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No, it is the correct approach. It is somewhat a zero-sum game at least in urban centers. Driving is cheap because free and cheap parking is widely available, a

No, it is the correct approach. It is somewhat a zero-sum game at least in urban centers. Driving is cheap because free and cheap parking is widely available, and car speed is prioritized over other factors including pedestrian safety. Some of the huge volume of parking has to be given over to other transit modes, which will increase demand and eventually price for what remains. Urban speed limits need to be lower, pedestrians need to have more and safer ways to cross, which will also lower average speeds. All of this will make driving less pleasant and convenient, the cost of making walking safer and easier. As it is driving is "artificially" easy, the consequence of decades of it being prioritized very highly. It needs to come down somewhat.

the_snooze 3y ago
And even when cities invest in non-car transit, cars will still steal those resources. It's not uncommon in my city to see cars idling on bus lanes, or gig delivery workers parking in protected bike lines inside the bollards.
- giraffe_lady 3y ago
  Yeah where I am there is little and half-assed bike infrastructure. Cyclists facetiously and bitterly call the bike lanes "uber lanes." They are simply painted and unbuffered, unenforced. Extra parking in residential areas and loading, ride share, and delivery space everywhere else. Cyclists ride in the lane or not at all, and then are blamed for being there when we're injured or killed in traffic.
  - AlotOfReading 3y ago
    I used to knock on these people's windshields to ask them to move on busy roads. I had to stop doing that after one person tried to run me over a few blocks later (they missed and hit the sidewalk). Others were content to simply scream, or back up onto me.
josephcsible 3y ago
> It is somewhat a zero-sum game at least in urban centers. Driving is cheap because free and cheap parking is widely available, and car speed is prioritized over other factors including pedestrian safety. I've never seen an urban center where "free and cheap parking is widely available", or one with a speed limit above 25.
- giraffe_lady 3y ago
  Chicago for example has both. Phoenix, las vegas. As do a number of medium-large cities in the southeast like raleigh, tampa, charleston SC. Maybe not cities that come to mind first when talking about urban centers but they are million+ population agglomerations with plentiful parking and serious pedestrian death problems. Tens of millions of americans live in these "small" cities of around a million, so trends across them end up affecting a huge population. Another factor is that urban speed limits vary widely in how much they are actually limits. Research is clear on the fact that road design has at least as strong an influence on driver behavior as posted limits do. Without rigorous enforcement & given the wide streets common in these places, driver behavior tends towards interpreting the limit as the minimum speed they are entitled to, rather than the maximum to be attained only when safe. And finally neither I nor anyone else here know what you've seen so that's a very silly limit to place on the conversation.
- EatingWithForks 3y ago
  I've been to NYC where free and cheap parking is on nearly every major and minor street. I would consider it widely available. Yes, trying to find a parking spot is a nightmare but that doesn't mean it isn't widely available generally.
  - everdrive 3y ago
    >Yes, trying to find a parking spot is a nightmare but that doesn't mean it isn't widely available generally. But that’s exactly what it means. It’s not available to people. Someone else already parked there.
    - 3y ago

the_snooze 3y ago

And even when cities invest in non-car transit, cars will still steal those resources. It's not uncommon in my city to see cars idling on bus lanes, or gig delivery workers parking in protected bike lines inside the bollards.

giraffe_lady 3y ago
Yeah where I am there is little and half-assed bike infrastructure. Cyclists facetiously and bitterly call the bike lanes "uber lanes." They are simply painted and unbuffered, unenforced. Extra parking in residential areas and loading, ride share, and delivery space everywhere else. Cyclists ride in the lane or not at all, and then are blamed for being there when we're injured or killed in traffic.
- AlotOfReading 3y ago
  I used to knock on these people's windshields to ask them to move on busy roads. I had to stop doing that after one person tried to run me over a few blocks later (they missed and hit the sidewalk). Others were content to simply scream, or back up onto me.

josephcsible 3y ago

> It is somewhat a zero-sum game at least in urban centers. Driving is cheap because free and cheap parking is widely available, and car speed is prioritized over other factors including pedestrian safety. I've never seen an urban center where "free and cheap parking is widely available", or one with a speed limit above 25.

giraffe_lady 3y ago
Chicago for example has both. Phoenix, las vegas. As do a number of medium-large cities in the southeast like raleigh, tampa, charleston SC. Maybe not cities that come to mind first when talking about urban centers but they are million+ population agglomerations with plentiful parking and serious pedestrian death problems. Tens of millions of americans live in these "small" cities of around a million, so trends across them end up affecting a huge population. Another factor is that urban speed limits vary widely in how much they are actually limits. Research is clear on the fact that road design has at least as strong an influence on driver behavior as posted limits do. Without rigorous enforcement & given the wide streets common in these places, driver behavior tends towards interpreting the limit as the minimum speed they are entitled to, rather than the maximum to be attained only when safe. And finally neither I nor anyone else here know what you've seen so that's a very silly limit to place on the conversation.
EatingWithForks 3y ago
I've been to NYC where free and cheap parking is on nearly every major and minor street. I would consider it widely available. Yes, trying to find a parking spot is a nightmare but that doesn't mean it isn't widely available generally.
- everdrive 3y ago
  >Yes, trying to find a parking spot is a nightmare but that doesn't mean it isn't widely available generally. But that’s exactly what it means. It’s not available to people. Someone else already parked there.
  - 3y ago