5 ms·

Basically everything I was doing came to a grinding halt for 45 minutes because I live in Latin America, where your entire life runs on WhatsApp. It's infuriat

Basically everything I was doing came to a grinding halt for 45 minutes because I live in Latin America, where your entire life runs on WhatsApp. It's infuriating because nobody will consider any other messaging app. My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month.

seany 3y ago
> My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month. Meta is surely compensating them in some form
- DanitaBaires 3y ago
  It has been like that before Meta.
- toast0 3y ago
  I worked on carrier partnerships (among many other things) while I was at WhatsApp, from before FB through 2019. Carriers wanted to setup special pricing (including zero-rating) for WhatsApp with or without our help or approval. Before acquisition, the only compensation we provided was approval to use our brand (which we didn't have resources to litigate around the world over anyway), our list of IPs (and notifications when they changed), and maybe a little bit of guidance/support on how to identify traffic; although from conversations I had, the DPI vendors had ways of doing it anyway without our help. In return, WA got some amount of marketing, and sometimes access to zero cost SMS (used for registration). Additionally, by participating with carriers, rather than letting them do their own thing, we were able to influence them towards providing a good experience for users; WA did not approve of text only special pricing[1], it had to include attachments, and we did our best to keep carriers updated on IPs to reduce the amount of miscategorized usage leading to overage or connectivity problems. To my knowledge, there was only one deal with monetary compensation, but it theoretically flowed to WA, not to the carrier. My understanding is the carriers wanted to run these deals because they attract customers who often convert to full internet plans. Messaging is nice, but customers eventually get outside links and want to experience the web or other applications. Post acquisition, deals moved into Facebook's mobile partner portal, and afaik, there was still no compensation for WhatsApp deals, but the MPP does also offer analytics (audience insights) to carriers, and I'm not sure if it's a requirement to have a special pricing deal to get that or not. It's been several years, so it's possible the program has changed. [1] If you've seen that on planes, it wasn't authorized when I was there, and I don't think it's authorized now, but it doesn't stop a motivated network from providing the service.
dools 3y ago
WhatsApp rose to prominence because data was cheaper than SMS. Is that still the case in Latin America? In Australia there are no mobile plans with metered SMS charges anymore.
- leesalminen 3y ago
  Yes, at least for me it is. My pre-paid plan (~$14/mo) gets me 4GB data but only 50 SMS. I also get 3GB of free WhatsApp data. There is no prepaid plan with unlimited SMS.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > 4GB data but only 50 SMS. Woah. I knew there were still places that charged for or metered SMS use, but I had no idea that the restrictions were that severe.
    - imachine1980_ 3y ago
      you can still buy lots of sms for cheap, and free sms plans(i think i have) but they aren't included because nobody uses them, i not read sms who isn't from 2fa in more than 7 years, it is publicity, scams, and miss calls.
      - dools 3y ago
        "i not read sms who isn't from 2fa in more than 7 years, it is publicity, scams, and miss calls." Funnily enough the volume of scam calls and txt that I receive via WhatsApp is why I have it disabled. The only reason I ever use it is because we sometimes need cross platform group messaging to organise plans with other families or school groups, then I delete the app again
    - rtpg 3y ago
      I think I pay for every SMS? For a thing that’s supposedly free it’s wild how much of a money maker it is for people

seany 3y ago

> My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month. Meta is surely compensating them in some form

DanitaBaires 3y ago
It has been like that before Meta.
toast0 3y ago
I worked on carrier partnerships (among many other things) while I was at WhatsApp, from before FB through 2019. Carriers wanted to setup special pricing (including zero-rating) for WhatsApp with or without our help or approval. Before acquisition, the only compensation we provided was approval to use our brand (which we didn't have resources to litigate around the world over anyway), our list of IPs (and notifications when they changed), and maybe a little bit of guidance/support on how to identify traffic; although from conversations I had, the DPI vendors had ways of doing it anyway without our help. In return, WA got some amount of marketing, and sometimes access to zero cost SMS (used for registration). Additionally, by participating with carriers, rather than letting them do their own thing, we were able to influence them towards providing a good experience for users; WA did not approve of text only special pricing[1], it had to include attachments, and we did our best to keep carriers updated on IPs to reduce the amount of miscategorized usage leading to overage or connectivity problems. To my knowledge, there was only one deal with monetary compensation, but it theoretically flowed to WA, not to the carrier. My understanding is the carriers wanted to run these deals because they attract customers who often convert to full internet plans. Messaging is nice, but customers eventually get outside links and want to experience the web or other applications. Post acquisition, deals moved into Facebook's mobile partner portal, and afaik, there was still no compensation for WhatsApp deals, but the MPP does also offer analytics (audience insights) to carriers, and I'm not sure if it's a requirement to have a special pricing deal to get that or not. It's been several years, so it's possible the program has changed. [1] If you've seen that on planes, it wasn't authorized when I was there, and I don't think it's authorized now, but it doesn't stop a motivated network from providing the service.

dools 3y ago

WhatsApp rose to prominence because data was cheaper than SMS. Is that still the case in Latin America? In Australia there are no mobile plans with metered SMS charges anymore.

leesalminen 3y ago
Yes, at least for me it is. My pre-paid plan (~$14/mo) gets me 4GB data but only 50 SMS. I also get 3GB of free WhatsApp data. There is no prepaid plan with unlimited SMS.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > 4GB data but only 50 SMS. Woah. I knew there were still places that charged for or metered SMS use, but I had no idea that the restrictions were that severe.
  - imachine1980_ 3y ago
    you can still buy lots of sms for cheap, and free sms plans(i think i have) but they aren't included because nobody uses them, i not read sms who isn't from 2fa in more than 7 years, it is publicity, scams, and miss calls.
    - dools 3y ago
      "i not read sms who isn't from 2fa in more than 7 years, it is publicity, scams, and miss calls." Funnily enough the volume of scam calls and txt that I receive via WhatsApp is why I have it disabled. The only reason I ever use it is because we sometimes need cross platform group messaging to organise plans with other families or school groups, then I delete the app again
  - rtpg 3y ago
    I think I pay for every SMS? For a thing that’s supposedly free it’s wild how much of a money maker it is for people