5 ms·

Crazy guy who did this here. Before I made the video, I spent the last 18 months manipulating the court system against the TSA. The TSA does not want to add m

Crazy guy who did this here. Before I made the video, I spent the last 18 months manipulating the court system against the TSA. The TSA does not want to add me to any no-fly list (or more realistically, the "selectee list") because every time a legal battle starts, I'm entitled to more and more discovery in court, and more and more of their lies come out. --Jon

snprbob86 15y ago
::hug:: Thank you. Keep on fighting the good fight man.
toomuchtodo 15y ago
#shutupandtakemymoney Thank you for your hard work.
tsaoutourpants 15y ago
You guys are very welcome... I appreciate the support, and I feel like on this board it's coming from my own people, so thank you!!
- ktizo 15y ago
  This may not be the ideal forum for lighthearted sillyness, but I still think you have won 1000 internets and a life supply of adorable kittens. Well done ;)
  - MrMan 15y ago
    You are lucky that this thread is about a vaguely tech-related external topic. In any thread where money was at stake, you would be down-voted for making it more difficult for money and entrepreneurs to find each other. In the future please limit your comments to topics relevant to the ongoing tech bubble and attendant charlatanism.
    - ktizo 15y ago
      I am really, really sorry for risking upsetting the frictionless flow of money in the pursuit of comedy.
- ColinDabritz 15y ago
  I deeply appreciate your effort here. Is there anything that we could do directly to help you? Maybe a Kickstarter to help with some legal costs?
- grandalf 15y ago
  Yes, thanks for your courage in fighting government tyranny.
velshin 15y ago
@Jon Seriously awesome work. Thank you! People like yourself raising everyone's awareness are one of the few hopes we have of avoiding the dystopian world that @ck2 and others have already resigned themselves to.
tricolon 15y ago
> manipulating the court system against the TSA Can you elaborate on what you mean?
- maxerickson 15y ago
  They have been blogging about it... http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/ http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/
  - junto 15y ago
    Wow, this post is amazing: http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/underwear-bomber-victim-us-government-intentionally-allowed-bomb-on-plane/ http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/underwear-b... If I read this right, there is a suggestion that the US authorities deliberately put a terrorist on a plane with a bomb for propaganda purposes?
rokhayakebe 15y ago
This is why HN is the second best community online. Authors are very likely to be here, and add to the discussion.
- gierach 15y ago
  What's number one?
  - junto 15y ago
    HN. It is both the first and the second. A bit like the Fight Club rules.
enigmabomb 15y ago
I hate the scanners also, and I'm glad to support you in defending our freedom.
whiletruefork 15y ago
This is awesome. The time/cost of legal battles deter most folks, so I am glad you are doing what other people can't.
dlinder 15y ago
You are honestly one of my heroes. Please keep up the good fight. I haven't flown in over a year, and have never gone through a scanner, and while I love having discovered so much more of my dear old USA by car, the nearly 20K miles I've driven are starting to take a toll! ps My favorite part of not flying has been discovering Kansas City BBQ joints. I stop each way between IL and CA. Yum. Silver lining, right?
- dfischer 15y ago
  Can you recommend some of the best?
  - dlinder 15y ago
    My absolute favorite is Oklahoma Joe's: http://www.oklahomajoesbbq.com/ http://www.oklahomajoesbbq.com/ But really, it's kind of hard to go wrong in KC.
einhverfr 15y ago
As a fellow American, I must sincerely thank you for your service to my country.
- haukur 15y ago
  As an Icelander I must ask about the origin of your nickname. Einhverfur means autistic in modern Icelandic. Einhverfr would mean the same if the term had existed in Old Norse.
  - einhverfr 15y ago
    A friend gave it to me. But ein- can mean a number of things (the one, also according to Kris Kershaw "paragon of") in Old Norse, right? As can hverf- (generally related to transitively or intransitively turning)? I always joked that it could mean the "one who turns things around" or "the paragon of shifty people." I assume the tie to autism comes from the idea that it's turning within oneself?
    - haukur 15y ago
      Yes, you're correct. Do you study Old Norse? When new technology or terms arrive in Iceland usually new words are created, or old words are given a new meaning (as opposed to adopting foreign words, such as telephone (sími in Icelandic, which is an archaic word meaning wire). Einhverfur is one of those, I suppose. It can also mean what you said.
      - einhverfr 15y ago
        I am studying Old Norse, along with Old English. It's a fascinating language.
        haukur 15y ago
        You might want to visit Iceland, then. Modern Icelandic is very similar to Old Norse and to a lesser extent to Old English. The pronunciation has changed a little since the 10th century. And there are other things to enjoy, such as outdoors thermal pools. You could strike up a conversation about the language with local people in a "hot pot" (heitur pottur), as we call the outdoors jacuzzies. :)
jQueryIsAwesome 15y ago
Love you man. You should have a donation button on your website; because you are awesome and because you may get involved in a very expensive lawsuit with the government.
- tsaoutourpants 15y ago
  There is! :) Collecting donations for my lawsuit to go to the Supreme Court. PayPal: jon [at] fourtentech.com
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]
ahmadss 15y ago
hey jon - my wife is an attorney in DC and her big law firm often takes on pro bono civil liberties cases. let me know if you're interested and i can put you in touch with her.
ForrestN 15y ago
I laud your efforts against the TSA on the issue of body scanners. It was a huge waste, and they aren't effective. But I think you'll be more effective against the body scanners if you drop the right-wing crankery at the end. The fear-mongering about terrorists isn't helpful. If they want to pull something off, they will, whatever kind of detector we're using. "Placing us all in danger" is Fox News rhetoric. The fact that these scanners were a mistake doesn't imply that we should necessarily privatize the TSA. It needs a huge amount of reform. But there's no evidence that privatization wouldn't lead to the same kind of risk-taking and incentive problems that we've seen come to such spectacular fruition in the financial sector. As things stand now, we have a clumsy system and there hasn't been a major attack since 9/11. Focus on the ineffectiveness, and the invasion of privacy, not on making people scared or promoting bankrupt ideas about replacing the government with free enterprise.
- dissident 15y ago
  I highly doubt he was being serious when he was "fear mongering". In context it was likely him using the TSA's logic against the scanners. Remember, this guy has been fighting long before this vulnerability was publicly known.
- ForrestN 15y ago
  @dissident: He doesn't sound like he's joking when he talks about this situation placing us in danger. If he's kidding, the presentation is quite poor and he needs to make that clearer. If this video is essentially a persuasive argument that he clearly hopes will turn the tide against these scanners, preposterously subtle sarcasm is one tool he can leave in the toolbox.
- grandalf 15y ago
  This is a bit off topic, but the reason the TSA exists was out of the need to address the liability issue for airlines, not to make anyone safer. It would have been easy enough to just pass a law defining what level of security was needed (there are lots of very secure, private prisons, etc.) and then forcing the private firms to pass frequent breach attempts, etc. The problem with this is that it would result in far more secure (and time consuming) security screening procedures. Around the same time as the TSA was created, the government became the insurer of last resort for terrorism related claims over $1B. This was to avoid the inevitable consequence -- in order to be able to buy insurance against terrorism, airlines would have had to prove to the insurance company that they had reasonable security measures. This would mean a 15-20 minute screening for each passenger, etc. In other words, air travel as we know it would have ended. The simple alternative? Let the government hire the workers and "outsource" the security duty from the private airports and airlines. Nobody is going to successfully sue the government for allowing an attack to occur, and now that it's outside the scope of responsibility of the airlines, the insurance companies are willing to insure against the remaining risk. The $1B ceiling was basically a handout to the insurance industry offered in exchange for bearing a lot of extra risk for free while the government got its act together post 9/11. If airport screeners were private firms, then even if the insurance industry didn't force quality screening to occur, there would be public demand for it once reports of weapons being successfully brought through. In today's world, it's a crime to even try to bring a fake/harmless weapon through, so the public is essentially forbidden from independently auditing the screeners. The blogger is playing it safe by using a metal case, but that only tests the metal/object detection capabilities and doesn't test for successful detection of any of the other potentially dangerous items (which are also likely to be easy to smuggle through).
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
jeremyarussell 15y ago
It's already been said, but can't be said enough, thank you for fighting the good fight. Thank you for being the one who stands up instead of the one who lets others stand on his behalf.

snprbob86 15y ago

::hug:: Thank you. Keep on fighting the good fight man.

toomuchtodo 15y ago

#shutupandtakemymoney Thank you for your hard work.

tsaoutourpants 15y ago

You guys are very welcome... I appreciate the support, and I feel like on this board it's coming from my own people, so thank you!!

ktizo 15y ago
This may not be the ideal forum for lighthearted sillyness, but I still think you have won 1000 internets and a life supply of adorable kittens. Well done ;)
- MrMan 15y ago
  You are lucky that this thread is about a vaguely tech-related external topic. In any thread where money was at stake, you would be down-voted for making it more difficult for money and entrepreneurs to find each other. In the future please limit your comments to topics relevant to the ongoing tech bubble and attendant charlatanism.
  - ktizo 15y ago
    I am really, really sorry for risking upsetting the frictionless flow of money in the pursuit of comedy.
ColinDabritz 15y ago
I deeply appreciate your effort here. Is there anything that we could do directly to help you? Maybe a Kickstarter to help with some legal costs?
grandalf 15y ago
Yes, thanks for your courage in fighting government tyranny.

velshin 15y ago

@Jon Seriously awesome work. Thank you! People like yourself raising everyone's awareness are one of the few hopes we have of avoiding the dystopian world that @ck2 and others have already resigned themselves to.

tricolon 15y ago

> manipulating the court system against the TSA Can you elaborate on what you mean?

maxerickson 15y ago
They have been blogging about it... http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/ http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/
- junto 15y ago
  Wow, this post is amazing: http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/underwear-bomber-victim-us-government-intentionally-allowed-bomb-on-plane/ http://tsaoutofourpants.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/underwear-b... If I read this right, there is a suggestion that the US authorities deliberately put a terrorist on a plane with a bomb for propaganda purposes?

rokhayakebe 15y ago

This is why HN is the second best community online. Authors are very likely to be here, and add to the discussion.

gierach 15y ago
What's number one?
- junto 15y ago
  HN. It is both the first and the second. A bit like the Fight Club rules.

enigmabomb 15y ago

I hate the scanners also, and I'm glad to support you in defending our freedom.

whiletruefork 15y ago

This is awesome. The time/cost of legal battles deter most folks, so I am glad you are doing what other people can't.

dlinder 15y ago

You are honestly one of my heroes. Please keep up the good fight. I haven't flown in over a year, and have never gone through a scanner, and while I love having discovered so much more of my dear old USA by car, the nearly 20K miles I've driven are starting to take a toll! ps My favorite part of not flying has been discovering Kansas City BBQ joints. I stop each way between IL and CA. Yum. Silver lining, right?

dfischer 15y ago
Can you recommend some of the best?
- dlinder 15y ago
  My absolute favorite is Oklahoma Joe's: http://www.oklahomajoesbbq.com/ http://www.oklahomajoesbbq.com/ But really, it's kind of hard to go wrong in KC.

einhverfr 15y ago

As a fellow American, I must sincerely thank you for your service to my country.

haukur 15y ago
As an Icelander I must ask about the origin of your nickname. Einhverfur means autistic in modern Icelandic. Einhverfr would mean the same if the term had existed in Old Norse.
- einhverfr 15y ago
  A friend gave it to me. But ein- can mean a number of things (the one, also according to Kris Kershaw "paragon of") in Old Norse, right? As can hverf- (generally related to transitively or intransitively turning)? I always joked that it could mean the "one who turns things around" or "the paragon of shifty people." I assume the tie to autism comes from the idea that it's turning within oneself?
  - haukur 15y ago
    Yes, you're correct. Do you study Old Norse? When new technology or terms arrive in Iceland usually new words are created, or old words are given a new meaning (as opposed to adopting foreign words, such as telephone (sími in Icelandic, which is an archaic word meaning wire). Einhverfur is one of those, I suppose. It can also mean what you said.
    - einhverfr 15y ago
      I am studying Old Norse, along with Old English. It's a fascinating language.
      - haukur 15y ago
        You might want to visit Iceland, then. Modern Icelandic is very similar to Old Norse and to a lesser extent to Old English. The pronunciation has changed a little since the 10th century. And there are other things to enjoy, such as outdoors thermal pools. You could strike up a conversation about the language with local people in a "hot pot" (heitur pottur), as we call the outdoors jacuzzies. :)

jQueryIsAwesome 15y ago

Love you man. You should have a donation button on your website; because you are awesome and because you may get involved in a very expensive lawsuit with the government.

tsaoutourpants 15y ago
There is! :) Collecting donations for my lawsuit to go to the Supreme Court. PayPal: jon [at] fourtentech.com
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]

ahmadss 15y ago

hey jon - my wife is an attorney in DC and her big law firm often takes on pro bono civil liberties cases. let me know if you're interested and i can put you in touch with her.

ForrestN 15y ago

I laud your efforts against the TSA on the issue of body scanners. It was a huge waste, and they aren't effective. But I think you'll be more effective against the body scanners if you drop the right-wing crankery at the end. The fear-mongering about terrorists isn't helpful. If they want to pull something off, they will, whatever kind of detector we're using. "Placing us all in danger" is Fox News rhetoric. The fact that these scanners were a mistake doesn't imply that we should necessarily privatize the TSA. It needs a huge amount of reform. But there's no evidence that privatization wouldn't lead to the same kind of risk-taking and incentive problems that we've seen come to such spectacular fruition in the financial sector. As things stand now, we have a clumsy system and there hasn't been a major attack since 9/11. Focus on the ineffectiveness, and the invasion of privacy, not on making people scared or promoting bankrupt ideas about replacing the government with free enterprise.

dissident 15y ago
I highly doubt he was being serious when he was "fear mongering". In context it was likely him using the TSA's logic against the scanners. Remember, this guy has been fighting long before this vulnerability was publicly known.
ForrestN 15y ago
@dissident: He doesn't sound like he's joking when he talks about this situation placing us in danger. If he's kidding, the presentation is quite poor and he needs to make that clearer. If this video is essentially a persuasive argument that he clearly hopes will turn the tide against these scanners, preposterously subtle sarcasm is one tool he can leave in the toolbox.
grandalf 15y ago
This is a bit off topic, but the reason the TSA exists was out of the need to address the liability issue for airlines, not to make anyone safer. It would have been easy enough to just pass a law defining what level of security was needed (there are lots of very secure, private prisons, etc.) and then forcing the private firms to pass frequent breach attempts, etc. The problem with this is that it would result in far more secure (and time consuming) security screening procedures. Around the same time as the TSA was created, the government became the insurer of last resort for terrorism related claims over $1B. This was to avoid the inevitable consequence -- in order to be able to buy insurance against terrorism, airlines would have had to prove to the insurance company that they had reasonable security measures. This would mean a 15-20 minute screening for each passenger, etc. In other words, air travel as we know it would have ended. The simple alternative? Let the government hire the workers and "outsource" the security duty from the private airports and airlines. Nobody is going to successfully sue the government for allowing an attack to occur, and now that it's outside the scope of responsibility of the airlines, the insurance companies are willing to insure against the remaining risk. The $1B ceiling was basically a handout to the insurance industry offered in exchange for bearing a lot of extra risk for free while the government got its act together post 9/11. If airport screeners were private firms, then even if the insurance industry didn't force quality screening to occur, there would be public demand for it once reports of weapons being successfully brought through. In today's world, it's a crime to even try to bring a fake/harmless weapon through, so the public is essentially forbidden from independently auditing the screeners. The blogger is playing it safe by using a metal case, but that only tests the metal/object detection capabilities and doesn't test for successful detection of any of the other potentially dangerous items (which are also likely to be easy to smuggle through).

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

jeremyarussell 15y ago

It's already been said, but can't be said enough, thank you for fighting the good fight. Thank you for being the one who stands up instead of the one who lets others stand on his behalf.