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Why Oppenheimer Deserves His Own Movie [video]
- Oarch 3y agoI'd be curious to see a von Neumann portrayal. It seems he's not in the film even though he was a part of the Manhattan Project. Are there any good biopics of him?
- anta40 3y agoJust watched the movie. Yep, he's not mentioned at all in the movie. Interesting though I just learn that JvN also worked in Los Alamos. All I know about him was von Neumann architecture.
- ramraj07 3y agoI'll always recommend a first tryst with "the making of the atomic bomb" by Richard Rhodes, he won the Pulitzer prize for it and it's my favourite book of all time. He explores the history and mind of every important person involved which includes Neumann, Szilard, Bohr and Oppenheimer.
- vanattab 3y agoI will second "the making of the atomic bomb". Definitely the best book on the topic. The audio book on audible is well done as well.
- pjmorris 3y agoI'll third the recommendation for 'The Making of the Atomic Bomb,' one of the best books I've ever read. It is a long, challenging read, but it is thorough and rewarding in proportion. On the topic of Oppenheimer, I came away with a deep respect for him as a project manager.
- arethuza 3y ago"When Szilárd told the story later he never mentioned his destination that morning. He may have had none; he often walked to think. In any case another destination intervened. The stoplight changed to green. Szilárd stepped off the curb. As he crossed the street time cracked open before him and he saw a way to the future, death into the world and all our woe, the shape of things to come."
- BenjiWiebe 3y agoAnd I'll fourth the suggestion. Excellent book.
- karmakurtisaani 3y agoI "came here to say this", but then thought about it and was thinking what kind of a movie it would be. The synopsis of the movie would basically be "there's this guy who knows everything, creates a few fields of science and pretty much solves any problem coming at him", not sure if that would be interesting to large audiences (although super interesting to me for sure). I'm a but bummered to hear he's not in the movie tho, so I'm gonna just go ahead and share an anecdote about him: apparently the first time he joined the Manhattan project and met with the team in a dinner party, he basically explained them that the charges around the uranium have to be arranged spherically in order to maximize the compression of the uranium. This was already known by the team, but only after experimenting with several different shapes!
- defrost 3y agoSo .. your anecdote is that Oppenheimer repeated the contents of the Frisch–Peierls memorandum as explained to him by the Australian physicist Mark Oliphant?
- karmakurtisaani 3y agoIt was about von Neumann, but I have no idea, just something I read somewhere. As with all anecdotes about him, I take them as entertaining stories. Another one: Von Neumann was supposed to give an address on the international mathematics congress in 1950 (I think) as the keynote speaker. He was expected to deliver similar speech as Hilbert did 50 years ago. Somehow he forgot and did not prepare much, and ended up talking about operator theory and his work in the 1930s. After the disappointed audience had listened to his address for a while, someone heckled him, he apologized and promptly left the stage.
- mitchbob 3y agoNot a biopic, but an engrossing book where von Neumann is the main character is Turing's Cathedral by George Dyson. [1] [1] https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/44425/turings-cathedral-by-george-dyson/ https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/44425/turings-cathe...
- Oarch 3y agoI've read this and that's probably what sparked my curiosity!
- civilitty 3y agoThe quote “Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds” is reason enough! They could have had Thanos say it as he wipes out half the universe and it’d still wouldn’t sound as cool.
- xxs 3y agoYet, it's not an original quote at any rate - it's a reference to Bhagavad Gita
- zamfi 3y agoIf anything that makes its use more interesting: > J. Robert Oppenheimer, American physicist and director of the Manhattan Project, learned Sanskrit in 1933 and read the Bhagavad Gita in the original form, citing it later as one of the most influential books to shape his philosophy of life. His later description of the moment is: > We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried. Most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad Gita; Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty and, to impress him, takes on his multi-armed form and says, 'Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.' I suppose we all thought that, one way or another.
- surgical_fire 3y ago"Now we are all sons of bitches"
- AkshatJ27 3y agoVideo of Oppenheimer saying it with context: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb13ynu3Iac https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb13ynu3Iac
- wongarsu 3y agoTo me it's really his delivery that sells the quote. The video is so much better than just seeing the words written down
- melling 3y agoThe movie is based on this Pulitzer Prize winning book: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Prometheus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Prometheus It doesn’t get mentioned much but is highly rated on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/American-Prometheus-Triumph-Tragedy-Oppenheimer/dp/0375412026 https://www.amazon.com/American-Prometheus-Triumph-Tragedy-O...
- josefresco 3y agoI read it earlier this year and thought it was great. Imagine my delight when I found out there was a movie coming out in July!
- LegitShady 3y ago99% of the time when a book I enjoy gets a major studio movie treatment the result is garbage, though. So I imagine the opposite of delight.
- josefresco 3y agoWhen I first learned of the movie, I thought it would be a small/indi film that I'd have to dig up from my local library archives. Then I learned it was going to be a "blockbuster" and had mixed feelings - still pretty excited! I'm sure there will be about a dozen "that's not how it was in the book" moments but whatever, can't be worse than the last movie I saw at the theater (Dial of Destiny)
- oittaa 3y agoThe Martian is an excellent movie based on one of the best scifi books. Gives me a lot of hope for the Project Hail Mary movie.
- LegitShady 3y agoTo my understanding the Martian was originally written as web serial, right? I haven’t seen the movie. Not personally my type of film although I’ve heard good things.
- Thaxll 3y agoIs the sound in the theater is going to be unbearable like other Nolan movies?
- patapong 3y agoTo learn more about Oppenheimer, I enjoyed the following book: "The Oppenheimer Alternative", by Robert J. Sawyer. https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/49706374 https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/49706374 The first part is a well-researched retelling of the years leading up to the Manhattan project and the building of the bomb, through the eyes of Oppenheimer and others. The rest is a science fiction extension of what could have happened if the group stayed together and are faced with another big challenge. I enjoyed the first part even more, as an entertaining way of learning more about Oppenheimer and the other scientists involved.
- RegularOpossum 3y agoI'm excited for the movie but also worried Nolan's worst habits when it comes to forcing non linear narratives are going to be present. It always makes me wonder if he's confident enough in the story when he does gimmicks.
- prometheus76 3y agoPerhaps he's pointing at or trying to reveal a recursive view of reality, rather than a linear view. I'm thinking along the lines of Godel, Escher, Bach and also I Am a Strange Loop, both by Douglas Hofstadter.
- bin_bash 3y agoDunkirk didn't have any gimmicks like that so far as I can remember
- martin_balsam 3y ago?? Dunkirk is imo the best one of his non-linear narratives, with 3 storylines intertwining: one taking place in the span of one week, one in one day and the last one (the plane) in one hour.
- bin_bash 3y agoI stand corrected, strange I don't remember that. I don't think it hurt the storytelling at least.
- RegularOpossum 3y agoIt was Dunkirk I was most referencing in my original comment. I found it a very disappointing film. Here's this important human story that the movie refuses to tell clearly, making the whole thing hit less than the sum of it's parts. 1917 was much more effective in its stylistic choices in my opinion.
- RichardCA 3y ago
- guggle 3y agohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E0r-ssYI94 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E0r-ssYI94
- HydianSnake1 3y agoIn a slightly different timeline there's a blockbuster film celebrating Höss, while Oppenheimer is the personification of evil for his holocaust of Japanese civilians.
- IgorPartola 3y agoThere is already an epic tale of him: https://youtu.be/v1vXC-vKgKg https://youtu.be/v1vXC-vKgKg
- sampo 3y ago> J. Robert Oppenheimer might be the most important physicist to have ever lived What about Maxwell inventing electromagnetic theory, whoever invented the transistor, and Francis Crick co-discovering the structure of DNA?
- credit_guy 3y agoWell, I don’t know, but for me the top spot is taken by that certain guy who used to ride on the shoulders of giants. Top spot for physics and top spot for math.
- arethuza 3y agoPhysicist and undercover crime fighter! Edit: I'm still hoping someone does a live action version of The Baroque Cycle.
- credit_guy 3y agoWait, what? Newton was involved in crime fighting? Do tell, please.
- arethuza 3y ago"Newton conducted more than 100 cross-examinations of witnesses, informers, and suspects between June 1698 and Christmas 1699. He himself gathered much of the evidence he needed to successfully prosecute 28 coiners." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Later_life_of_Isaac_Newton https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Later_life_of_Isaac_Newton "Disguised as a habitué of bars and taverns, he gathered much of that evidence himself." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isaac_Newton The Baroque Cycle has some memorable scenes with Newton! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Baroque_Cycle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Baroque_Cycle
- Sai_ 3y agoWith due respect, (a) I would classify this as marketing and self-promoting hyperbole, not worth contradicting, (b) absent any objective measure, the video creator's opinion is as valid as yours and (c) as far as opinions go, Oppenheimer = most important physicist isn't the worst one to have.
- ndsipa_pomu 3y agoIt's worth checking out the old 1980s TV mini-series: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078037/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078037/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqQAMwWly94&list=PL7TuA9EPF1p8k2Yc6tHYPPQLkylOCyGUq https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqQAMwWly94&list=PL7TuA9EPF1...
- beezle 3y agoCritical Assembly: A Technical History of Los Alamos during the Oppenheimer Years, 1943-1945 Highly recommended for anyone with interest in Project Y and a less "dramatic" account of Oppenheimer's role. It is technical but not insanely so. Also includes brief info on the run up to Los Alamos. If you are patient you can find a copy cheaper, many libraries will be able to borrow out of a college as well. I've heard the softcover is poorly printed fwiw. https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/critical-assembly-lillian-hoddeson/1100939048?ean=9780521441322 https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/critical-assembly-lillian-h... edited to add title of book in text and additional info
- JKCalhoun 3y agoI recently read "Escape from Earth: A Secret History of the Space Rocket" about Jack Parsons and the birth of JPL — it surprised me how "hip" communism was among the U.S. educated elite in the 1940's. Oppenheimer's very communist brother is mentioned frequently in the book. I was not surprised to see Robert also painted with communist suspicions — it seemed not to be unusual for "thinking people" of that time. There was though a whiff of, "Hey guys, I know we all made it, but we're the thinkers of society so what kind of government can we embrace that will help elevate the average Joe-down-the-street? Communism seems like a logical idea!" Remarkable how suddenly it seemed no one was a Communist beginning in the 1950's. Even the JPL folks scrubbed their own histories — diminished their involvement to "was it a communist party meeting? I was only there for the drinks."
- mannykannot 3y agoSpoiler alert: the movie sheds some light on the issue you raise in your final paragraph. Here's another: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism A publicly-expressed faith in communism survived longer among intellectuals elsewhere, but the example of the Soviet Union eventually wore down all but the most committed.
- dwayne_dibley 3y agoI'd like a sequel but based around Ernest Lawrence set on the same timeline.
- johnwalkr 3y agoKind of off-topic but this movie was shot in 70mm IMAX (and similar) film, and some scenes are shot in the first-ever 65mm black and white film, and it has no CGI effects. It's only playing in 70mm IMAX in 30 theatres globally[1], most of them in the US. Normally IMAX feature releases only play for a few weeks, so if you are a film nerd at all it's worth checking if this version is playing near you.
- fsh 3y agoIMAX was once supposed to deliver the best image quality possible. Nowadays, digital cameras are superior to 70 mm film in every possible way, especially color accuracy and dynamic range. It is really time to stop this pretentious analogue nonsense.
- cush 3y agoWho are you to say how someone else’s film should be viewed…?
- ecshafer 3y agoFilm still looks better than digital. Quality of film is has many aspects, some of which are really more aesthetic aspects than purely technical. Watching a film from film really just has this feeling which digital can't reproduce.
- asow92 3y agoAs someone who has shot a lot of medium format film and digital, what I've gathered is it's the Wabi-sabi imperfections of film—the dream like quality that can be captured in camera—that people appreciate the most about it. People like it precisely because it is inaccurate. Both are just tools and have their appropriate uses.
- kjkjadksj 3y ago70mm though has so much resolution, its probably better than a lot of digital sensors I’d expect.
- sidcool 3y agoRumor has it that to ensure realism without CGI, Nolan enriched his own Uranium and used it to detonate an actual fission bomb. Just like Stanley Kubrick faked the moon landings by actually shooting it on the moon for authenticity. /S
- N19PEDL2 3y agoI have been fascinated and intrigued by the figure of Oppenheimer ever since I saw him in the TV series Manhattan. It's one of my all-time favourite series, even though it's not very well known.
- tibbydudeza 3y agoDoes it feature the "tickling the dragon's tail" incident ???. Now that was insane lab method - Marie Curie was at least oblivious about hers.
- falcrist 3y agoThere were two such incidents. The first with Harry Daghlian stacking tungsten bricks around the "demon core" before dropping the final brick into place. The second with Louis Slotin and his infamous screwdriver. The whole idea of getting as close as possible to criticality with neutron reflectors was the part that was "tickling the dragon's tail". Not necessarily just the screwdriver method, which was particularly insane.
- dreamcompiler 3y agoThe movie "Fat Man and Little Boy" dramatizes this with John Cusack playing a fictionalized version of Louis Slotin.
- 58x14 3y agoI heard recently (on Lex Fridman's podcast with Marc Andreessen) that Oppenheimer was called a "cry-baby scientist" by President Truman, and that his groveling campaign was considered by many to be self-aggrandizing, albeit in a self-deprecating way. Apparently, his involvement was less significant than many others in the Manhattan Project, but his name became one of the most well-known due to his public outcries, and of course his iconic quote. I haven't yet seen the movie and I'm looking forward to it; I wonder how much of this is portrayed. Funny enough, I'm planning a double feature with Oppenheimer and the Barbie movie. Maintaining a healthy relationship involves tradeoffs.
- dralley 3y ago> on Lex Fridman's podcast with Marc Andreessen There's two to talk.
- matthewdgreen 3y agoAlternatively, have you considered that the guy organized and ran the development of the atomic bomb and that those specific podcasters might not be particularly objective in their analysis?
- beezle 3y agoHe both ran Project Y and contributed to it in meaninful ways. And managing the project was not simple on a technical/engineering level nor as "big science" (as Project Y essentially invented the term).
- falcrist 3y ago> Apparently, his involvement was less significant than many others in the Manhattan Project He was essentially the project manager, so I'm not sure how this is possible. Are people simply suggesting that he wasn't the one who did most of the actual science? If so, that seems like missing the point.
- dgllghr 3y agoGeneral Leslie Groves thought very highly of Oppenheimer, and if you got the stamp of approval from Groves, you were doing something right. Oppenheimer was dragged through the mud during the red scare and his name is still tarnished because of that. It is ironic and a little sad that he was awarded the Fermi medal once his name was finally cleared because Fermi worked for him during the Manhattan Project. It probably would have been the Oppenheimer Medal if it weren’t for Senator McCarthy. Oppenheimer beat Heisenberg (also a pretty smart guy) to the bomb and not by a little either. And thank whatever higher power is out there he did. Oppenheimer was a genius both in theoretical and practical physics work. It is a shame that he doesn’t have a better reputation today. And when it comes to his “campaign”, well, he had good reasons for his concerns. The second atomic bomb dropped on Japan was dropped without the president’s knowledge! He realized that we were not ready for that weapon and still aren’t to this day.
- dreamcompiler 3y agoOppenheimer has had his own movie (and opera and TV series and a ton of books as others here have pointed out). The earlier Hollywood treatment was "Fat Man and Little Boy" with Paul Newman. It's rentable on Amazon Prime. It's not a great movie despite the talented cast and good photography. I expect Nolan to make a better movie, but FM&LB does a decent job telling the story of the relationship of Groves and Oppenheimer and some of Oppie's back story.