4 ms·

The fact that the songs play instantly when you click makes me sad for literally all modern software.

1letterunixname 3y ago
The relative compression is much, much higher for the equivalent of "vector" music over high bit rate "raster" digital audio codecs.
throwaway675309 3y ago
This comment makes zero sense considering that mod/XM type tracker files are mere kilobytes in size as opposed to a streamed OGG or MP3 file which is megabytes.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
Waterluvian 3y ago
Not sure I follow. I just tried with Spotify on my phone and desktop (oooh Electron spooky) and any song plays instantly.
- xp84 3y ago
  Try Apple Music, lol. They’re still working on starting tracks quickly and smoothly.
- p-e-w 3y ago
  It's just a variation of the standard "all modern software is garbage because Facebook and Twitter are garbage" nonsense complaint.
  - zondafan1 3y ago
    Replace "Facebook and Twitter" with "Electron" and you would be right.
    - postalrat 3y ago
      Would these not play instantly in electron too?
      - briandear 3y ago
        If you have 5 terabytes of RAM, electron is perfect. I hate electron and the CTOs that use it almost as much as I had “cross-platform” mobile apps. That sort of garbage is coding to the lowest common denominator of device rather than optimizing the app for the capabilities of the hardware.
        post-it 3y ago
        > as I had “cross-platform” mobile apps I'm on a four-person team building a React Native app. RN is awful, I'll admit, but it would be impossible to work at the pace we do if we were maintaining fully parallel Android and iOS codebases. Besides, it's the hardware's job to optimize for the capabilities of the SDK.
        tredre3 3y ago
        I was with you for the first paragraph. But that's just despicable thinking: > Besides, it's the hardware's job to optimize for the capabilities of the SDK. You can't possibly blame the hardware manufacturers for how poorly React Native runs. Even if the CPU engineers wanted to target React specifically and make it run better somehow (and you seem to think they should), where would they begin? React sits on top of 35 layers of software abstraction and runs in 2-3 virtual machines, how could they target RN? Assuming they could add magical instructions that benefit React somehow, who's going to patch the 34 lower layers for React to benefit from it? The manufacturers? The React team? You?
        post-it 3y ago
        I don't have any performance issues with React Native[0], so as far as I'm aware the status quo is fine with regards to how well the hardware is optimized for the SDK. The specific SDK I'm referring to is JSCore, obviously everything on top of that is third-party. [0] My main beef with React Native is the total lack of useful stack traces. Also, when running on a device, when you tap Debug before manually setting your dev machine's IP, the app is bricked and you have to delete and reinstall it.
- sealeck 3y ago
  I actually find that Spotify is super buggy. If I switch devices it doesn't work (I have to select the new device at least five times), when I go underground with my phone it's super slow to realise that I've lost connection, and I usually have to restart the app for it to continue playing music.
  - holoduke 3y ago
    Big tech UIs are never made to satisfy the user. They are made to balance you between annoyance and acceptance. Just enough that you wont leave, but still getting frustrated by the aweful mechanics. In a way its also a good thing. Gives room to create a better variant
  - samayylmao 3y ago
    For me switching playback device is quick and reliable if the device is a PC or phone. Whenever I try to select a connected Google speaker... it takes like 3-5 tries. I've found it is more reliable to use voice commands to get the speaker to play Spotify then I can use a phone/PC to select the song/playlist/podcast/etc. but it's kind of frustrating it just doesn't work well to begin with.
  - azemetre 3y ago
    My major issue with Spotify is that they keep changing the UX on me every week. I hate being part of some terrible a/b testing that I didn't consent too. They already have my money, why do they feel the need to tamper with my experience more? It's extremely infuriating. I remember something was posted to HN a while ago about exporting your playlists from Spotify. That's my current hurdle to leaving the platform, if I can do that and whichever service allows me to import these playlists I'll be leaving.
    - gymbeaux 3y ago
      SongShift is what I use. The free version works well enough, and goes either way between Apple Music and Spotify, probably supports other services.
- brk 3y ago
  I think the point is that "all modern software" has all kinds of delays and buffering before playing, in contrast to this site where the audio just plays instantly and reliably.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- ungamedplayer 3y ago
  This is not a consistent experience for everyone.
ziml77 3y ago
They don't though? I just clicked between two tracks a few times. Each time I switch there is a very clear delay between the click and the playback starting. You can even visually tell there's a delay because the row only becomes highlighted when playback of that track starts.
- mdp2021 3y ago
  Check the download graphs in your browser's network activity monitor.
mdp2021 3y ago
> when you click When you click, you download packages between 30kb and 300kb (roughly speaking); the player is surely already in memory - that is your latency. For systems that run immediately on machines with a fraction of power.

The relative compression is much, much higher for the equivalent of "vector" music over high bit rate "raster" digital audio codecs.

throwaway675309 3y ago

This comment makes zero sense considering that mod/XM type tracker files are mere kilobytes in size as opposed to a streamed OGG or MP3 file which is megabytes.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

Waterluvian 3y ago

Not sure I follow. I just tried with Spotify on my phone and desktop (oooh Electron spooky) and any song plays instantly.

xp84 3y ago
Try Apple Music, lol. They’re still working on starting tracks quickly and smoothly.
p-e-w 3y ago
It's just a variation of the standard "all modern software is garbage because Facebook and Twitter are garbage" nonsense complaint.
- zondafan1 3y ago
  Replace "Facebook and Twitter" with "Electron" and you would be right.
  - postalrat 3y ago
    Would these not play instantly in electron too?
    - briandear 3y ago
      If you have 5 terabytes of RAM, electron is perfect. I hate electron and the CTOs that use it almost as much as I had “cross-platform” mobile apps. That sort of garbage is coding to the lowest common denominator of device rather than optimizing the app for the capabilities of the hardware.
      - post-it 3y ago
        > as I had “cross-platform” mobile apps I'm on a four-person team building a React Native app. RN is awful, I'll admit, but it would be impossible to work at the pace we do if we were maintaining fully parallel Android and iOS codebases. Besides, it's the hardware's job to optimize for the capabilities of the SDK.
        tredre3 3y ago
        I was with you for the first paragraph. But that's just despicable thinking: > Besides, it's the hardware's job to optimize for the capabilities of the SDK. You can't possibly blame the hardware manufacturers for how poorly React Native runs. Even if the CPU engineers wanted to target React specifically and make it run better somehow (and you seem to think they should), where would they begin? React sits on top of 35 layers of software abstraction and runs in 2-3 virtual machines, how could they target RN? Assuming they could add magical instructions that benefit React somehow, who's going to patch the 34 lower layers for React to benefit from it? The manufacturers? The React team? You?
        post-it 3y ago
        I don't have any performance issues with React Native[0], so as far as I'm aware the status quo is fine with regards to how well the hardware is optimized for the SDK. The specific SDK I'm referring to is JSCore, obviously everything on top of that is third-party. [0] My main beef with React Native is the total lack of useful stack traces. Also, when running on a device, when you tap Debug before manually setting your dev machine's IP, the app is bricked and you have to delete and reinstall it.
sealeck 3y ago
I actually find that Spotify is super buggy. If I switch devices it doesn't work (I have to select the new device at least five times), when I go underground with my phone it's super slow to realise that I've lost connection, and I usually have to restart the app for it to continue playing music.
- holoduke 3y ago
  Big tech UIs are never made to satisfy the user. They are made to balance you between annoyance and acceptance. Just enough that you wont leave, but still getting frustrated by the aweful mechanics. In a way its also a good thing. Gives room to create a better variant
- samayylmao 3y ago
  For me switching playback device is quick and reliable if the device is a PC or phone. Whenever I try to select a connected Google speaker... it takes like 3-5 tries. I've found it is more reliable to use voice commands to get the speaker to play Spotify then I can use a phone/PC to select the song/playlist/podcast/etc. but it's kind of frustrating it just doesn't work well to begin with.
- azemetre 3y ago
  My major issue with Spotify is that they keep changing the UX on me every week. I hate being part of some terrible a/b testing that I didn't consent too. They already have my money, why do they feel the need to tamper with my experience more? It's extremely infuriating. I remember something was posted to HN a while ago about exporting your playlists from Spotify. That's my current hurdle to leaving the platform, if I can do that and whichever service allows me to import these playlists I'll be leaving.
  - gymbeaux 3y ago
    SongShift is what I use. The free version works well enough, and goes either way between Apple Music and Spotify, probably supports other services.
brk 3y ago
I think the point is that "all modern software" has all kinds of delays and buffering before playing, in contrast to this site where the audio just plays instantly and reliably.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
ungamedplayer 3y ago
This is not a consistent experience for everyone.

ziml77 3y ago

They don't though? I just clicked between two tracks a few times. Each time I switch there is a very clear delay between the click and the playback starting. You can even visually tell there's a delay because the row only becomes highlighted when playback of that track starts.

mdp2021 3y ago
Check the download graphs in your browser's network activity monitor.

mdp2021 3y ago

> when you click When you click, you download packages between 30kb and 300kb (roughly speaking); the player is surely already in memory - that is your latency. For systems that run immediately on machines with a fraction of power.