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Wife and I have been together for 8+ years and finances is still the #1 area we struggle with (more than sex, more than children), an area we are actively worki

Wife and I have been together for 8+ years and finances is still the #1 area we struggle with (more than sex, more than children), an area we are actively working on improving. When we first had our hiccups, someone suggested we divide our finances as such: - A shared account (shared expenses) - An account (for my eyes only; buy whatever - no questions asked) - An account (for her eyes only; buy whatever - no questions asked) Far from perfect. We're now revisiting our setup and perhaps this article might nudge us in a different direction.

dryanau 3y ago
May I ask what specifically some of the issues have been? I know it's digging into a personal area so feel free to ignore this, but I'm curious what kind of issues can arise.
- itsmemattchung 3y ago
  Issues can be categorized into three buckets: my challenges, her challenges, shared challenges. We're working through many of these with our couple's therapist but here's the gist: 1. When wife would spend beyond our defined budget, I would get angry (stemming from fear) and let that boil inside without ever communicating it verbally 2. When wife and I decided for her to quit her job to parent our first daughter full time, initially was elated and then I felt a financial pressure I've never experienced before 3. Wife had a domestically violent partner before and interprets budgeting as controlling behavior Full disclosure: lots of vulnerability factors for the both of us. I grew up poor and although I have money now, there's lots of emotions tied to finances.
  - jncfhnb 3y ago
    I don’t understand how you can write (1) and not perceive it as an easily solved communication problem with your own wife
    - sooheon 3y ago
      Lots of things about human emotion are dumb but understandable, especially re: money.
    - em-bee 3y ago
      because of point 3. for example my wife didn't like me doing detailed accounting of all of our expenses do i had to stop that. she hasn't spent to much money so that issue didn't come up but i can imagine it being a problem to tell your partner they spend to much if the partner is sensitive about that.
      - jncfhnb 3y ago
        That’s not an excuse to let things boil up without talking about it. If you fundamentally cannot communicate with someone you should not get married
        em-bee 3y ago
        that is not fair. it is easy to say, but sometimes very hard to do. things like these are not always predictable, and especially money handling often doesn't even come up as an issue until after you are married for some time.
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        But this is not only predictable but acknowledged. It’s not ideal to fail to communicate and not realize it. It’s not ok to identify as someone who just doesn’t communicate and bottles up their emotions until they’re problematic. It might not be easy. But to do otherwise is a recipe for failure. And we’d be dumb to not acknowledge that. You shouldn’t marry someone you’re not comfortable talking to About difficult things. That’s like the whole point of having a trusted partner.
        em-bee 3y ago
        You shouldn’t marry someone you’re not comfortable talking to About difficult things. you keep saying that, but generally you can't know how your partner reacts until the issue actually comes up and especially with finances it rarely comes up before you start living together which often doesn't happen until you get married. it is impossible to vet your partner on every aspect. when you get married you start to build trust, and you find out your partners sensitive points and learn to avoid them. that's not even an issue of trust, but a question of how you communicate to keep a healthy relationship. in my case i simply stopped the detailed accounting and everything was fine. in the case here the person had difficulty dealing with that. we don't know why, or how they could resolve that, but telling them that they should have predicted that and not married this person is really unreasonable.
  - sidewndr46 3y ago
    You do realize that setting a budget is by definition controlling behavior? You are controlling the expenditure of the household. I'm not suggesting you are wrong for that, but it is controlling behavior. So your wife observed controlling behavior and then equated it to something in her past.
    - helpfulmandrill 3y ago
      It isn't controlling behaviour if you both have equal input into designing the budget, and both agree to and support the idea of having a budget in the first place.
      - em-bee 3y ago
        it can be intended to be not controlling, but perceived as such. i used to do accounting to track and understand my own behavior. and when i tried that after getting married on all our expenses, the point was not to control her but to understand our expenses and allow for self control or restraint if necessary (realizing that you spend $100 on coffee each month can help you change your behavior). but it made my wife uncomfortable.
      - sidewndr46 3y ago
        If you read the post, it's clear that is not what happened here. OP set the budget. Wife did not follow it.
        itsmemattchung 3y ago
        There’s a I’me assumptions that were made here. To clarify, we set the budget together.
        sidewndr46 3y ago
        Based on the account you provided, your wife only agreed to it as a matter of conversation. Not as a matter of practice.
  - avgDev 3y ago
    1. You have to communicate otherwise the other party doesn't know. However, this would be a huge deal for me. 2. I felt this pressure when we were deciding if my wife would stay home or if we would do daycare. I told her I don't want a pressure of single income. In the end daycare has been great for our kid. The feeling of pressure is completely normal. Single income to support a family clearly is more riskier than two incomes. 3. Your wife needs therapy. Budgeting is not controlling, it is basic personal finance. She can contribute to the budgeting discussion. 4. You also may need therapy. I too grew up poor and know the feeling. I know people who took that feeling, budgeted and became millionaires but one does need a healthy balance of spending and saving.
- detourdog 3y ago
  We do as the above and I think it is the only thing that makes sense for us. The problem we have is too much is not enough for some. They don't need to spend they need to horde. It causes problems and I think it is actually some other need that is poorly expressed. Never underestimate the ability to have problems in relationships.
pseudosavant 3y ago
Don't merge your accounts together. You have the right setup - accounts-wise. Changing it to joint likely won't solve issues, and untangling from joint is difficult.
d1sxeyes 3y ago
My wife and I use a pretty simple system which we picked up from some friends of ours: 80% of each of our post-tax income goes into a shared account for stuff which is unambiguously 'shared' costs - for example rent, utilities, groceries, savings, stuff for our son, eating out together, etc. We each keep 20% of our income to do what we want with. This fixes almost all feelings of inequality (I make a bit more than my wife. Personally I'm not that bothered, but my wife feels very strongly that she does not want to be 'supported' by my income, and that her disposable income should be based on her income, not our net income). Every now and then we agree to move a cost into the 'shared' category even if it's clearly not a shared cost (e.g., my wife's phone bill comes out of the shared account because my phone bill is paid by my employer). Sometimes we also 'treat' each other, by taking a cost like a dinner out together as a personal expense (often on pay day, for example). As an exception to the above, my wife is on maternity leave at the moment so we agreed we'd just sum up all our incomings and each of us gets 10%. This is also working pretty well so we might not change it back after she starts working again, but we'll see if she raises this inequality thing again. Obviously YMMV, but this system suits us well

dryanau 3y ago

May I ask what specifically some of the issues have been? I know it's digging into a personal area so feel free to ignore this, but I'm curious what kind of issues can arise.

itsmemattchung 3y ago
Issues can be categorized into three buckets: my challenges, her challenges, shared challenges. We're working through many of these with our couple's therapist but here's the gist: 1. When wife would spend beyond our defined budget, I would get angry (stemming from fear) and let that boil inside without ever communicating it verbally 2. When wife and I decided for her to quit her job to parent our first daughter full time, initially was elated and then I felt a financial pressure I've never experienced before 3. Wife had a domestically violent partner before and interprets budgeting as controlling behavior Full disclosure: lots of vulnerability factors for the both of us. I grew up poor and although I have money now, there's lots of emotions tied to finances.
- jncfhnb 3y ago
  I don’t understand how you can write (1) and not perceive it as an easily solved communication problem with your own wife
  - sooheon 3y ago
    Lots of things about human emotion are dumb but understandable, especially re: money.
  - em-bee 3y ago
    because of point 3. for example my wife didn't like me doing detailed accounting of all of our expenses do i had to stop that. she hasn't spent to much money so that issue didn't come up but i can imagine it being a problem to tell your partner they spend to much if the partner is sensitive about that.
    - jncfhnb 3y ago
      That’s not an excuse to let things boil up without talking about it. If you fundamentally cannot communicate with someone you should not get married
      - em-bee 3y ago
        that is not fair. it is easy to say, but sometimes very hard to do. things like these are not always predictable, and especially money handling often doesn't even come up as an issue until after you are married for some time.
        jncfhnb 3y ago
        But this is not only predictable but acknowledged. It’s not ideal to fail to communicate and not realize it. It’s not ok to identify as someone who just doesn’t communicate and bottles up their emotions until they’re problematic. It might not be easy. But to do otherwise is a recipe for failure. And we’d be dumb to not acknowledge that. You shouldn’t marry someone you’re not comfortable talking to About difficult things. That’s like the whole point of having a trusted partner.
        em-bee 3y ago
        You shouldn’t marry someone you’re not comfortable talking to About difficult things. you keep saying that, but generally you can't know how your partner reacts until the issue actually comes up and especially with finances it rarely comes up before you start living together which often doesn't happen until you get married. it is impossible to vet your partner on every aspect. when you get married you start to build trust, and you find out your partners sensitive points and learn to avoid them. that's not even an issue of trust, but a question of how you communicate to keep a healthy relationship. in my case i simply stopped the detailed accounting and everything was fine. in the case here the person had difficulty dealing with that. we don't know why, or how they could resolve that, but telling them that they should have predicted that and not married this person is really unreasonable.
- sidewndr46 3y ago
  You do realize that setting a budget is by definition controlling behavior? You are controlling the expenditure of the household. I'm not suggesting you are wrong for that, but it is controlling behavior. So your wife observed controlling behavior and then equated it to something in her past.
  - helpfulmandrill 3y ago
    It isn't controlling behaviour if you both have equal input into designing the budget, and both agree to and support the idea of having a budget in the first place.
    - em-bee 3y ago
      it can be intended to be not controlling, but perceived as such. i used to do accounting to track and understand my own behavior. and when i tried that after getting married on all our expenses, the point was not to control her but to understand our expenses and allow for self control or restraint if necessary (realizing that you spend $100 on coffee each month can help you change your behavior). but it made my wife uncomfortable.
    - sidewndr46 3y ago
      If you read the post, it's clear that is not what happened here. OP set the budget. Wife did not follow it.
      - itsmemattchung 3y ago
        There’s a I’me assumptions that were made here. To clarify, we set the budget together.
        sidewndr46 3y ago
        Based on the account you provided, your wife only agreed to it as a matter of conversation. Not as a matter of practice.
- avgDev 3y ago
  1. You have to communicate otherwise the other party doesn't know. However, this would be a huge deal for me. 2. I felt this pressure when we were deciding if my wife would stay home or if we would do daycare. I told her I don't want a pressure of single income. In the end daycare has been great for our kid. The feeling of pressure is completely normal. Single income to support a family clearly is more riskier than two incomes. 3. Your wife needs therapy. Budgeting is not controlling, it is basic personal finance. She can contribute to the budgeting discussion. 4. You also may need therapy. I too grew up poor and know the feeling. I know people who took that feeling, budgeted and became millionaires but one does need a healthy balance of spending and saving.
detourdog 3y ago
We do as the above and I think it is the only thing that makes sense for us. The problem we have is too much is not enough for some. They don't need to spend they need to horde. It causes problems and I think it is actually some other need that is poorly expressed. Never underestimate the ability to have problems in relationships.

pseudosavant 3y ago

Don't merge your accounts together. You have the right setup - accounts-wise. Changing it to joint likely won't solve issues, and untangling from joint is difficult.

d1sxeyes 3y ago

My wife and I use a pretty simple system which we picked up from some friends of ours: 80% of each of our post-tax income goes into a shared account for stuff which is unambiguously 'shared' costs - for example rent, utilities, groceries, savings, stuff for our son, eating out together, etc. We each keep 20% of our income to do what we want with. This fixes almost all feelings of inequality (I make a bit more than my wife. Personally I'm not that bothered, but my wife feels very strongly that she does not want to be 'supported' by my income, and that her disposable income should be based on her income, not our net income). Every now and then we agree to move a cost into the 'shared' category even if it's clearly not a shared cost (e.g., my wife's phone bill comes out of the shared account because my phone bill is paid by my employer). Sometimes we also 'treat' each other, by taking a cost like a dinner out together as a personal expense (often on pay day, for example). As an exception to the above, my wife is on maternity leave at the moment so we agreed we'd just sum up all our incomings and each of us gets 10%. This is also working pretty well so we might not change it back after she starts working again, but we'll see if she raises this inequality thing again. Obviously YMMV, but this system suits us well