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(Haven’t read the article.) Our perception of alien life may be profoundly constrained by the human lens through which we examine the cosmos. We must acknowle

(Haven’t read the article.) Our perception of alien life may be profoundly constrained by the human lens through which we examine the cosmos. We must acknowledge that all our scientific knowledge, including our conception of life, is a product of human cognition. This cognition has evolved under Earth's specific conditions, thereby deeply influencing our understanding of what life is. We've come to associate life with cells, DNA, and carbon-based compounds, simply because these are the frameworks we're most familiar with. Yet, life elsewhere in the universe may defy these constructs. It could hinge on principles entirely alien to our comprehension, making it "life" in the truest sense of the word. Consequently, our current definitions might fail to recognize or comprehend such forms of existence. This brings us to the philosophical and cognitive underpinnings of this idea. It echoes solipsistic notions, where only one's mind is certain to exist, and the brain-in-a-vat theory, which asserts our inability to differentiate between real experiences and those simulated by our brains. These philosophies question the authenticity of our perceived reality and force us to reconsider our mental models. Such introspection is crucial when we think about potential alien life. For instance, we associate green vegetation with life because of Earth-based chlorophyll. But should we find green plants on another planet, can we instinctively conclude that they indicate life as we know it? Probably not, as such assumptions hinge on our Earth-centric model of life. To overcome this limitation, we might need to redefine life in a more universal context. We may have to accept that some entities might exist beyond our grasp of understanding and should develop novel tools that seek not only life as we know it, but any form of organized complexity that could denote a radically different kind of life. Such a perspective fundamentally changes the narrative of our search for alien life. It indicates a need to drastically reshape our understanding to truly appreciate the universe's potential diversity and complexity. It's a humbling reminder of how much we don't know, as well as a hopeful prompt of the extraordinary discoveries that could await us.

pyinstallwoes 3y ago
Radical idea: anything that emits a signal is a life sign.
- zokier 3y ago
  That's what SETI has been looking for, but it also sets very high bar; microbes are not exactly known for sending signals to space.
  - eesmith 3y ago
    Though to be fair, SETI is specifically looking for "intelligent" life. It may be possible to identify biosignatures on other planets, like looking for evidence of atmospheric gasses far from ordinary chemical equilibrium (like how microbes emit methane here on Earth), or unusual spectra, like spotting the signature of chlorophyll absorption.
  - sandworm101 3y ago
    Other than bioluminessence. One possible means of detecting life on water/ice worlds could be glowing oceans on the night/dark sides of exoplanets.
  - pyinstallwoes 3y ago
    I mean, I am emphasizing anything with any measurable signal is life.
zokier 3y ago
"weird life" is pretty basic idea in astrobiology. The scientists in the field are very much aware of the concept. From the article > plenty of other experts suggest that life elsewhere might be so different, so fundamentally alien, as to be unrecognizable to us as life. Surprisingly, a pretty big question amongst scientists searching for life on other planets is what life even means. Would we know it when we saw it? --- > We may have to accept that some entities might exist beyond our grasp of understanding and should develop novel tools that seek not only life as we know it, but any form of organized complexity that could denote a radically different kind of life. Maybe at some point, but right now we haven't even scrathed the surface in the search, and with limited resources it makes sense to start first by looking for earth-like life, and eventually expand the search for weirder things. > Such a perspective fundamentally changes the narrative of our search for alien life. I don't really find that to be the case. If anything, the weird life narrative might be overemphasized in the popsci/scifi communities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_chauvinism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_chauvinism
- svachalek 3y ago
  Totally. This comes up every time the Fermi paradox is discussed but it's a distraction. It's not like we are running out of places to look for carbon/water biology, we haven't even begun. And if we're going to start looking, it totally makes sense to start looking for what obviously works and only requires some simple conditions that are easily found throughout the galaxy.
bluGill 3y ago
Not as much as you would think. Carbon and water are common and have some interesting chemical properties that are not common overall. While other organizations are possible, between the other elements being less common, and how much more difficult the chemistry is the odds of it are low.
mellosouls 3y ago
(Haven’t read the article.) Its not paywalled. Our perception of alien life may be profoundly constrained by the human lens through which we examine the cosmos. Here's the subtitle: Scientists disagree about what life on other planets even means. Would we know it when we saw it?
NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
> Yet, life elsewhere in the universe may defy these constructs. It could hinge on principles entirely alien to our comprehension, making it "life" in the truest sense of the word. Consequently, our current definitions might fail to recognize or comprehend such forms of existence. This is a cop-out. It might make for a good episode (or a bad one) of Star Trek, but in the real world, life's going to be made out of particles. Likely even out of atoms/molecules. It will be recognizable, in that it is self-sustaining... it creates itself. It will, for lack of a better term, "do things". The chemistry might be weird (hell, we almost expect that). The effects might be subtle (at minimum, we imagine we'll need microscopes, but it gets more difficult from there). But none of these things are incomprehensible. "Incomprehensible" is probably nearly non-overlapping with "life", if not outright incompatible. > But should we find green plants on another planet, can we instinctively conclude that they indicate life as we know it? Probably not, as such assumptions hinge on our Earth-centric model of life. This is incoherent. I don't even know how to parse it. "We found photosynthetic organisms on another planet, but are they life?" Like, seriously? Are you saying that plants aren't really alive here on Earth, or that plants are only alive if on Earth? If I take a potted plant to Mars, "is it really life as we know it"? > We may have to accept that some entities might exist beyond our grasp of understanding and should develop novel tools that seek not only life as we know it, I think that some people learn to think like this because their mouth-breathing public school system teachers gave them B+s for this bullshit in 7th grade. It's bizarrely bad. Have you never listened to yourself? > Such a perspective fundamentally changes the narrative of our search for alien life. Yes. It hobbles the search in any number of ways. Entire generations of children grow up thinking this poorly. Influencers and politicians start thinking such is somehow clever or insightful, and money/effort is wasted on it.
- harshalizee 3y ago
  Why can't you fathom that something cannot be incomprehensible to the human mind? Imagine an ant sitting on your arm. Do you believe it's cognizant and aware of your existence? Now imagine humanity being the ant to a higher intelligence.
  - The_Colonel 3y ago
wkat4242 3y ago
> Such introspection is crucial when we think about potential alien life. For instance, we associate green vegetation with life because of Earth-based chlorophyll. But should we find green plants on another planet, can we instinctively conclude that they indicate life as we know it? Probably not, as such assumptions hinge on our Earth-centric model of life. Not really. We have many plants that aren't green even here. If we find an alien plant, we'll consider it alive because it's a plant. That assessment already implies life. Even if life takes other shapes on the planets we can reach, we will find it because of the structures and organisation it generates. So far we've found nothing but basic chemistry.

pyinstallwoes 3y ago

Radical idea: anything that emits a signal is a life sign.

zokier 3y ago
That's what SETI has been looking for, but it also sets very high bar; microbes are not exactly known for sending signals to space.
- eesmith 3y ago
  Though to be fair, SETI is specifically looking for "intelligent" life. It may be possible to identify biosignatures on other planets, like looking for evidence of atmospheric gasses far from ordinary chemical equilibrium (like how microbes emit methane here on Earth), or unusual spectra, like spotting the signature of chlorophyll absorption.
- sandworm101 3y ago
  Other than bioluminessence. One possible means of detecting life on water/ice worlds could be glowing oceans on the night/dark sides of exoplanets.
- pyinstallwoes 3y ago
  I mean, I am emphasizing anything with any measurable signal is life.

zokier 3y ago

"weird life" is pretty basic idea in astrobiology. The scientists in the field are very much aware of the concept. From the article > plenty of other experts suggest that life elsewhere might be so different, so fundamentally alien, as to be unrecognizable to us as life. Surprisingly, a pretty big question amongst scientists searching for life on other planets is what life even means. Would we know it when we saw it? --- > We may have to accept that some entities might exist beyond our grasp of understanding and should develop novel tools that seek not only life as we know it, but any form of organized complexity that could denote a radically different kind of life. Maybe at some point, but right now we haven't even scrathed the surface in the search, and with limited resources it makes sense to start first by looking for earth-like life, and eventually expand the search for weirder things. > Such a perspective fundamentally changes the narrative of our search for alien life. I don't really find that to be the case. If anything, the weird life narrative might be overemphasized in the popsci/scifi communities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_chauvinism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_chauvinism

svachalek 3y ago
Totally. This comes up every time the Fermi paradox is discussed but it's a distraction. It's not like we are running out of places to look for carbon/water biology, we haven't even begun. And if we're going to start looking, it totally makes sense to start looking for what obviously works and only requires some simple conditions that are easily found throughout the galaxy.

bluGill 3y ago

Not as much as you would think. Carbon and water are common and have some interesting chemical properties that are not common overall. While other organizations are possible, between the other elements being less common, and how much more difficult the chemistry is the odds of it are low.

mellosouls 3y ago

(Haven’t read the article.) Its not paywalled. Our perception of alien life may be profoundly constrained by the human lens through which we examine the cosmos. Here's the subtitle: Scientists disagree about what life on other planets even means. Would we know it when we saw it?

NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago

> Yet, life elsewhere in the universe may defy these constructs. It could hinge on principles entirely alien to our comprehension, making it "life" in the truest sense of the word. Consequently, our current definitions might fail to recognize or comprehend such forms of existence. This is a cop-out. It might make for a good episode (or a bad one) of Star Trek, but in the real world, life's going to be made out of particles. Likely even out of atoms/molecules. It will be recognizable, in that it is self-sustaining... it creates itself. It will, for lack of a better term, "do things". The chemistry might be weird (hell, we almost expect that). The effects might be subtle (at minimum, we imagine we'll need microscopes, but it gets more difficult from there). But none of these things are incomprehensible. "Incomprehensible" is probably nearly non-overlapping with "life", if not outright incompatible. > But should we find green plants on another planet, can we instinctively conclude that they indicate life as we know it? Probably not, as such assumptions hinge on our Earth-centric model of life. This is incoherent. I don't even know how to parse it. "We found photosynthetic organisms on another planet, but are they life?" Like, seriously? Are you saying that plants aren't really alive here on Earth, or that plants are only alive if on Earth? If I take a potted plant to Mars, "is it really life as we know it"? > We may have to accept that some entities might exist beyond our grasp of understanding and should develop novel tools that seek not only life as we know it, I think that some people learn to think like this because their mouth-breathing public school system teachers gave them B+s for this bullshit in 7th grade. It's bizarrely bad. Have you never listened to yourself? > Such a perspective fundamentally changes the narrative of our search for alien life. Yes. It hobbles the search in any number of ways. Entire generations of children grow up thinking this poorly. Influencers and politicians start thinking such is somehow clever or insightful, and money/effort is wasted on it.

harshalizee 3y ago
Why can't you fathom that something cannot be incomprehensible to the human mind? Imagine an ant sitting on your arm. Do you believe it's cognizant and aware of your existence? Now imagine humanity being the ant to a higher intelligence.
- The_Colonel 3y ago

wkat4242 3y ago

> Such introspection is crucial when we think about potential alien life. For instance, we associate green vegetation with life because of Earth-based chlorophyll. But should we find green plants on another planet, can we instinctively conclude that they indicate life as we know it? Probably not, as such assumptions hinge on our Earth-centric model of life. Not really. We have many plants that aren't green even here. If we find an alien plant, we'll consider it alive because it's a plant. That assessment already implies life. Even if life takes other shapes on the planets we can reach, we will find it because of the structures and organisation it generates. So far we've found nothing but basic chemistry.