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Have I been incredibly lucky my entire career? I don't think I've applied for more than 10 jobs at once. I have heard stories like this before - maybe the marke

Have I been incredibly lucky my entire career? I don't think I've applied for more than 10 jobs at once. I have heard stories like this before - maybe the market has shifted drastically, or maybe spamming 2500 applications means each one is ... less good than one might think? Tailoring your application to each job has worked well for me at least. 46 Interviews is also a huge amount. I've done less than that my entire career combined. I agree with others, something else may be off here.

vsareto 3y ago
>I agree with others, something else may be off here. IMO Blind is generally full of shit
- carabiner 3y ago
  IMO it's the best tech career advice you can find on the internet. Literally life changing for so many people, search "thank you blind."
tannerc 3y ago
In my experience, when you’re applying to hundreds or thousands of jobs, odds are you aren’t clear on what your strengths are and what you want from your career. And, unfortunately, that often comes across in a résumé and application. Much better, I think, to spend time better conveying your strengths and interests as they relate to a specific job (or type of job). You’re much more likely to get the interest of relevant recruiters and hiring managers in this way.
commandlinefan 3y ago
> Have I been incredibly lucky my entire career? I wonder that, too, but the last time I was on the market was 2017. This is the first time in my 30-year programmer career that I've heard anybody looking for programming jobs complaining about anything _other_ than recruiters bothering them too much. I haven't been in this market personally yet, but the tone is definitely a new one since the dawn of the internet.
- bamfly 3y ago
  Stories of people's hundreds- to thousands-of-applications journeys make it on here what seems like a couple times per year, pretty consistently. All I can figure is I've been in a totally different part of the market from these folks. I've never once had a job search that looked like that. Typically, I do 1-3 interviews after 1-5 applications, and come out with 1-2 acceptable offers. I don't think my total application count in a given search has ever come very close to 10, let alone 100 or 1,000. Or, the last couple times, I've just gone, "yo, I'm looking" and had someone in my network hand me a job (I get that's a later-career thing—but my early-career searches never, ever looked like these application-gauntlets, either). I doubt I've sent 50 total applications in a 20+ year career, which career includes most of the usual job-hopping-for-more-pay, so it's not because I'm doing very-long stints with single employers.
  - ryandrake 3y ago
    I’ve maintained a 100:10:1 application:interview:job ratio for about 20 years now. This is for software engineer roles as well as product management and project management roles. It’s been pretty consistent, although I admit I’m usually looking for work when everyone else is: during tech recessions.
A4ET8a8uTh0 3y ago
It can depend heavily on timing and industry you are in. Not to search very far, in my neck of the woods, job search can have 6 months lead time even while actively searching. I am passively searching now and I did not have one call back yet ( mostly blind applications without playing HR bingo ). My buddies seem to be experiencing the same thing ( including one relatively recent graduate ). I am not sure if entities are restricting hiring, more people are applying for one spot or its some combination. I am exclusively applying for remote only items, but buddies are not as discriminating. Still, the number is attention grabbing.
carabiner 3y ago
2500 apps is with his wife and brother helping. 46 phone screens out of that, a 1.8% conversion rate, is totally realistic. My rate was 6% but I was very targeted. I had 32 phone screens. These usually only take 30 minutes and don't require much prep. > maybe the market has shifted drastically You're catching on. This is the worst job market in 20 years, far worse than the 2009 recession. In 2009, tons of college kids were still getting in Amazon but new grads today are struggling to find anything. This is a tectonic shift causing mountains to crumble, and we will be feeling the effects for decades.
- buildbot 3y ago
  Is it really? Because unemployment numbers don't line up with it being the worst market in 20 years.
  - Volundr 3y ago
    Overall unemployment or are you looking at tech specific numbers? Anecdotally I just went through the hardest job search of my career, and many people I know have either just gone through the same or still are. I don't have numbers to it up, but it certainly feels like a rough time to be looking to me.
  - tayo42 3y ago
    send 10 applications out now and see what your response is like
- antisthenes 3y ago
  > In 2009, tons of college kids were still getting in Amazon Clearly, "tons" of kids getting into 1 company (out of several thousand just public ones), is a great indicator. Just for reference, I actually lived through the 11% unemployment out of college. The market for fresh grads was absolutely brutal. A good 20-30% of my cohort never recovered and never broke into higher-paying white collar jobs and still works in jobs that don't require a college degree. It was so bad, that the fresh grads of those years coined the term "lost generation". Millions of fresh grads just couldn't break into adulting for several years.
vehementi 3y ago
Yeah I'd love to see what the conversion rate is on actual referrals.
tennisflyi 3y ago
I’m not spending time to tailor my resume to get ghosted.
- jmye 3y ago
  If not tailoring it still gets you interviews, then great. But if you're not getting interviews, and you're refusing to do basic things to help yourself, that seems silly and self-defeating, especially if it's an appealing role or company. As a non-dev, I have between a 90-95% response rate when I do apply because I tailor my resume, and I apply to roles strategically and intentionally. I don't begrudge people who either have high success rates without doing that work, or who don't care about a lower success rate if it means spending less time on the process, but I don't get the people who hate the process so much that they intentionally torpedo themselves because of it.
  - ryandrake 3y ago
    Chances are, the algorithmic/automation that is at the top of the funnel filtering out 90% of incoming resumes doesn’t know or care if the resume it deletes is carefully hand-tailored with love for weeks or if it’s been shotgunned to 1000 companies.
    - jmye 3y ago
      If you’re hand-tailoring it, and you’re still getting knocked out by the system, you’re doing a poor job of it and should probably ask for help. The endless complaints about ATS and whatever else almost always come from people with objectively poorly written resumes or who are applying to jobs they’re not even slightly qualified for.
scruple 3y ago
I feel incredibly lucky that I haven't actually applied for any programming job since my first. I've walked through the back door into my last 4 employers through my network. I'm 20 years in. Don't get me wrong, I'm still interviewing, but the process has moved incredibly fast for me every single time I put it out to my network that I was open. Just this year, in fact, I put it out that I was looking, on a Tuesday, and I had multiple phone screens set up by that Thursday and Friday. Interviews with 5 companies the following week, followed up by additional interviews that same week, and ultimately I had 3 offers and accepted a new position inside of 10 days. I wish everyone could have this sort of experience because I have the sense that (from my own personal experience, to some degree, but especially anecdotes like the OP) that it's a really, really rough out there for most people.
efficax 3y ago
I have only ever applied to 2 jobs at once, where one was a definite fit and another was just to have an option. Except one single case, I've always gotten interviews and offers at both companies. We're out there, just weirdly lucky people. But also I know where to apply and where not to apply, and having a very narrowly tailored application/cover letter makes a huge difference in getting to the top of the pile (something I know from working with hiring departments).

vsareto 3y ago

>I agree with others, something else may be off here. IMO Blind is generally full of shit

carabiner 3y ago
IMO it's the best tech career advice you can find on the internet. Literally life changing for so many people, search "thank you blind."

tannerc 3y ago

In my experience, when you’re applying to hundreds or thousands of jobs, odds are you aren’t clear on what your strengths are and what you want from your career. And, unfortunately, that often comes across in a résumé and application. Much better, I think, to spend time better conveying your strengths and interests as they relate to a specific job (or type of job). You’re much more likely to get the interest of relevant recruiters and hiring managers in this way.

commandlinefan 3y ago

> Have I been incredibly lucky my entire career? I wonder that, too, but the last time I was on the market was 2017. This is the first time in my 30-year programmer career that I've heard anybody looking for programming jobs complaining about anything _other_ than recruiters bothering them too much. I haven't been in this market personally yet, but the tone is definitely a new one since the dawn of the internet.

bamfly 3y ago
Stories of people's hundreds- to thousands-of-applications journeys make it on here what seems like a couple times per year, pretty consistently. All I can figure is I've been in a totally different part of the market from these folks. I've never once had a job search that looked like that. Typically, I do 1-3 interviews after 1-5 applications, and come out with 1-2 acceptable offers. I don't think my total application count in a given search has ever come very close to 10, let alone 100 or 1,000. Or, the last couple times, I've just gone, "yo, I'm looking" and had someone in my network hand me a job (I get that's a later-career thing—but my early-career searches never, ever looked like these application-gauntlets, either). I doubt I've sent 50 total applications in a 20+ year career, which career includes most of the usual job-hopping-for-more-pay, so it's not because I'm doing very-long stints with single employers.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  I’ve maintained a 100:10:1 application:interview:job ratio for about 20 years now. This is for software engineer roles as well as product management and project management roles. It’s been pretty consistent, although I admit I’m usually looking for work when everyone else is: during tech recessions.

A4ET8a8uTh0 3y ago

It can depend heavily on timing and industry you are in. Not to search very far, in my neck of the woods, job search can have 6 months lead time even while actively searching. I am passively searching now and I did not have one call back yet ( mostly blind applications without playing HR bingo ). My buddies seem to be experiencing the same thing ( including one relatively recent graduate ). I am not sure if entities are restricting hiring, more people are applying for one spot or its some combination. I am exclusively applying for remote only items, but buddies are not as discriminating. Still, the number is attention grabbing.

carabiner 3y ago

2500 apps is with his wife and brother helping. 46 phone screens out of that, a 1.8% conversion rate, is totally realistic. My rate was 6% but I was very targeted. I had 32 phone screens. These usually only take 30 minutes and don't require much prep. > maybe the market has shifted drastically You're catching on. This is the worst job market in 20 years, far worse than the 2009 recession. In 2009, tons of college kids were still getting in Amazon but new grads today are struggling to find anything. This is a tectonic shift causing mountains to crumble, and we will be feeling the effects for decades.

buildbot 3y ago
Is it really? Because unemployment numbers don't line up with it being the worst market in 20 years.
- Volundr 3y ago
  Overall unemployment or are you looking at tech specific numbers? Anecdotally I just went through the hardest job search of my career, and many people I know have either just gone through the same or still are. I don't have numbers to it up, but it certainly feels like a rough time to be looking to me.
- tayo42 3y ago
  send 10 applications out now and see what your response is like
antisthenes 3y ago
> In 2009, tons of college kids were still getting in Amazon Clearly, "tons" of kids getting into 1 company (out of several thousand just public ones), is a great indicator. Just for reference, I actually lived through the 11% unemployment out of college. The market for fresh grads was absolutely brutal. A good 20-30% of my cohort never recovered and never broke into higher-paying white collar jobs and still works in jobs that don't require a college degree. It was so bad, that the fresh grads of those years coined the term "lost generation". Millions of fresh grads just couldn't break into adulting for several years.

vehementi 3y ago

Yeah I'd love to see what the conversion rate is on actual referrals.

tennisflyi 3y ago

I’m not spending time to tailor my resume to get ghosted.

jmye 3y ago
If not tailoring it still gets you interviews, then great. But if you're not getting interviews, and you're refusing to do basic things to help yourself, that seems silly and self-defeating, especially if it's an appealing role or company. As a non-dev, I have between a 90-95% response rate when I do apply because I tailor my resume, and I apply to roles strategically and intentionally. I don't begrudge people who either have high success rates without doing that work, or who don't care about a lower success rate if it means spending less time on the process, but I don't get the people who hate the process so much that they intentionally torpedo themselves because of it.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  Chances are, the algorithmic/automation that is at the top of the funnel filtering out 90% of incoming resumes doesn’t know or care if the resume it deletes is carefully hand-tailored with love for weeks or if it’s been shotgunned to 1000 companies.
  - jmye 3y ago
    If you’re hand-tailoring it, and you’re still getting knocked out by the system, you’re doing a poor job of it and should probably ask for help. The endless complaints about ATS and whatever else almost always come from people with objectively poorly written resumes or who are applying to jobs they’re not even slightly qualified for.

scruple 3y ago

I feel incredibly lucky that I haven't actually applied for any programming job since my first. I've walked through the back door into my last 4 employers through my network. I'm 20 years in. Don't get me wrong, I'm still interviewing, but the process has moved incredibly fast for me every single time I put it out to my network that I was open. Just this year, in fact, I put it out that I was looking, on a Tuesday, and I had multiple phone screens set up by that Thursday and Friday. Interviews with 5 companies the following week, followed up by additional interviews that same week, and ultimately I had 3 offers and accepted a new position inside of 10 days. I wish everyone could have this sort of experience because I have the sense that (from my own personal experience, to some degree, but especially anecdotes like the OP) that it's a really, really rough out there for most people.

efficax 3y ago

I have only ever applied to 2 jobs at once, where one was a definite fit and another was just to have an option. Except one single case, I've always gotten interviews and offers at both companies. We're out there, just weirdly lucky people. But also I know where to apply and where not to apply, and having a very narrowly tailored application/cover letter makes a huge difference in getting to the top of the pile (something I know from working with hiring departments).