4 ms·

I have zero interest in these feature hiding, information density reducing ‘upgrades’. Nice hamburger menu, real innovation.

lucb1e 3y ago
Found the not-Thunderbird user. The hamburger menu was introduced about ten years ago I'd wager. Maybe you'd like to make your own free(dom/beer) email client and see what positive responses people post there? :)
- 000ooo000 3y ago
  What's your point? People aren't required to build something equivalent before they're allowed to have critical feedback.
  - luuurker 3y ago
    Isn't the parent comment complaining about the upgrade and mentions the hamburger menu as one of the "innovations"? The hamburger menu was already there, it's not new. That's the point, I think.
- okanat 3y ago
  Maybe they are not a Thunderbird user but I am. You can still disable the hamburger menu in the older versions. If they are removing the menu bars entirely I will stop using Thunderbird. What's the point of using a desktop app if you don't get the nice features and dense UI of the desktop apps.
paddim8 3y ago
This layout displays information way more efficiently. It makes absolutely no sense to have the email content panel below the email list, because emails don't have that aspect ratio, so you either end up with super zoomed in emails or huge empty borders. Makes no sense. With this, the available space is used more efficiently, and differing font sizes are used to differentiate between different types of text and how important it is. That's more ergonomic as well.
- einpoklum 3y ago
  > It makes absolutely no sense to have the email content panel below the email list, because emails don't have that aspect ratio, It does make sense, because the list of emails typically requires the full length of your window. And while most emails may not use the full width of the window - some do; and one shouldn't have to open a separate window for those. +--+---------------+ | f| list of | | o| folder emails,| | l| one per line | | d+---------------+ | e| selected email| | r| contents | | s| | +--+---------------+ is the only way to go... for me. I realize that some people like it different and that's fine.
  - NoboruWataya 3y ago
    That's my opinion as well. However, given a sufficiently wide screen I think I could get into side-by-side view if I could drastically shrink or even hide the folders pane as I don't use it that often (particularly with a unified folder, which I believe 115 offers). We shall see. Apparently you can keep the legacy view anyway so everyone's happy.
    - einpoklum 3y ago
      No, unhappy, because in addition to the UI warping so far, they've taken away the toolbar; and they're insisting on drawing stuff inside the title bar. And that's in addition to breaking things for extension developers etc.
  - Grimm665 3y ago
    Same, since I use Thunderbird tiled next to Teams, this layout is the only real option. Haven't tried the new release yet but hoping to see this in there...
- rahen 3y ago
  I prefer the traditional layout over the MS Outlook one. It requires less screen estate, and you don't need to open some emails in a separate window to read them at an adequate size.
einpoklum 3y ago
Many users (and extension developers, and probably developers) have tried to push back against the degradation of the UI into a hodge-podge of pieces of some mobile phone app. Some of the objections staved off even worse degradations, but for the most part they have been ignored or suppressed.

lucb1e 3y ago

Found the not-Thunderbird user. The hamburger menu was introduced about ten years ago I'd wager. Maybe you'd like to make your own free(dom/beer) email client and see what positive responses people post there? :)

000ooo000 3y ago
What's your point? People aren't required to build something equivalent before they're allowed to have critical feedback.
- luuurker 3y ago
  Isn't the parent comment complaining about the upgrade and mentions the hamburger menu as one of the "innovations"? The hamburger menu was already there, it's not new. That's the point, I think.
okanat 3y ago
Maybe they are not a Thunderbird user but I am. You can still disable the hamburger menu in the older versions. If they are removing the menu bars entirely I will stop using Thunderbird. What's the point of using a desktop app if you don't get the nice features and dense UI of the desktop apps.

paddim8 3y ago

This layout displays information way more efficiently. It makes absolutely no sense to have the email content panel below the email list, because emails don't have that aspect ratio, so you either end up with super zoomed in emails or huge empty borders. Makes no sense. With this, the available space is used more efficiently, and differing font sizes are used to differentiate between different types of text and how important it is. That's more ergonomic as well.

einpoklum 3y ago
> It makes absolutely no sense to have the email content panel below the email list, because emails don't have that aspect ratio, It does make sense, because the list of emails typically requires the full length of your window. And while most emails may not use the full width of the window - some do; and one shouldn't have to open a separate window for those. +--+---------------+ | f| list of | | o| folder emails,| | l| one per line | | d+---------------+ | e| selected email| | r| contents | | s| | +--+---------------+ is the only way to go... for me. I realize that some people like it different and that's fine.
- NoboruWataya 3y ago
  That's my opinion as well. However, given a sufficiently wide screen I think I could get into side-by-side view if I could drastically shrink or even hide the folders pane as I don't use it that often (particularly with a unified folder, which I believe 115 offers). We shall see. Apparently you can keep the legacy view anyway so everyone's happy.
  - einpoklum 3y ago
    No, unhappy, because in addition to the UI warping so far, they've taken away the toolbar; and they're insisting on drawing stuff inside the title bar. And that's in addition to breaking things for extension developers etc.
- Grimm665 3y ago
  Same, since I use Thunderbird tiled next to Teams, this layout is the only real option. Haven't tried the new release yet but hoping to see this in there...
rahen 3y ago
I prefer the traditional layout over the MS Outlook one. It requires less screen estate, and you don't need to open some emails in a separate window to read them at an adequate size.

einpoklum 3y ago

Many users (and extension developers, and probably developers) have tried to push back against the degradation of the UI into a hodge-podge of pieces of some mobile phone app. Some of the objections staved off even worse degradations, but for the most part they have been ignored or suppressed.