5 ms·

Am I blind or are there no SID modules? C64 is like 90% of tracked music that I'm listening to. :(

by bronikowski 3y ago

montag 3y ago
You are not blind! This is my personal bias showing, I should really add SID modules to the catalog.
Sharlin 3y ago
Yeah, it’s a bit strange omission.
- mdp2021 3y ago
  Playing samples in patterns and computing coded sound are completely different efforts.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - Sharlin 3y ago
    But the site already has tons of tracker music, as well as other not-strictly-chiptunes like an incredible number of .mid versions of classical music and contemporary pop songs of all things.
    - mdp2021 3y ago
      Tracker files: audio samples as instruments played by a table of notes and variations. MIDI files: a table of notes and variations for playing default samples for instruments. Chip synthesis programs: code that generates sequences of sounds, requiring some specific synth engine. The former two have a radically different (lack of) complexity compared to the latter...
      - Sharlin 3y ago
        I know, but I don't understand your point. The site is full of .mids and mods, as well as other mod-like formats ripped from various devices. I'm not even sure if it does have any actual chiptunes, as in synthetized in realtime!
        mdp2021 3y ago
        You wrote that you find it a «strange omission» not to have included SID tunes in a collection of «mids and mods». Well, simply, the coder must have had an engine capable of playing the latter, which is simple - and not an engine capable of playing the former, which is complex.
snowram 3y ago
May I recommand to you the High Voltage Sid Collection? It is a collection of curated SID songs in a neat package, and it is updated regularly! https://www.hvsc.c64.org/ https://www.hvsc.c64.org/
- bronikowski 3y ago
  Oh, I have HVSC, probably on most of my devices. I was expressing surprise about the project's lack of SIDs not my lack of it! :-D
- Audiophilip 3y ago
  The whole HVSC is available on DeepSID, an online SID player: https://deepsid.chordian.net/ https://deepsid.chordian.net/
daneel_w 3y ago
In the scene people always set SIDs and tracker chiptunes apart, because of how technically different the two are. There's an enormous technical complexity of having to emulate not just the SID chip (which still isn't 100% understood) but also the 6510 CPU and even some of the C64's CIA timers to accurately replay SIDs, whereas almost all sample-based tracker music from the Amiga and PC need none of that effort. Replaying SIDs is even more complicated than emulating e.g. SPC700 of the SNES, the PSG sound of the SMS, or the YM/OPN2 synthesizer of the MegaDrive.
- kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
  Sample based tracker formats shouldn't be considered chiptunes. The latter is supposed to mean sound generated by dedicated hardware with automatic waveform generation, envelopes, and filtering. Doing it all in software by mixing samples isn't the same.
  - daneel_w 3y ago
    Sample-based tracker music and the Amiga scene is where the term and the artistic style was born. The Amiga scene and the musicians of that era are the authority.
    - kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
      That's where "tracker" originated. "Chiptunes" are a more recent denotation and imply hardware generated sound different than a tracker.
      - daneel_w 3y ago
        The term chiptune, and the technical approach and associated musical character, was firmly cemented in the Amiga scene already in the first half of the 90s. The composer who coined the term (in the beginning of the 90s) was legendary computer musician Matt "4-Mat" Simmonds. Everyone understands the difference between oscillators and sample playback, but notwithstanding the term being "technically lopsided" this is still the history of it.
terlisimo 3y ago
To be fair, nobody called c64 music "chip music", it was just "music/tunes" because c64 music is really just code so in a way all of it was chip music (excepting some digi tunes). The term chip music was coined on amigas and newer computers to differentiate it from regular sample based music.
nurettin 3y ago
Now you get an entire thread of nerds explain you the etymological history of sound chips and the huge differences between a sid program and the mid format despite having perfectly working converters in both directions.
Sharlin 3y ago
C64 modules here: https://chiptune.app/browse/Game%20Mods/-%20Arranged%20-/ https://chiptune.app/browse/Game%20Mods/-%20Arranged%20-/ Of course these are indeed modules, arrangements by someone else than the original composer, and not SID tunes per se.

Am I blind or are there no SID modules? C64 is like 90% of tracked music that I'm listening to. :(

montag 3y ago

You are not blind! This is my personal bias showing, I should really add SID modules to the catalog.

Sharlin 3y ago

Yeah, it’s a bit strange omission.

mdp2021 3y ago
Playing samples in patterns and computing coded sound are completely different efforts.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- Sharlin 3y ago
  But the site already has tons of tracker music, as well as other not-strictly-chiptunes like an incredible number of .mid versions of classical music and contemporary pop songs of all things.
  - mdp2021 3y ago
    Tracker files: audio samples as instruments played by a table of notes and variations. MIDI files: a table of notes and variations for playing default samples for instruments. Chip synthesis programs: code that generates sequences of sounds, requiring some specific synth engine. The former two have a radically different (lack of) complexity compared to the latter...
    - Sharlin 3y ago
      I know, but I don't understand your point. The site is full of .mids and mods, as well as other mod-like formats ripped from various devices. I'm not even sure if it does have any actual chiptunes, as in synthetized in realtime!
      - mdp2021 3y ago
        You wrote that you find it a «strange omission» not to have included SID tunes in a collection of «mids and mods». Well, simply, the coder must have had an engine capable of playing the latter, which is simple - and not an engine capable of playing the former, which is complex.

snowram 3y ago

May I recommand to you the High Voltage Sid Collection? It is a collection of curated SID songs in a neat package, and it is updated regularly! https://www.hvsc.c64.org/ https://www.hvsc.c64.org/

bronikowski 3y ago
Oh, I have HVSC, probably on most of my devices. I was expressing surprise about the project's lack of SIDs not my lack of it! :-D
Audiophilip 3y ago
The whole HVSC is available on DeepSID, an online SID player: https://deepsid.chordian.net/ https://deepsid.chordian.net/

daneel_w 3y ago

In the scene people always set SIDs and tracker chiptunes apart, because of how technically different the two are. There's an enormous technical complexity of having to emulate not just the SID chip (which still isn't 100% understood) but also the 6510 CPU and even some of the C64's CIA timers to accurately replay SIDs, whereas almost all sample-based tracker music from the Amiga and PC need none of that effort. Replaying SIDs is even more complicated than emulating e.g. SPC700 of the SNES, the PSG sound of the SMS, or the YM/OPN2 synthesizer of the MegaDrive.

kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
Sample based tracker formats shouldn't be considered chiptunes. The latter is supposed to mean sound generated by dedicated hardware with automatic waveform generation, envelopes, and filtering. Doing it all in software by mixing samples isn't the same.
- daneel_w 3y ago
  Sample-based tracker music and the Amiga scene is where the term and the artistic style was born. The Amiga scene and the musicians of that era are the authority.
  - kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
    That's where "tracker" originated. "Chiptunes" are a more recent denotation and imply hardware generated sound different than a tracker.
    - daneel_w 3y ago
      The term chiptune, and the technical approach and associated musical character, was firmly cemented in the Amiga scene already in the first half of the 90s. The composer who coined the term (in the beginning of the 90s) was legendary computer musician Matt "4-Mat" Simmonds. Everyone understands the difference between oscillators and sample playback, but notwithstanding the term being "technically lopsided" this is still the history of it.

terlisimo 3y ago

To be fair, nobody called c64 music "chip music", it was just "music/tunes" because c64 music is really just code so in a way all of it was chip music (excepting some digi tunes). The term chip music was coined on amigas and newer computers to differentiate it from regular sample based music.

nurettin 3y ago

Now you get an entire thread of nerds explain you the etymological history of sound chips and the huge differences between a sid program and the mid format despite having perfectly working converters in both directions.

Sharlin 3y ago

C64 modules here: https://chiptune.app/browse/Game%20Mods/-%20Arranged%20-/ https://chiptune.app/browse/Game%20Mods/-%20Arranged%20-/ Of course these are indeed modules, arrangements by someone else than the original composer, and not SID tunes per se.