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This goes to show just how superficial and backwards the American car industry is. You can do the job of a $50,000 pickup using a machine that is half the size
by asdfigandfiono 3y ago
This goes to show just how superficial and backwards the American car industry is. You can do the job of a $50,000 pickup using a machine that is half the size of a Honda Civic, costs $10,000 new, gets 40 MPG, fits in any parking spot, is easy to load, and sells for around $10,000 new. But they look weak and girly.
Vanitas vanitatum, omnia vanitas.
- waiseristy 3y ago> You can do the job of a $50,000 pickup using a machine that is half the size of a Honda Civic No you can’t
- markdown 3y agoFor what the average person uses their $50k pickup for, you most certainly can. Do you really imagine most pickup trucks in the US are hauling bricks on a dirt road up the side of mountains?
- criddell 3y agoYou said it yourself. People aren’t buying trucks for their function. They aren’t hauling bricks up mountain roads. So if it’s not about function, then it’s about something else and a Kei truck might not fill that role. It’s like people who spend thousands of dollars on a wristwatch. They don’t do that because they need to know what time it is.
- tshaddox 3y agoNo, I imagine the average person in the U.S. is using their truck to drive to and from their office job and taking their kids to and from school. And for that these tiny trucks obviously would not work.
- markdown 3y agoSounds like they should be using a sedan, station wagon, or compact SUV
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- menus 3y agoI'm glad the truck bed is coming handy when dropping the kids to school. Sure makes up for all the kids getting crushed by big cars (1) (1) https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/americas-cars-trucks-are-getting-bigger-are-front-blind-zones-children-rcna52109 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/americas-cars-trucks-ar...
- fragmede 3y agoYou think a Kei truck can't make it up a mountain with a load of bricks? It may not be the fastest, and the biggest load of bricks it can haul is gonna be smaller, but let's not pretend a Kei truck can't go to Home Depot and back again with a decent amount of stuff. Like smaller trucks in the US, like the Ford Ranger or Chevy S10, they do just fine if you don't abuse them. If you do, giant 2-ton trucks don't last either.
- rootusrootus 3y agoIt’s not even remotely as capable as a full size truck. Or a compact one for that matter. Edit: Don't be grouchy and just downvote. If you really think a Kei truck with a 1000 pound payload and 60mph [optimistic] top speed is comparable to a full size pickup, explain why. It's the same payload as a Corolla, not a full size body-on-frame pickup. And even then, that completely ignores towing, which is a very common use case for full size trucks today. A Corolla would do -that- better, too. Kei cars are neat, but be realistic.
- p1necone 3y agoYeah but the point is that the vast majority of people buying full sized pickup trucks aren't actually using them for practical purposes, and it turns out that when something becomes a status symbol like that for so long the capabilities diverge from what people that aren't just buying it as a status symbol want.
- dragonwriter 3y ago> Yeah but the point is that the vast majority of people buying full sized pickup trucks aren't actually using them for practical purposes, If they aren't, you can replace them with a cheaper, safer, more fuel efficient vehicle that meets US safety standards and is easier to maintain and register than a Kei, and probably at a comparable or far cheaper initial price than the Kei. If they are using it for a practical purpose, you can't replace it with a Kei. Either way, a Kei is probably the wrong choice for most US buyers. (There are newer import-legal minitrucks that don't have the registration hassles, like Nissan Clipper, which makes the range of situations where the Kei makes a lot of sense outside of particular brand attachment even narrower.)
- p1necone 3y ago> a Kei is probably the wrong choice for most US buyers. > There are newer import-legal minitrucks that don't have the registration hassles, like Nissan Clipper I'm confused - the Nissan Clipper is a Kei truck/van. Kei isn't a brand, it's just a description of a specific style of car (low weight, engine size etc incentivized by the Japanese government).
- zdragnar 3y ago...and aren't allowed on a highway or freeway. They're useless for most consumers.
- greggsy 3y agoI would argue that this form factor could absolutely replace the vast majority of trucks use for delivery and contractor duties in many cities and towns in the US. Edit: flat bed pickup trucks that is, not lorries.
- waiseristy 3y agoThey already have the form factor, it’s called a Toyota Tacoma and Ford Ranger. They are bigger than Kei trucks because they have actual safety features.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoThey are bigger because they need to house 200HP+ engines, which are, in most cases, unnecessary.
- 0xbadcafebee 3y agoCars and trucks 25 years ago had 200HP+ engines with much smaller bodies.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoCars nowadays are larger for improved comfort, not because of safety features. Larger cars aren't inherently safer. Modern safety features, such as airbags, crumple zones, etc., have been around for over twenty years now, but cars have gotten larger. Regardless, the comparison was between Kei trucks and pickup trucks.
- avar 3y ago
- coryrc 3y agoSo long as you never get in a car crash. That's what's holding me back.
- woodruffw 3y agoPure speculation on my part, but from having ridden in one of these Kei trucks (and lots of US trucks): I wouldn't be surprised if American-style trucks get in and cause more accidents per mile, both because of their lesser visibility and weaker cultural norms around speeding and rules of the road ("biggest car wins"). (This doesn't make Kei trucks safer, but it might have the same paradoxical effect as helmets on cyclists[1].) [1]: https://slate.com/technology/2023/01/bike-helmets-cyclist-deaths-do-you-need-to-wear.html https://slate.com/technology/2023/01/bike-helmets-cyclist-de...
- kirse 3y agoAmerican-style trucks get in and cause more accidents per mile They don't. I used to own an F-350 for a race team and when I sold it for a Corolla I had a long argument with my insurance agent as to why the Corolla was going to cost me more to insure. Despite their outrageous cost to own (which you would think would primarily be the driver of insurance fees), apparently large trucks are both stolen much less and get in fewer accidents due to their size. Hard to argue with the insurance company on the stats there.
- woodruffw 3y agoI think we're talking about different things: I was talking about the physical risk to the humans inside and outside of the truck, not the cost of insuring the truck. Trucks can simultaneously be involved in fewer non-injury accidents (meaning preferable insurance terms for you) and be involved in more injurious accidents/produce worse health outcomes. IIHS and NHTSA have figures that are generally consistent with my speculation[1]: 1. Overall car occupant deaths have nearly halved since 1975, but have risen by 25% in the pickup category. 2. Trucks have fewer rollover accidents as a category, but those rollovers that do occur make up a far larger percentage of occupant deaths. 3. Consistent with (2), truck drivers appear to drive without seatbelts more often than other categories do (based on overall incidence in accidents), and suffer higher fatalities as a result. [1]: https://driving-tests.org/driving-statistics/ https://driving-tests.org/driving-statistics/
- 0xbadcafebee 3y agoThey can not replace new pickup truck. A bicycle doesn't replace a motorcycle just because it has two wheels and you can put groceries on it.
- tarxvf 3y agoIt can certainly replace _some_ pickup trucks in the same way that there is overlap between a motorcycle and bicycle for _some_ purposes. I would happily buy a kei truck, but something like an older Toyota Tacoma is my best bet right now.
- asdff 3y agoThe real equivalent of a kei truck in the US I think is a minivan. I see a lot of blue collar workers that use an old beater minivan as a work truck basically. Its an easy engine and platform to work on; something like a honda odyssey shares parts with a civic and most anything else they made in the same era. There is a ton of space when you take out the seats, that locks up unlike a truck bed. The floor is a lot lower than a truck bed which makes it easy to load stuff in and out. You get much better gas mileage than most commercial van platforms. They sell for a few thousand dollars in decent shape used and hold their value.
- spdif899 3y agoN=1, moved into my current home a few years ago and it has a long and steep hill for a driveway (house is downhill from the street). I bought an early-00's pickup truck thinking I'd use it a lot more than I have. It's languishing in the driveway and will probably go up for sale soon. If I could reasonably get and register a Kei truck in my state it would be the perfect replacement, literally all I need is some hauling space for big trash cans, and the occasional Home Depot run. If they made them electric I'd already be getting one!
- smazga 3y agoMy kei truck is actually a replacement for my Tacoma (had to sell it because it was starting to fall apart). I wanted something to fill the gap. It's always nice to have a truck bed available for hauling random stuff, but it was during the used car boom and Tacomas seem to hold their value (everything was expensive). Not since I first got my license have I had so much fun driving. It's like a right-hand drive, manual transmission go-kart. I've hauled bikes, lumber, furniture, rocks and soil for landscaping. Unfortunately, it's no good on the highway, so long distances are out, and your knees are the crumple zone, so I drive the same way I bike...hyper-vigilant and try to anticipate danger. Still worth it. Not trying to persuade you, I just love to talk about my truck!
- manuelabeledo 3y ago> You can do the job of a $50,000 pickup... I would say that a non insignificant portion of pickup truck owners, don't even need a pick up truck to begin with.
- criddell 3y agoI think that’s why big shared fleets will never really take off. People don’t seem to mind spending a lot more on their vehicle than what they really need to. People spend $50k because they want that truck, not because they need it.
- 7speter 3y agoBig shared fleets of cars seems like a great idea until you end up with the one with the backseat covered in day old vomit… in July
- VectorLock 3y agoCars are pretty much the defacto status item in the US, so it makes sense for people to want to "fake it til they make it."
- SoftTalker 3y agoSame reason many people buy Teslas
- fragmede 3y agoTo be fair, the first gen Nissan Leaf was a piece of crap though.
- manuelabeledo 3y agoIt was cheaper too. The cheapest Model S you could buy back in 2012 was ~$70,000, while the Leaf started at half of that in 2010, ~$35,000.
- 3y ago
- weberer 3y ago>But they look weak and girly. If you've read the article, you'd see its because these vehicles don't conform to Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards.
- zokier 3y agoNor EPA emissions regulations.
- p3rls 3y agoPlus, looking girly is totally different than looking small. They look like utility vehicles to me, but then again I had a miata and a grom...
- freedrock87 3y agoA motor vehicle that is at least 25 years old can be lawfully imported into the U.S. without regard to whether it complies with all applicable FMVSS. Such a vehicle would be entered under Box 1 on the HS-7 Declaration form to be given to Customs at the time of importation. If you wish to see that form, you may download a copy from our website at nhtsa.gov/importing-vehicle. You should note that the 25 year period runs from the date of the vehicle's manufacture. If the date of manufacture is not identified on a label permanently affixed to the vehicle by its original manufacturer, to establish the age of the vehicle, you should have documentation available such as an invoice showing the date the vehicle was first sold or a registration document showing that the vehicle was registered at least 25 years ago. Absent such information, a statement from a recognized vehicle historical society identifying the age of the vehicle could be used. https://www.nhtsa.gov/importing-vehicle/importation-and-certification-faqs#:~:text=A%20motor%20vehicle%20that%20is,at%20the%20time%20of%20importation https://www.nhtsa.gov/importing-vehicle/importation-and-cert....
- sudosysgen 3y agoUntrue. Any vehicle that is more than 25 years is exempted from the FMVSS.
- Georgelemental 3y ago
- dirtyid 3y agoWell are they actually weak vs a pickup? I'd love a Kei car if I can pay 10k to survive a crash against mass monsters out there.
- wrycoder 3y agoThey will do better than a bicycle. Assuming you stick to roads and speeds that you would use for a bicycle.
- UlisesAC4 3y agoWhile doing less emissions related to ICEs.
- astrea 3y agoAlternatively, you could get a vehicle like this and _not_ be concerned about what other people think about you. Or you could continue to fight imaginary battles against people who simply like something different than you.
- agloe_dreams 3y agoFWIIW, I would’t be shocked to find out these have worse emissions.
- agloe_dreams 3y ago(To be clear, The EPA said this as well and it was part of the original crackdown.)
- dragonwriter 3y ago> You can do the job of a $50,000 pickup using a machine that is half the size of a Honda Civic You can't, though: “half-ton” pickups start much lower than $50k and near universally have a 1,500+ lb cargo capacity (the half-ton designation is historical and almost never actually meant what it seems to, quater-ton is even worse.) Seems more competitive with the $27K Hyundai Santa Cruz, with similar cargo capacity (by weight), 40 MPG mileage, US new vehicle standards compliance, but trading off a shorter bed length for a second row of seating.
- datavirtue 3y ago"“half-ton” pickups start much lower than $50k" Where!? I just priced a few 2010 F-150s at $30-40k.
- datavirtue 3y agoI can't tow a boat with that...so please. Also, yes, vehicles are identity expressions in America. No way around that...just is what it is.