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If you are interested in this topic but would like to understand how historians think about things, look into writing about Historiography and Historical Memory

If you are interested in this topic but would like to understand how historians think about things, look into writing about Historiography and Historical Memory. This person appears to just be some guy who describes himself as an entrepreneur and TED speaker. The way we understand the past is a deep topic that is analyzed and discussed by actual professionals constantly. Better to read their writing than this kind of stuff, IMO.

sanderjd 3y ago
This comment reminds me a lot of XKCD "Ten Thousand" (https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/). You don't need to denigrate the author's credibility to write about their personal experience and insight from it in order to provide a reference to the much deeper field of study on this to those who are interested. Personally, I had heard of "historiography" but had no idea this is what it meant. And now I do! And that wouldn't have happened today if this author hadn't published their little anecdote.
- UncleMeat 3y ago
  I'm less denigrating the author and more encouraging people who found this idea interesting to seek out experts. I'm glad that this person is thinking about this topic. I also see a frankly huge number of absolute amateurs having their ideas about history distributed all over the world while professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively.
  - sanderjd 3y ago
    I think you're doing both things. And I applaud you for the encouragement and useful information! I also don't begrudge you your frustration about this. But I also find the "ten thousand" idea to be a useful re-framing of how to respond to this phenomenon where something seems obvious to you because you know all about it, but it's actually not obvious to most people at all. Maybe you'll find this to be a useful re-framing too, I dunno. I will push back a bit on "professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively". I don't think that's really true. In my experience, it seems like most professionals and academics prefer to write and speak within their own bubbles. Some few make a concerted effort to communicate effectively to the masses, but more often they look down their noses at the kinds of communication that entails. For instance, my interpretation of your "TED speaker" comment is that TED talks are not a suitable way to communicate about this topic. But a compelling TED talk or blog post or op-ed in a mainstream publication would be a great way for a professional to communicate about this with a large audience. I think this has a lot to do with the way academia is set up. "Publish or perish" provides little incentive structure for effectively communicating your work for amateurs. Or in more concrete terms: What professionals do you know of in this field who are out there doing everything they can to communicate effectively about this to a non-professional non-academic audience? What is it that they're doing?
    - UncleMeat 3y ago
      > I will push back a bit on "professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively". I don't think that's really true. For personal reasons, I am very good friends with an unusually large number of history faculty. I do not agree with your assessment at all. My experience is that historians are desperately trying to communicate their expertise in the face of an increasingly hostile culture that either does not value their expertise or considers them to be propagandists. Public History in particular is having a renaissance right now and Digital History (which is often tightly associated with widespread distribution of tools and interactive systems) is comparatively well funded. History doesn't have the same "publish or perish" model as say CS because individual journal articles don't actually provide much professional clout. You do have the publish the book (which are increasingly distributed open-access) but there is ample time for communication with laypeople (and teaching).
      - sanderjd 3y ago
        What are that trying? My last paragraph was intended as a call for examples, links, books, blogs, newsletters, YouTube channels, whatever! If they are trying to communicate to an amateur but interested audience, here's your chance to help them reach that audience.
- rTX5CMRXIfFG 3y ago
  The author’s claim “history is not true” is a huge one and it’s reasonable to look up his background to understand where he might be coming from. Unfortunately for him (the author) he’s not coming from an expert’s position, and whatever perceptions that creates in people is not fault of the commenter you’re replying to.

sanderjd 3y ago

This comment reminds me a lot of XKCD "Ten Thousand" (https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/). You don't need to denigrate the author's credibility to write about their personal experience and insight from it in order to provide a reference to the much deeper field of study on this to those who are interested. Personally, I had heard of "historiography" but had no idea this is what it meant. And now I do! And that wouldn't have happened today if this author hadn't published their little anecdote.

UncleMeat 3y ago
I'm less denigrating the author and more encouraging people who found this idea interesting to seek out experts. I'm glad that this person is thinking about this topic. I also see a frankly huge number of absolute amateurs having their ideas about history distributed all over the world while professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively.
- sanderjd 3y ago
  I think you're doing both things. And I applaud you for the encouragement and useful information! I also don't begrudge you your frustration about this. But I also find the "ten thousand" idea to be a useful re-framing of how to respond to this phenomenon where something seems obvious to you because you know all about it, but it's actually not obvious to most people at all. Maybe you'll find this to be a useful re-framing too, I dunno. I will push back a bit on "professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively". I don't think that's really true. In my experience, it seems like most professionals and academics prefer to write and speak within their own bubbles. Some few make a concerted effort to communicate effectively to the masses, but more often they look down their noses at the kinds of communication that entails. For instance, my interpretation of your "TED speaker" comment is that TED talks are not a suitable way to communicate about this topic. But a compelling TED talk or blog post or op-ed in a mainstream publication would be a great way for a professional to communicate about this with a large audience. I think this has a lot to do with the way academia is set up. "Publish or perish" provides little incentive structure for effectively communicating your work for amateurs. Or in more concrete terms: What professionals do you know of in this field who are out there doing everything they can to communicate effectively about this to a non-professional non-academic audience? What is it that they're doing?
  - UncleMeat 3y ago
    > I will push back a bit on "professionals are doing everything they can to communicate effectively". I don't think that's really true. For personal reasons, I am very good friends with an unusually large number of history faculty. I do not agree with your assessment at all. My experience is that historians are desperately trying to communicate their expertise in the face of an increasingly hostile culture that either does not value their expertise or considers them to be propagandists. Public History in particular is having a renaissance right now and Digital History (which is often tightly associated with widespread distribution of tools and interactive systems) is comparatively well funded. History doesn't have the same "publish or perish" model as say CS because individual journal articles don't actually provide much professional clout. You do have the publish the book (which are increasingly distributed open-access) but there is ample time for communication with laypeople (and teaching).
    - sanderjd 3y ago
      What are that trying? My last paragraph was intended as a call for examples, links, books, blogs, newsletters, YouTube channels, whatever! If they are trying to communicate to an amateur but interested audience, here's your chance to help them reach that audience.
rTX5CMRXIfFG 3y ago
The author’s claim “history is not true” is a huge one and it’s reasonable to look up his background to understand where he might be coming from. Unfortunately for him (the author) he’s not coming from an expert’s position, and whatever perceptions that creates in people is not fault of the commenter you’re replying to.