4 ms·

Cool idea! Seems like car thieves could probably just carry around another device to hack it, but certainly could be a deterrent. I don’t know much about it bu

by soared 3y ago

Cool idea! Seems like car thieves could probably just carry around another device to hack it, but certainly could be a deterrent. I don’t know much about it but it seems like a key is supposed to be the password for the car, so seemingly the key is where improvements could be made. Like add unique and random differences in the metal on each key and have the key slot read those and only turn on the car if it matches (since I guess the metal bumps are easily bypassed by thieves?) Or couldn’t the bumps on keys just be replaced by.. pretty much anything that is physically secure and not multiple hundreds of years old technology? Credit card chips, magnet strips, 2fa fobs, fingerprint sensors, etc?

pc86 3y ago
> Like add unique and random differences in the metal on each key and have the key slot read those and only turn on the car if it matches So turn a $100 ignition switch assembly into a $3,000 1-of-1 monstrosity? Would you need to replace the entire ignition assembly if you lose your keys, or would you be able to generate a key from the ignition assembly (or VIN or other unique identifier)? Thieves would probably just do that for high end vehicles anyway. > Or couldn’t the bumps on keys just be replaced by.. pretty much anything that is physically secure and not multiple hundreds of years old technology? Isn't this exactly what push-to-start tech is? I'm not sure the percentage of vehicles that have push-to-start at this point but I'd imagine it's well into the majority, and increasing.
wongarsu 3y ago
High security door keys commonly use magnets embedded in the key as an additional security layer. A lot harder to pick by hand, and also doesn't appear in photographs of the key. For car keys manufacturers try to get away from physical keys for years, and for a remote keyfob it's just a cost question. Bidirectional communication allows for good cryptography with challenge-response protocol, but costs more than unidirectional. But then people want to be able to open their car when the battery of their fob is dead ...
incahoots 3y ago
I imagine the purpose is to extend the timer when attempting to steal a vehicle. Ford had their dial pad on their vehicles for the longest time to prevent entry if you were using a non factory key to enter. I always thought that was a neat feature, but heavily under utilized.
ilyt 3y ago
The hacks that are being used are bypassing the authentication device so improving authentication device is pointless.

by soared 3y ago

pc86 3y ago

> Like add unique and random differences in the metal on each key and have the key slot read those and only turn on the car if it matches So turn a $100 ignition switch assembly into a $3,000 1-of-1 monstrosity? Would you need to replace the entire ignition assembly if you lose your keys, or would you be able to generate a key from the ignition assembly (or VIN or other unique identifier)? Thieves would probably just do that for high end vehicles anyway. > Or couldn’t the bumps on keys just be replaced by.. pretty much anything that is physically secure and not multiple hundreds of years old technology? Isn't this exactly what push-to-start tech is? I'm not sure the percentage of vehicles that have push-to-start at this point but I'd imagine it's well into the majority, and increasing.

wongarsu 3y ago

High security door keys commonly use magnets embedded in the key as an additional security layer. A lot harder to pick by hand, and also doesn't appear in photographs of the key. For car keys manufacturers try to get away from physical keys for years, and for a remote keyfob it's just a cost question. Bidirectional communication allows for good cryptography with challenge-response protocol, but costs more than unidirectional. But then people want to be able to open their car when the battery of their fob is dead ...

incahoots 3y ago

I imagine the purpose is to extend the timer when attempting to steal a vehicle. Ford had their dial pad on their vehicles for the longest time to prevent entry if you were using a non factory key to enter. I always thought that was a neat feature, but heavily under utilized.

ilyt 3y ago

The hacks that are being used are bypassing the authentication device so improving authentication device is pointless.