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Hmm idk. My anecdata of one wife had a really bad time with oral contraceptives. I feel like behavioral side effects are pretty insidious. She got pretty bad an

Hmm idk. My anecdata of one wife had a really bad time with oral contraceptives. I feel like behavioral side effects are pretty insidious. She got pretty bad anger problems that would only appear to manifest with those she was very close to (and 95% of the time was me). It was difficult to convince her that her emotions were being selectively biased. Which is a bit of a causality minefield to get into. I worry that many women could just start taking this and have it derail their lives invisibly to them. Not that the doctors prescription step made this better per se. But it’s hard for someone to take a drug that can potentially materially alter your perception of things in ways that are not intuitive for you to observe. Switching birth control methods sucks. But this shit is not talked about enough. I lean towards believing the pill is riskier than it’s worth. Hormonal IUDs or copper IUDs feel like they’re a much safer choice (higher switching costs though and probably daunting for the very young).

EatingWithForks 3y ago
Counter anecdata: I know several women where oral contraceptives noticeably improved their lives, because their hormones were now being regulated. They got less mood swings and were way more stable. Also, women generally have a larger friend group than men and their friends are more encouraged to stage interventions if their lives are spinning out of control than men.
- Astronaut3315 3y ago
  My wife included. She does far better with the pill than without. It’s not taken for birth control.
- jncfhnb 3y ago
  That’s not a counterpoint. It’s a possible upside, but these things don’t net out across patients. > Also, women generally have a larger friend group than men and their friends are more encouraged to stage interventions if their lives are spinning out of control than men. This is a nonsense argument even if the premise may be true. This, in no way, makes the harm ok.
thebooktocome 3y ago
[flagged]
giraffe_lady 3y ago
Women talk about this a lot, you probably just don't have the sort of relationship where it would come up with very many women besides your wife. Most women I've spoken to about it have had bad experiences with at least one hormonal birth control, especially in mood, appetite, sex drive, energy levels, depression & anxiety, fitness, bleeding. The range of things hormones can affect is wide and sometimes subtle. There are dozens of different formulations and a lot of women are very particular about the one they take, having found one with tolerable side effects. IUDs have a similar range of experiences too, though they're less popular so I hear less about them.
- jncfhnb 3y ago
  More popular globally actually. not in US.
  - giraffe_lady 3y ago
    Interesting, thanks. I didn't know that.
pevey 3y ago
Oral contraceptives do have side effects, including effects on mental health. Sometimes the effects seem to be positive. Often, they are quite negative. These effects are not taken seriously/acknowledged by the vast majority of medical professionals, so I don't see how it is relevant to whether the pills have to be prescribed. It is a separate issue. People should be free to make their own choice without going through a gatekeeper who adds no value. Most often, women making the choices are more informed (by their social network) of the wide range of potential side effects than their doctor is, who may or may not have a uterus and may or may not take reports of side effects seriously.
- thepasswordis 3y ago
  There's an association with "needs a prescription" that people have about the seriousness of the medication that they are taking. "Over the counter" sortof implies that you can't mess it up, or that it isn't really dangerous
  - pevey 3y ago
    If that is the standard, only homeopathic stuff should be available OTC. No [side] effects at all. :)
- sweetjuly 3y ago
  >These effects are not taken seriously by the vast majority of medical professionals This is what is so baffling about so many of the ridiculous comments here. It's so disturbingly common for doctors to ignore bad individual interactions and just call women dramatic. It's shockingly hard to find anyone who will even so much as listen. Prescribers will throw some random BC pill at you and if it doesn't work for you, tough, try your luck with another doctor/NP. The system doesn't provide any protection, it frankly just makes it worse.
  - jncfhnb 3y ago
    If you put up gates to one option but not to others you are tunneling them into the one. Regardless of doctor value.

EatingWithForks 3y ago

Counter anecdata: I know several women where oral contraceptives noticeably improved their lives, because their hormones were now being regulated. They got less mood swings and were way more stable. Also, women generally have a larger friend group than men and their friends are more encouraged to stage interventions if their lives are spinning out of control than men.

Astronaut3315 3y ago
My wife included. She does far better with the pill than without. It’s not taken for birth control.
jncfhnb 3y ago
That’s not a counterpoint. It’s a possible upside, but these things don’t net out across patients. > Also, women generally have a larger friend group than men and their friends are more encouraged to stage interventions if their lives are spinning out of control than men. This is a nonsense argument even if the premise may be true. This, in no way, makes the harm ok.

thebooktocome 3y ago

[flagged]

giraffe_lady 3y ago

Women talk about this a lot, you probably just don't have the sort of relationship where it would come up with very many women besides your wife. Most women I've spoken to about it have had bad experiences with at least one hormonal birth control, especially in mood, appetite, sex drive, energy levels, depression & anxiety, fitness, bleeding. The range of things hormones can affect is wide and sometimes subtle. There are dozens of different formulations and a lot of women are very particular about the one they take, having found one with tolerable side effects. IUDs have a similar range of experiences too, though they're less popular so I hear less about them.

jncfhnb 3y ago
More popular globally actually. not in US.
- giraffe_lady 3y ago
  Interesting, thanks. I didn't know that.

pevey 3y ago

Oral contraceptives do have side effects, including effects on mental health. Sometimes the effects seem to be positive. Often, they are quite negative. These effects are not taken seriously/acknowledged by the vast majority of medical professionals, so I don't see how it is relevant to whether the pills have to be prescribed. It is a separate issue. People should be free to make their own choice without going through a gatekeeper who adds no value. Most often, women making the choices are more informed (by their social network) of the wide range of potential side effects than their doctor is, who may or may not have a uterus and may or may not take reports of side effects seriously.

thepasswordis 3y ago
There's an association with "needs a prescription" that people have about the seriousness of the medication that they are taking. "Over the counter" sortof implies that you can't mess it up, or that it isn't really dangerous
- pevey 3y ago
  If that is the standard, only homeopathic stuff should be available OTC. No [side] effects at all. :)
sweetjuly 3y ago
>These effects are not taken seriously by the vast majority of medical professionals This is what is so baffling about so many of the ridiculous comments here. It's so disturbingly common for doctors to ignore bad individual interactions and just call women dramatic. It's shockingly hard to find anyone who will even so much as listen. Prescribers will throw some random BC pill at you and if it doesn't work for you, tough, try your luck with another doctor/NP. The system doesn't provide any protection, it frankly just makes it worse.
- jncfhnb 3y ago
  If you put up gates to one option but not to others you are tunneling them into the one. Regardless of doctor value.