4 ms·

In the age of Zoom, won't even slightly well to do parents get tutors from a remote country for a reasonable price for their kids if the school stops teaching m

In the age of Zoom, won't even slightly well to do parents get tutors from a remote country for a reasonable price for their kids if the school stops teaching math. The only kids who will suffer are the kids where parents are not so much focused on education, thus increasing the disparity.

thatfrenchguy 3y ago
Learning remotely is hard, especially for kids. People will just get normal tutors.
- crop_rotation 3y ago
  People will get/prefer normal tutors when they can afford, yes. But good high school kids would be able to learn from remote tutors too, and those would be affordable for most families.
- travisjungroth 3y ago
  Not a kid, but I got a math tutor remotely. 1:1 a lot of the group remote problems go away. And market differences make a huge difference in affordability.
- TheCaptain4815 3y ago
  This is what I'm most excited for in LLMs. GPT4 Code Interpreter was created by taking the Base Model GPT4 + Layer of programming questions. I hope they do the same for a math tutor model or open up the base model for others to do so.
  - pdpi 3y ago
    How does that follow from GP’s point? If remote interaction with a human doesn’t quite measure up to face-to-face interaction, how does an LLM improve upon that?
    - TheCaptain4815 3y ago
      Major difference between a personalized tutor LLM and remote teaching an entire classroom.
gnicholas 3y ago
You can get remote tutors to teach your kid skills, yes. However, if your goal is to have your kid advance to higher math classes, it isn't enough to just know the skills. Schools erect extreme barriers to advancement (Palo Alto USD has been successfully sued on this point [1]), so what students really need is to enroll in outside courses that are certified replacements in order to get credit. Finding out about which courses these are, getting your kid physically to the courses, etc., will always be easier for parents with more means. 1: https://thecampanile.org/27999/news/the-verdict-is-in-pausds-math-placement-policies-dont-add-up/ https://thecampanile.org/27999/news/the-verdict-is-in-pausds...
- gotoeleven 3y ago
  The article you linked is incredibly confusing. I assume the issue is, which is typical of any advanced courses in school districts where helicopter tiger moms live, that little billy didn't qualify for the advanced math course because he's not smart enough but mom knows he's actually a genius. The pressure to let in little billy builds and builds until the districts relent and fill the classes with buffoons and the educational quality is lowered for everyone.
  - eitally 3y ago
    It sounds to me like there may have been an intermediate step, which was for little billy to be enrolled in some sort of third party course as a catch-up / qualifier for enrollment in the advanced class, and the district not accepting that.
  - aduffy 3y ago
    This article is better https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2023/03/03/judge-rules-high-school-math-policy-violates-state-law https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2023/03/03/judge-rules-h... The crux is that many students would take the 9th grade math course via private courses to then jump ahead a year or two when they get to the high school. The school tried to prevent people from doing this and the parents sued. I went to this high school ~10 years ago and at the time a handful of kids every year would do this. I'd imagine it's much higher now though.
vuln 3y ago
> The only kids who will suffer are the kids where parents are not so much focused on education, thus increasing the disparity. It’s almost like whenever the government tries to “fix” as issue and put its thumb on the scale it backfires. The results end up being the exact opposite of the government’s stated goal, unless that was the plan all along.
- UnFleshedOne 3y ago
  No, it is just people who are trying to do something would achieve more in that area than people who are not trying, regardless of conditions. You could change things so that trying is not really required, and it might work wonderfully if the barrier was made up to begin with, but that fails hard when that clashes with reality.
headcanon 3y ago
I don't think you need to get a tutor from a remote country. I would just enroll them in an after-school math program like Kumon. But yes, enhancing the education after school in general is likely what motivated parents with means would do.
- flappyeagle 3y ago
  Isn't Kumon just drilling basic stuff?
  - greatfilter250 3y ago
    [dead]
  - headcanon 3y ago
    yeah its a lot of drills, I hated it as a kid but it worked. I didn't use it for algebra or beyond but I'm pretty sure they have it.

thatfrenchguy 3y ago

Learning remotely is hard, especially for kids. People will just get normal tutors.

crop_rotation 3y ago
People will get/prefer normal tutors when they can afford, yes. But good high school kids would be able to learn from remote tutors too, and those would be affordable for most families.
travisjungroth 3y ago
Not a kid, but I got a math tutor remotely. 1:1 a lot of the group remote problems go away. And market differences make a huge difference in affordability.
TheCaptain4815 3y ago
This is what I'm most excited for in LLMs. GPT4 Code Interpreter was created by taking the Base Model GPT4 + Layer of programming questions. I hope they do the same for a math tutor model or open up the base model for others to do so.
- pdpi 3y ago
  How does that follow from GP’s point? If remote interaction with a human doesn’t quite measure up to face-to-face interaction, how does an LLM improve upon that?
  - TheCaptain4815 3y ago
    Major difference between a personalized tutor LLM and remote teaching an entire classroom.

gnicholas 3y ago

You can get remote tutors to teach your kid skills, yes. However, if your goal is to have your kid advance to higher math classes, it isn't enough to just know the skills. Schools erect extreme barriers to advancement (Palo Alto USD has been successfully sued on this point [1]), so what students really need is to enroll in outside courses that are certified replacements in order to get credit. Finding out about which courses these are, getting your kid physically to the courses, etc., will always be easier for parents with more means. 1: https://thecampanile.org/27999/news/the-verdict-is-in-pausds-math-placement-policies-dont-add-up/ https://thecampanile.org/27999/news/the-verdict-is-in-pausds...

gotoeleven 3y ago
The article you linked is incredibly confusing. I assume the issue is, which is typical of any advanced courses in school districts where helicopter tiger moms live, that little billy didn't qualify for the advanced math course because he's not smart enough but mom knows he's actually a genius. The pressure to let in little billy builds and builds until the districts relent and fill the classes with buffoons and the educational quality is lowered for everyone.
- eitally 3y ago
  It sounds to me like there may have been an intermediate step, which was for little billy to be enrolled in some sort of third party course as a catch-up / qualifier for enrollment in the advanced class, and the district not accepting that.
- aduffy 3y ago
  This article is better https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2023/03/03/judge-rules-high-school-math-policy-violates-state-law https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2023/03/03/judge-rules-h... The crux is that many students would take the 9th grade math course via private courses to then jump ahead a year or two when they get to the high school. The school tried to prevent people from doing this and the parents sued. I went to this high school ~10 years ago and at the time a handful of kids every year would do this. I'd imagine it's much higher now though.

vuln 3y ago

> The only kids who will suffer are the kids where parents are not so much focused on education, thus increasing the disparity. It’s almost like whenever the government tries to “fix” as issue and put its thumb on the scale it backfires. The results end up being the exact opposite of the government’s stated goal, unless that was the plan all along.

UnFleshedOne 3y ago
No, it is just people who are trying to do something would achieve more in that area than people who are not trying, regardless of conditions. You could change things so that trying is not really required, and it might work wonderfully if the barrier was made up to begin with, but that fails hard when that clashes with reality.

headcanon 3y ago

I don't think you need to get a tutor from a remote country. I would just enroll them in an after-school math program like Kumon. But yes, enhancing the education after school in general is likely what motivated parents with means would do.

flappyeagle 3y ago
Isn't Kumon just drilling basic stuff?
- greatfilter250 3y ago
  [dead]
- headcanon 3y ago
  yeah its a lot of drills, I hated it as a kid but it worked. I didn't use it for algebra or beyond but I'm pretty sure they have it.