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I was a "real engineer" for several years before learning to code and switching to software and found that software was harder and required a greater attention

I was a "real engineer" for several years before learning to code and switching to software and found that software was harder and required a greater attention to detail, skill, depth of knowledge, and so on. I've found that your sentiment that software engineering is less rigorous is common among those that haven't done "real engineering" though. There is some truth that in software you have the option to push out risky code and have it fail and then course correct quickly, while in "real engineering" you can't take risks like that because there is a higher potential negative severity/outcome but that depends on the cost of software downtime and bugs. In "real engineering" you can also develop models and test things in a safer environment before the equivalent of "pushing out to prod" but often the feedback loop is longer, and so you have more time to consider your test, but that doesn't mean that reasoning about that system is any harder, or easier necessarily.

pcthrowaway 3y ago
> There is some truth that in software you have the option to push out risky code and have it fail and then course correct quickly, while in "real engineering" you can't take risks like that because there is a higher potential negative severity/outcome but that depends on the cost of software downtime and bugs. I'm sure you could be like Albert Hofmann for Chemical Engineering, or Electroboom for EE
dranudin 3y ago
I, too, was a "real" engineer before transitioning into software. I think you are right with your analysis. "Real" engineering, as practised by people in the industry, is neither harder nor more rigorous than real world software engineering. I wonder where this idea comes from. I read that very often here on HN.
- mikewarot 3y ago
  For me, the reason I give so much respect to Engineers is that they have a profession, a set of rules they are willing to stand up for, and not violate. The law supports them in this manner. Perhaps my respect is misplaced, I'll never know for sure. The application of the rules and procedures reliably, every time, every day, for every little change, just seems so damned boring and yet terrifying. Knowing that if you're wrong, one or perhaps many people will die, is a strong incentive to do things right. Take the walkway collapse caused by a seemingly small change to make construction easier[1]. Or, the institutional failure when Engineers are over-ridden by management with spread-sheets who don't actually understand the problem at hand.[2] But... The day in, day out grind, it's so tempting to be clever and creative, and do the thing that programmers do all to often when they write code so cleaver they can't debug it. Give in to the temptation once, and someone else could die. What a grind... It's like being an accountant with a sword dangling over your head. Engineering is about being methodical and prudent, not about being the sharpest tool in the shed. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Challenger_disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Challenger_disas...

pcthrowaway 3y ago

> There is some truth that in software you have the option to push out risky code and have it fail and then course correct quickly, while in "real engineering" you can't take risks like that because there is a higher potential negative severity/outcome but that depends on the cost of software downtime and bugs. I'm sure you could be like Albert Hofmann for Chemical Engineering, or Electroboom for EE

dranudin 3y ago

I, too, was a "real" engineer before transitioning into software. I think you are right with your analysis. "Real" engineering, as practised by people in the industry, is neither harder nor more rigorous than real world software engineering. I wonder where this idea comes from. I read that very often here on HN.

mikewarot 3y ago
For me, the reason I give so much respect to Engineers is that they have a profession, a set of rules they are willing to stand up for, and not violate. The law supports them in this manner. Perhaps my respect is misplaced, I'll never know for sure. The application of the rules and procedures reliably, every time, every day, for every little change, just seems so damned boring and yet terrifying. Knowing that if you're wrong, one or perhaps many people will die, is a strong incentive to do things right. Take the walkway collapse caused by a seemingly small change to make construction easier[1]. Or, the institutional failure when Engineers are over-ridden by management with spread-sheets who don't actually understand the problem at hand.[2] But... The day in, day out grind, it's so tempting to be clever and creative, and do the thing that programmers do all to often when they write code so cleaver they can't debug it. Give in to the temptation once, and someone else could die. What a grind... It's like being an accountant with a sword dangling over your head. Engineering is about being methodical and prudent, not about being the sharpest tool in the shed. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Challenger_disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Challenger_disas...