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There was also a lot of social commentary on it. Particularly striking is this spoken word piece: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_on_the_Moon https://en.w

There was also a lot of social commentary on it. Particularly striking is this spoken word piece: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_on_the_Moon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_on_the_Moon

earthboundkid 3y ago
Auden: https://allpoetry.com/moon-landing https://allpoetry.com/moon-landing
germinalphrase 3y ago
Link to performance by Gil Scott-Heron: https://youtu.be/goh2x_G0ct4 https://youtu.be/goh2x_G0ct4
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
csours 3y ago
The first time I heard Whitey On The Moon, I had a strong feeling that we don't all live in the same world, even while we share the same planet. As a counterpoint, there's Home on Lagrange: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRns6u5bHuw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRns6u5bHuw Oh, give me a locus where the gravitons focus Where the three-body problem is solved, Where the microwaves play down at three degrees K, And the cold virus never evolved. (chorus) We eat algea pie, our vacuum is high, Our ball bearings are perfectly round. Our horizon is curved, our warheads are MIRVed, And a kilogram weighs half a pound. (chorus) If we run out of space for our burgeoning race No more Lebensraum left for the Mensch When we're ready to start, we can take Mars apart, If we just find a big enough wrench. (chorus) I'm sick of this place, it's just McDonald's in space, And living up here is a bore. Tell the shiggies, "Don't cry," they can kiss me goodbye 'Cause I'm moving next week to L4! (chorus) CHORUS: Home, home on LaGrange, Where the space debris always collects, We possess, so it seems, two of Man's greatest dreams: Solar power and zero-gee sex. --Home on Lagrange (The L5 Song) © 1978 by William S. Higgins and Barry D. Gehm http://www.jamesoberg.com/humor.html http://www.jamesoberg.com/humor.html
- krapp 3y ago
  > The first time I heard Whitey On The Moon, I had a strong feeling that we don't all live in the same world, even while we share the same planet. I think that was the point. White Americans and Black Americans weren't living in the same world in the 1960s. And you're not providing a counterpoint, you're answering a community's outrage at the literal interplanetary scale gulf of racial inequality (the US was still dealing with desegregation at the time) with twee nerd humor.
  - csours 3y ago
    It's nerd humor and nerd aspiration. It's a novelty song, but it shows what people want.
    - krapp 3y ago
      It shows what some people want, and what at the time only white people could aspire to. The criticism that the space program came at a social and economic cost that primarily burdened black Americans while only reinforcing the narrative of white supremacy and racial inequality seems legitimate. The Wikipedia article links to a paper that quotes MLK on the matter: Today our exploration of space is engaging not only our enthusiasm but our patriotism. ... No such fervor or exhilaration attends the war on poverty. ... Without denying the value of scientific endeavor, there is a striking absurdity in committing billions to reach the moon where no people live, while only a fraction of that amount is appropriated to service the densely populated slums. If these strange views persist, in a few years we can be assured that when we set a man on the moon, with an adequate telescope he will be able to see the slums on earth with their intensified congestion, decay and turbulence. I mean yeah, why should black people have given a damn about the moon landing when American society was still permeated by the remnant effects of slavery in many places?
topspin 3y ago
All the grievances of Whitey on the Moon can be, and regularly are, offered today. Yet Whitey hasn't been to the Moon in 50 years. It's almost as if one has nothing to do with the other.
- rhcom2 3y ago
  Or maybe those grievances have never been sufficiently addressed.
  - topspin 3y ago
    Perhaps. Now all that's left to you is to define "address." I suspect what you come up with would be entirely orthogonal to the US space program. I know you could snatch every cent of treasure spent on Apollo and use it in any conceivable manner on Whitey on the Moon grievances and the needle wouldn't move one iota: the engrieved will sing it still.
    - rhcom2 3y ago
      "Address" would be have a serious discussion about the priorities - both fiscally and socially - of the United States. In a sense you're right that the US Space Program is a drop in the bucket compared to other spending but Gil Scott-Heron's poem was never a financial proposal. It was trying to express a sentiment that the US government's priorities were messed up, something that still resonates today.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
decremental 3y ago
[dead]
yesco 3y ago
As someone who considers the moon landing to be mankind's greatest achievement, this poem has only ever inspired dark feelings within me. The attitude that we have to choose between social services or humanity's future, that we can't do both, that space travel is pointless because we haven't "fixed all the problems at home yet", is pure entitlement, it's selfish and it's wrong. This poem is certainly good at getting it's message across, but that message is racist degenerative trash.
- sangnoir 3y ago
  How is it racist? Is "whitey" a slur? Or perhaps a poem written in 1969 highlighting that obvious fact that Apollo astronauts were all white is the real racism?
  - yesco 3y ago
    The moon landing transcends race, it inspired people, humans, worldwide. This poem diminishes it into some white exclusive eccentricity. Sure, perhaps a black person should have been among the first involved, I can certainly get behind that criticism. But that's not what the poem critiques, and it's not what activists who protested the moon landing asked for either. So yes it's racist, the real kind.
    - sangnoir 3y ago
      > The moon landing transcends race Perhaps aspirationally, but empirically, the Apollo program did not transcend race. It's not racist to call out racism - the "He who smelt it, dealt it" defense is intellectually lazy. > But that's not what the poem critiques, I don't see how you can say that, when the poem is literally titled "Whitey on the Moon". One would have to assume the decision to highlight whiteness was deliberate - it easily could have been "Neil on the Moon" or "Man on the Moon" if the author/perfomer so desired.
      - yesco 3y ago
        > Perhaps aspirationally, but empirically, the Apollo program did not transcend race. It's not racist to call out racism You are wrong. I'm unwilling to debate this fact with you, or even discuss the matter any further frankly, I have made my position clear. Your interpretation of the poem shows a clear lack of understanding on the historical context surrounding it.

There was also a lot of social commentary on it. Particularly striking is this spoken word piece: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_on_the_Moon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_on_the_Moon

earthboundkid 3y ago

Auden: https://allpoetry.com/moon-landing https://allpoetry.com/moon-landing

germinalphrase 3y ago

Link to performance by Gil Scott-Heron: https://youtu.be/goh2x_G0ct4 https://youtu.be/goh2x_G0ct4

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

csours 3y ago

The first time I heard Whitey On The Moon, I had a strong feeling that we don't all live in the same world, even while we share the same planet. As a counterpoint, there's Home on Lagrange: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRns6u5bHuw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRns6u5bHuw Oh, give me a locus where the gravitons focus Where the three-body problem is solved, Where the microwaves play down at three degrees K, And the cold virus never evolved. (chorus) We eat algea pie, our vacuum is high, Our ball bearings are perfectly round. Our horizon is curved, our warheads are MIRVed, And a kilogram weighs half a pound. (chorus) If we run out of space for our burgeoning race No more Lebensraum left for the Mensch When we're ready to start, we can take Mars apart, If we just find a big enough wrench. (chorus) I'm sick of this place, it's just McDonald's in space, And living up here is a bore. Tell the shiggies, "Don't cry," they can kiss me goodbye 'Cause I'm moving next week to L4! (chorus) CHORUS: Home, home on LaGrange, Where the space debris always collects, We possess, so it seems, two of Man's greatest dreams: Solar power and zero-gee sex. --Home on Lagrange (The L5 Song) © 1978 by William S. Higgins and Barry D. Gehm http://www.jamesoberg.com/humor.html http://www.jamesoberg.com/humor.html

krapp 3y ago
> The first time I heard Whitey On The Moon, I had a strong feeling that we don't all live in the same world, even while we share the same planet. I think that was the point. White Americans and Black Americans weren't living in the same world in the 1960s. And you're not providing a counterpoint, you're answering a community's outrage at the literal interplanetary scale gulf of racial inequality (the US was still dealing with desegregation at the time) with twee nerd humor.
- csours 3y ago
  It's nerd humor and nerd aspiration. It's a novelty song, but it shows what people want.
  - krapp 3y ago
    It shows what some people want, and what at the time only white people could aspire to. The criticism that the space program came at a social and economic cost that primarily burdened black Americans while only reinforcing the narrative of white supremacy and racial inequality seems legitimate. The Wikipedia article links to a paper that quotes MLK on the matter: Today our exploration of space is engaging not only our enthusiasm but our patriotism. ... No such fervor or exhilaration attends the war on poverty. ... Without denying the value of scientific endeavor, there is a striking absurdity in committing billions to reach the moon where no people live, while only a fraction of that amount is appropriated to service the densely populated slums. If these strange views persist, in a few years we can be assured that when we set a man on the moon, with an adequate telescope he will be able to see the slums on earth with their intensified congestion, decay and turbulence. I mean yeah, why should black people have given a damn about the moon landing when American society was still permeated by the remnant effects of slavery in many places?

topspin 3y ago

All the grievances of Whitey on the Moon can be, and regularly are, offered today. Yet Whitey hasn't been to the Moon in 50 years. It's almost as if one has nothing to do with the other.

rhcom2 3y ago
Or maybe those grievances have never been sufficiently addressed.
- topspin 3y ago
  Perhaps. Now all that's left to you is to define "address." I suspect what you come up with would be entirely orthogonal to the US space program. I know you could snatch every cent of treasure spent on Apollo and use it in any conceivable manner on Whitey on the Moon grievances and the needle wouldn't move one iota: the engrieved will sing it still.
  - rhcom2 3y ago
    "Address" would be have a serious discussion about the priorities - both fiscally and socially - of the United States. In a sense you're right that the US Space Program is a drop in the bucket compared to other spending but Gil Scott-Heron's poem was never a financial proposal. It was trying to express a sentiment that the US government's priorities were messed up, something that still resonates today.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

decremental 3y ago

[dead]

yesco 3y ago

As someone who considers the moon landing to be mankind's greatest achievement, this poem has only ever inspired dark feelings within me. The attitude that we have to choose between social services or humanity's future, that we can't do both, that space travel is pointless because we haven't "fixed all the problems at home yet", is pure entitlement, it's selfish and it's wrong. This poem is certainly good at getting it's message across, but that message is racist degenerative trash.

sangnoir 3y ago
How is it racist? Is "whitey" a slur? Or perhaps a poem written in 1969 highlighting that obvious fact that Apollo astronauts were all white is the real racism?
- yesco 3y ago
  The moon landing transcends race, it inspired people, humans, worldwide. This poem diminishes it into some white exclusive eccentricity. Sure, perhaps a black person should have been among the first involved, I can certainly get behind that criticism. But that's not what the poem critiques, and it's not what activists who protested the moon landing asked for either. So yes it's racist, the real kind.
  - sangnoir 3y ago
    > The moon landing transcends race Perhaps aspirationally, but empirically, the Apollo program did not transcend race. It's not racist to call out racism - the "He who smelt it, dealt it" defense is intellectually lazy. > But that's not what the poem critiques, I don't see how you can say that, when the poem is literally titled "Whitey on the Moon". One would have to assume the decision to highlight whiteness was deliberate - it easily could have been "Neil on the Moon" or "Man on the Moon" if the author/perfomer so desired.
    - yesco 3y ago
      > Perhaps aspirationally, but empirically, the Apollo program did not transcend race. It's not racist to call out racism You are wrong. I'm unwilling to debate this fact with you, or even discuss the matter any further frankly, I have made my position clear. Your interpretation of the poem shows a clear lack of understanding on the historical context surrounding it.