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> You're now changing that to "apps don't give you the benefits they promise - notably, calmness, clarity, a feeling of being organized". My first comment. >

> You're now changing that to "apps don't give you the benefits they promise - notably, calmness, clarity, a feeling of being organized". My first comment. > To-do list apps advertise certain benefits. If huge swaths of people don’t actually get the benefit, that’s the to-do list failing to live up to its promise, at least for that group. Seems like pretty steady goal posts. I think we’re focusing on different things, what’s possible versus what happens. It’s possible to have a chef’s knife made of wood and cut vegetables with it. It’s just probably a pretty awful knife.

jodrellblank 3y ago
I said TODO lists have too much in them because you put too much in them, and "it sounds victim-blamey but it's not books' fault that you bought them.". You replied quoting that part of what I said and saying I'm putting the responsibility in the wrong place, which suggests you think the responsibility for "having too many things to do" or "having too many books" lies with the system a person is using, not with the person? If you don't think that, we are talking at cross purposes. But if you do think that, talking about calmness, clarity, feeling organised, doesn't support that position. And on those parts I agree that TODO lists can overpromise and underdeliver (or can't deliver at all, ever). I was mostly interested in the idea that when keeping todo items in your head you will naturally spend more time thinking about the ones you find important and interesting, and there will be a natural forgetting of the ones you don't find important or interesting without you having to choose to reject any of them - and putting them in any kind of system forces you to face how many there are and now you can't naturally forget and the system will not forget them. I only put the victim blaming part in to avoid people ignoring the main point and replying "sounds like victim blaming" "you're holding it wrong".

jodrellblank 3y ago

I said TODO lists have too much in them because you put too much in them, and "it sounds victim-blamey but it's not books' fault that you bought them.". You replied quoting that part of what I said and saying I'm putting the responsibility in the wrong place, which suggests you think the responsibility for "having too many things to do" or "having too many books" lies with the system a person is using, not with the person? If you don't think that, we are talking at cross purposes. But if you do think that, talking about calmness, clarity, feeling organised, doesn't support that position. And on those parts I agree that TODO lists can overpromise and underdeliver (or can't deliver at all, ever). I was mostly interested in the idea that when keeping todo items in your head you will naturally spend more time thinking about the ones you find important and interesting, and there will be a natural forgetting of the ones you don't find important or interesting without you having to choose to reject any of them - and putting them in any kind of system forces you to face how many there are and now you can't naturally forget and the system will not forget them. I only put the victim blaming part in to avoid people ignoring the main point and replying "sounds like victim blaming" "you're holding it wrong".