmKQEgWfcIu49J4nN&index=78 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N44DZJW4LSw&list=PLVV0r6CmEs...

dralley 3y ago
>who didn't even believe in his own (Oppenheimer's) landmark results in black holes Einstein was famously skeptical and dogmatic about a lot of his own "landmark results", i.e. "God doesn't play dice with the universe", and Feynman was a massive attention ...attractor. He's hardly in bad company if those are the worst criticisms.
- OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
  There's a lot more in that interview. Oppenheimer would not listen to Dyson's QED seminar until Bethe intervened. Dyson's Feynman stories are also very interesting. Gell-Mann settled scores with Feynman and several others on his own Web of Stories session.
  - dralley 3y ago
    The problem is that a lot of these guys, frankly, had quite large egos, and it's not terribly surprising that there would be some butting of heads and factionalism / cliques. I'm not saying he's wrong - but within 30 seconds of the start of your clip Dyson also criticizes Niels Bohr, Max Born, Schrodinger, and Heisenburg in the same breath as Oppenheimer. Parsing out exactly how much to take seriously, and how much is just the outcome of rivalry between a bunch of brilliant people with very strong beliefs, strong personalities, strong egos and the "eccentricity" that often comes with brilliance, being forced to live with each other for years - is a bit difficult. I've seen Gell-Mann's interview too, and I don't find what he said about Feynman very surprising, but at the same time I wouldn't be surprised if others had similar but different complaints about him.
    - OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
      If this cat may look at that king, I have ambivalent feelings about Dyson. But, taken as a whole, I think he is aware of what his own hubris and what it cost him to think the way he did at the time. He is wistful about not talking with Weyl, Einstein, or other Institute Faculty - "A great opportunity lost." Dyson does speak very fondly of many. Feynman, Bethe, Peierls, Besicovich, Morette, Margulis, Max, Singer, and a raft of others. Gell-Mann just seemed angry from start to finish all but accusing Schwinger of improper behavior and ripping Feynman for "collecting anecdotes about himself". Web of Stories talked to (among others) Dyson, Bethe, Knuth, Wheeler, and Gell-Mann and the latter is an outlier in his manner.
      - dralley 3y ago
        In any case Dyson seems to like Bethe quite a bit, and Bethe seems to have rated Oppenheimer highly as a leader at Los Alamos and suggested that was the general opinion https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIlNSgAHv5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIlNSgAHv5c
      - OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
        @dralley - Can't reply to your post re: Dyson and Bethe but that is a masterpiece of understatement! From what I can tell, Bethe was esteemed without being envied. A truly rare accomplishment.
        nerpderp82 3y ago
        You have to click on the text that says "_ minutes ago" and you can reply.
        OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
        Thank you! I appreciate the tip.
    - uwagar 3y ago
      john lilly - floating tank inventor didnt think highly of feynman either.
- somenameforme 3y ago
  As an aside, this is a very common misinterpretation of Einstein's comments. After its discovery, there was a major disagreement about how to interpret quantum mechanics. Bohr, among others, advocated for a view that quantum mechanics was a fundamentally probabilistic phenomena with no direct causal explanation. Einstein vehemently disagreed with this, and felt that the universe was absolutely causal in nature. And the only reason that an explanation that rejected determinism/causality fit so well was due to a lack of research or knowledge. That's the context where many of his most famous comments come from. He was not skeptical of his own results or views, but of others' interpretations. It's the same for "Spooky action at a distance." Einstein had a deeply held belief that the universe was causal and logical, which he held to his death. Incidentally, the probabilistic explanation, "The Copenhagen Interpretation", ultimately 'won.' It's one of the best examples of why equating science with consensus is such an odd view. The greatest physicist of all time held a fringe view on the very topic that he was 'the father' of. His arguing endlessly in support of his view, contrary to the consensus, only made for better science for all. To say nothing of some of the most amazing debates in history, with Einstein and Bohr having numerous live public debates over many years, constantly aiming to one-up each other.
  - staunton 3y ago
    > "The Copenhagen Interpretation", ultimately 'won.' The debates are ongoing and "Copenhagen" (which really isn't a unified and coherent view anyway) is currently losing (among physicists, it will take long to take over in more established areas such as school education or media).
  - goatlover 3y ago
    Won a popularity contest in the past because Bohr was very influential among his peers. But it always left enough physicists dissatisfied to motivate investigation into alternative interpretations, and Many Worlds is one of the interpretations which seems to be gaining followers.
  - hinkley 3y ago
    It interesting that Feynman describes Dirac in sentiments that aren’t far from what you’ve expressed about Einstein. Death, as often as not, saves us from old modes of thinking. If we ever invent immortality, we are in big trouble. That won’t be the last thing we invent, but it will precede the last thing by no more than twenty years. Thirty at the outside.

dralley 3y ago

>who didn't even believe in his own (Oppenheimer's) landmark results in black holes Einstein was famously skeptical and dogmatic about a lot of his own "landmark results", i.e. "God doesn't play dice with the universe", and Feynman was a massive attention ...attractor. He's hardly in bad company if those are the worst criticisms.

OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
There's a lot more in that interview. Oppenheimer would not listen to Dyson's QED seminar until Bethe intervened. Dyson's Feynman stories are also very interesting. Gell-Mann settled scores with Feynman and several others on his own Web of Stories session.
- dralley 3y ago
  The problem is that a lot of these guys, frankly, had quite large egos, and it's not terribly surprising that there would be some butting of heads and factionalism / cliques. I'm not saying he's wrong - but within 30 seconds of the start of your clip Dyson also criticizes Niels Bohr, Max Born, Schrodinger, and Heisenburg in the same breath as Oppenheimer. Parsing out exactly how much to take seriously, and how much is just the outcome of rivalry between a bunch of brilliant people with very strong beliefs, strong personalities, strong egos and the "eccentricity" that often comes with brilliance, being forced to live with each other for years - is a bit difficult. I've seen Gell-Mann's interview too, and I don't find what he said about Feynman very surprising, but at the same time I wouldn't be surprised if others had similar but different complaints about him.
  - OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
    If this cat may look at that king, I have ambivalent feelings about Dyson. But, taken as a whole, I think he is aware of what his own hubris and what it cost him to think the way he did at the time. He is wistful about not talking with Weyl, Einstein, or other Institute Faculty - "A great opportunity lost." Dyson does speak very fondly of many. Feynman, Bethe, Peierls, Besicovich, Morette, Margulis, Max, Singer, and a raft of others. Gell-Mann just seemed angry from start to finish all but accusing Schwinger of improper behavior and ripping Feynman for "collecting anecdotes about himself". Web of Stories talked to (among others) Dyson, Bethe, Knuth, Wheeler, and Gell-Mann and the latter is an outlier in his manner.
    - dralley 3y ago
      In any case Dyson seems to like Bethe quite a bit, and Bethe seems to have rated Oppenheimer highly as a leader at Los Alamos and suggested that was the general opinion https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIlNSgAHv5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIlNSgAHv5c
    - OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
      @dralley - Can't reply to your post re: Dyson and Bethe but that is a masterpiece of understatement! From what I can tell, Bethe was esteemed without being envied. A truly rare accomplishment.
      - nerpderp82 3y ago
        You have to click on the text that says "_ minutes ago" and you can reply.
        OldGuyInTheClub 3y ago
        Thank you! I appreciate the tip.
  - uwagar 3y ago
    john lilly - floating tank inventor didnt think highly of feynman either.
somenameforme 3y ago
As an aside, this is a very common misinterpretation of Einstein's comments. After its discovery, there was a major disagreement about how to interpret quantum mechanics. Bohr, among others, advocated for a view that quantum mechanics was a fundamentally probabilistic phenomena with no direct causal explanation. Einstein vehemently disagreed with this, and felt that the universe was absolutely causal in nature. And the only reason that an explanation that rejected determinism/causality fit so well was due to a lack of research or knowledge. That's the context where many of his most famous comments come from. He was not skeptical of his own results or views, but of others' interpretations. It's the same for "Spooky action at a distance." Einstein had a deeply held belief that the universe was causal and logical, which he held to his death. Incidentally, the probabilistic explanation, "The Copenhagen Interpretation", ultimately 'won.' It's one of the best examples of why equating science with consensus is such an odd view. The greatest physicist of all time held a fringe view on the very topic that he was 'the father' of. His arguing endlessly in support of his view, contrary to the consensus, only made for better science for all. To say nothing of some of the most amazing debates in history, with Einstein and Bohr having numerous live public debates over many years, constantly aiming to one-up each other.
- staunton 3y ago
  > "The Copenhagen Interpretation", ultimately 'won.' The debates are ongoing and "Copenhagen" (which really isn't a unified and coherent view anyway) is currently losing (among physicists, it will take long to take over in more established areas such as school education or media).
- goatlover 3y ago
  Won a popularity contest in the past because Bohr was very influential among his peers. But it always left enough physicists dissatisfied to motivate investigation into alternative interpretations, and Many Worlds is one of the interpretations which seems to be gaining followers.
- hinkley 3y ago
  It interesting that Feynman describes Dirac in sentiments that aren’t far from what you’ve expressed about Einstein. Death, as often as not, saves us from old modes of thinking. If we ever invent immortality, we are in big trouble. That won’t be the last thing we invent, but it will precede the last thing by no more than twenty years. Thirty at the outside.