6 ms·

Ha well a nice strong fine then to discourage this stupid behavior of adding tracking scripts from 3rd party fines. I’d still like to see the executive that app

Ha well a nice strong fine then to discourage this stupid behavior of adding tracking scripts from 3rd party fines. I’d still like to see the executive that approved this spend 1 night in jail to prove a point that stupid has personal consequences

roadbuster 3y ago
> a nice strong fine Who receives the fine? * The Tax Prep companies? That would be fair: they are obligated to handle private user data in a responsible manner * The ad tech companies? That would not be fair: they didn't want the data, didn't know it was being sent, and almost assuredly didn't use it for any kind of ad serving, measurement, or optimization.
- Eisenstein 3y ago
  > The ad tech companies? That would not be fair If I send you a video camera and tell you to put it in your retail store and stream me the video and you put in your changing room and send me the data and I don't tell you to stop, am I free from liability?
  - circuit10 3y ago
    If you were doing that to millions of people and automatically analysing the video streams you get back for general trends then you wouldn’t really have a way to know that’s happening
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - throw9away6 3y ago
      Yep so maybe massive fines and jail time would be a good deterrent
  - notahacker 3y ago
    I certainly hope I'm free from liability from you sending me illegal videos of naked people unless I've explicitly requested illegal videos of naked people. More to the point, if companies are required to forensically analyse the hashes sent to their API endpoints to check they haven't received anything sensitive, the internet in its modern form would essentially cease to exist.
    - throw9away6 3y ago
      What if your app sucks up all the data from my phone without consent and you get my nudes? I’d like to claw back your bonus for that at the very least
  - roadbuster 3y ago
    > and I don't tell you to stop Alternate analogy: an IoT thermometer vendor sells you a device to track temperature in your room, but you decide to stick it up someone's butt. Will the IoT vendor know the temperature reading is personal and rectal? Should they be held liable for not proactively attempting to scrub-out numbers which may represent gluteal climate?
    - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
      It seemed flawed on first reading but I think this analogy holds if one assumes (for the sake of argument) that it’s Definitely Illegal to be accepting these readings. It would be pretty hard to be sure about filtering out arbitrary strings of numbers (ie SSN) when one is also intending to accept such strings.
- throw9away6 3y ago
  Why not? Software has consequences and we need to hold people accountable for moving fast and breaking laws. We don’t but we should.
  - bhhaskin 3y ago
    Here is a fun question. What law has been broken?
    - magicalist 3y ago
      It seems like the claim is Internal Revenue Code §7216
      - bhhaskin 3y ago
        Thanks! It will be interesting to see how this plays out. In the case of software the user is the one preparing the return and not the software itself. Although people using software on behalf of someone else would be guilty.
- blacksmith_tb 3y ago
  I am almost certain Meta has some basic filtering in place to make sure they aren't storing, say, obvious credit card numbers, SSNs, etc. So I would say they're open to at least a little liability if they failed to match on financial info.
- technick 3y ago
  It should be treated like any other illegal purchase, the seller and buyer gets brought to justice. Try telling a cop that you didn't mean to buy fentanyl with your other illegal drugs.
notahacker 3y ago
I'm not sure jailing the low level employee that pasted some javascript into a footer template, or the low level employee that sent them the link with an email saying "this is the script we need to add to our signup flow" is going to achieve very much. This stuff happens because there isn't an exec approval process...
- Eisenstein 3y ago
  Then make an example and disband the company and all shareholders lose all equity. Have people realize they will lose money if they don't pay attention to details.
  - notahacker 3y ago
    Disbanding a company for including a Google Analytics tracker on their website, causing $0 worth of losses and damages seems a little excessive.
    - Eisenstein 3y ago
      So what is the line, then? Inadvertently sucking up people's tax return info and sending to who knows where because they get a few incentives for it is fine? What about a VoIP company sending call metadata? Or a burglar alarm company sending when you are home or not? At what point can we say 'make your money decently and don't sell customer data for a few pennies or you get made an example of'?
    - mcpackieh 3y ago
      It's far too little. The executives should be given the death penalty for this. They and the rest of the surveillance capitalists have waged war against society and deserve guillotines for it. We need to put a firm stop to this madness before the surveillance industry locks us all into a global panopticon. The stakes couldn't be higher.
  - boeingUH60 3y ago
    All employees should lose their jobs because an incompetent engineer made a mistake? What’s with some people and irrational mob justice? Does it make them feel good or what…
cscurmudgeon 3y ago
What law calls for such a harsh punishment?

roadbuster 3y ago

> a nice strong fine Who receives the fine? * The Tax Prep companies? That would be fair: they are obligated to handle private user data in a responsible manner * The ad tech companies? That would not be fair: they didn't want the data, didn't know it was being sent, and almost assuredly didn't use it for any kind of ad serving, measurement, or optimization.

Eisenstein 3y ago
> The ad tech companies? That would not be fair If I send you a video camera and tell you to put it in your retail store and stream me the video and you put in your changing room and send me the data and I don't tell you to stop, am I free from liability?
- circuit10 3y ago
  If you were doing that to millions of people and automatically analysing the video streams you get back for general trends then you wouldn’t really have a way to know that’s happening
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - throw9away6 3y ago
    Yep so maybe massive fines and jail time would be a good deterrent
- notahacker 3y ago
  I certainly hope I'm free from liability from you sending me illegal videos of naked people unless I've explicitly requested illegal videos of naked people. More to the point, if companies are required to forensically analyse the hashes sent to their API endpoints to check they haven't received anything sensitive, the internet in its modern form would essentially cease to exist.
  - throw9away6 3y ago
    What if your app sucks up all the data from my phone without consent and you get my nudes? I’d like to claw back your bonus for that at the very least
- roadbuster 3y ago
  > and I don't tell you to stop Alternate analogy: an IoT thermometer vendor sells you a device to track temperature in your room, but you decide to stick it up someone's butt. Will the IoT vendor know the temperature reading is personal and rectal? Should they be held liable for not proactively attempting to scrub-out numbers which may represent gluteal climate?
  - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 3y ago
    It seemed flawed on first reading but I think this analogy holds if one assumes (for the sake of argument) that it’s Definitely Illegal to be accepting these readings. It would be pretty hard to be sure about filtering out arbitrary strings of numbers (ie SSN) when one is also intending to accept such strings.
throw9away6 3y ago
Why not? Software has consequences and we need to hold people accountable for moving fast and breaking laws. We don’t but we should.
- bhhaskin 3y ago
  Here is a fun question. What law has been broken?
  - magicalist 3y ago
    It seems like the claim is Internal Revenue Code §7216
    - bhhaskin 3y ago
      Thanks! It will be interesting to see how this plays out. In the case of software the user is the one preparing the return and not the software itself. Although people using software on behalf of someone else would be guilty.
blacksmith_tb 3y ago
I am almost certain Meta has some basic filtering in place to make sure they aren't storing, say, obvious credit card numbers, SSNs, etc. So I would say they're open to at least a little liability if they failed to match on financial info.
technick 3y ago
It should be treated like any other illegal purchase, the seller and buyer gets brought to justice. Try telling a cop that you didn't mean to buy fentanyl with your other illegal drugs.

notahacker 3y ago

I'm not sure jailing the low level employee that pasted some javascript into a footer template, or the low level employee that sent them the link with an email saying "this is the script we need to add to our signup flow" is going to achieve very much. This stuff happens because there isn't an exec approval process...

Eisenstein 3y ago
Then make an example and disband the company and all shareholders lose all equity. Have people realize they will lose money if they don't pay attention to details.
- notahacker 3y ago
  Disbanding a company for including a Google Analytics tracker on their website, causing $0 worth of losses and damages seems a little excessive.
  - Eisenstein 3y ago
    So what is the line, then? Inadvertently sucking up people's tax return info and sending to who knows where because they get a few incentives for it is fine? What about a VoIP company sending call metadata? Or a burglar alarm company sending when you are home or not? At what point can we say 'make your money decently and don't sell customer data for a few pennies or you get made an example of'?
  - mcpackieh 3y ago
    It's far too little. The executives should be given the death penalty for this. They and the rest of the surveillance capitalists have waged war against society and deserve guillotines for it. We need to put a firm stop to this madness before the surveillance industry locks us all into a global panopticon. The stakes couldn't be higher.
- boeingUH60 3y ago
  All employees should lose their jobs because an incompetent engineer made a mistake? What’s with some people and irrational mob justice? Does it make them feel good or what…

cscurmudgeon 3y ago

What law calls for such a harsh punishment?