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This news has nothing to do with lack of innovation. The entire beer market is currently contracting. Also, not everything needs to innovate. Every field needs

This news has nothing to do with lack of innovation. The entire beer market is currently contracting. Also, not everything needs to innovate. Every field needs a canon of notable creations that have stood the test of centuries or millennia and beer brewing is no exception.

giantg2 3y ago
I don't know. It seems a mix of traditional and innovation does well. Yuengling seems to be a good example of a small brand becoming regional and now almost national. They have their traditional brews and have added a few new ones.
- trafficante 3y ago
  Grew up in PA and love seeing Yingers blow up, but I bet their success is largely due to the same reason we loved them back in the early 2000s: they brew a tasty no-frills lager at a good price. Seems a lot of the brewing industry chased fads for 20 years.
  - Projectiboga 3y ago
    I like Yingling Porter. I'm annoyed they aren't in NYC while brewed so nearby.
ibejoeb 3y ago
I'd like to see what '23 the numbers look like before declaring it a contracting market. Sales by volume for the entire category are indeed down, but somewhere between 2-3%, and that is still likely attributable to the crash starting in 2020, when it was actually illegal to serve or even order beer in many places. (To this day, there are still aggressive measures taken against breweries, brewpubs, and taprooms, like this extrajudicial order that is crushing the business in New Jersey: https://www.nj.gov/oag/abc/downloads/LimitedBrewerySpecialConditionsFinalText-6-30-22.pdf https://www.nj.gov/oag/abc/downloads/LimitedBrewerySpecialCo....) Still, imports are up, and regionals and crafts are up as a percentage of total beer. The small operations that weren't entirely destroyed are still in the process of coming back online. I'm not convince the empirical decline is the market at work and not external forces.
- rdj 3y ago
  If you are interested in the numbers, give Bart Watson a follow: https://twitter.com/BrewersStats https://twitter.com/BrewersStats He's an economist that covers this for the Brewers Association. Based on the data, it's not looking good. Some of it is released in public reports and presos, others are member-only resources. Here's a report from the TTB that shows the contraction: https://www.ttb.gov/images/statistics/ttb-beer-2023-statistics/Statistical_Report_Beer_March_2023.pdf https://www.ttb.gov/images/statistics/ttb-beer-2023-statisti... Also, there are several industry talks that dive into the why...one factor seems to be that Gen Z just isn't drinking.
- xp84 3y ago
  Oh my gosh. Section 1 of that about tours. What a ridiculous ordinance. I assume all this is in there to protect some other class of business that lobbied for it, right? Like bars trying to prevent breweries from competing?
  - ibejoeb 3y ago
    Yeah. They nailed it, too: "licensee may offer for sale or make gratuitous offer of de minimis types of food such as water" (2) ...but... "licensee shall not brew and sell coffee" (7) That is full de minimis lol.
  - mlyle 3y ago
    There's multiple kinds of liquor licenses. You can be a bar or restaurant that serves alcohol (retail consumption license). You can also be a brewpub (restricted brewery license), which comes with production limits and requires the above. You can be a brewery, which mostly makes and sells beer to retailers and distributors to consume elsewhere, but might have some tasting events (limited brewery license). New Jersey strictly limits the number of liquor licenses of different types. Limited brewery licenses don't count against these limits: it's expected they're mostly selling their goods to other licensees. It might be protectionism, but more likely it's just an effort to regulate alcohol that doesn't take into account the changes in the craft beer scene in the last couple of decades.

giantg2 3y ago

I don't know. It seems a mix of traditional and innovation does well. Yuengling seems to be a good example of a small brand becoming regional and now almost national. They have their traditional brews and have added a few new ones.

trafficante 3y ago
Grew up in PA and love seeing Yingers blow up, but I bet their success is largely due to the same reason we loved them back in the early 2000s: they brew a tasty no-frills lager at a good price. Seems a lot of the brewing industry chased fads for 20 years.
- Projectiboga 3y ago
  I like Yingling Porter. I'm annoyed they aren't in NYC while brewed so nearby.

ibejoeb 3y ago

I'd like to see what '23 the numbers look like before declaring it a contracting market. Sales by volume for the entire category are indeed down, but somewhere between 2-3%, and that is still likely attributable to the crash starting in 2020, when it was actually illegal to serve or even order beer in many places. (To this day, there are still aggressive measures taken against breweries, brewpubs, and taprooms, like this extrajudicial order that is crushing the business in New Jersey: https://www.nj.gov/oag/abc/downloads/LimitedBrewerySpecialConditionsFinalText-6-30-22.pdf https://www.nj.gov/oag/abc/downloads/LimitedBrewerySpecialCo....) Still, imports are up, and regionals and crafts are up as a percentage of total beer. The small operations that weren't entirely destroyed are still in the process of coming back online. I'm not convince the empirical decline is the market at work and not external forces.

rdj 3y ago
If you are interested in the numbers, give Bart Watson a follow: https://twitter.com/BrewersStats https://twitter.com/BrewersStats He's an economist that covers this for the Brewers Association. Based on the data, it's not looking good. Some of it is released in public reports and presos, others are member-only resources. Here's a report from the TTB that shows the contraction: https://www.ttb.gov/images/statistics/ttb-beer-2023-statistics/Statistical_Report_Beer_March_2023.pdf https://www.ttb.gov/images/statistics/ttb-beer-2023-statisti... Also, there are several industry talks that dive into the why...one factor seems to be that Gen Z just isn't drinking.
xp84 3y ago
Oh my gosh. Section 1 of that about tours. What a ridiculous ordinance. I assume all this is in there to protect some other class of business that lobbied for it, right? Like bars trying to prevent breweries from competing?
- ibejoeb 3y ago
  Yeah. They nailed it, too: "licensee may offer for sale or make gratuitous offer of de minimis types of food such as water" (2) ...but... "licensee shall not brew and sell coffee" (7) That is full de minimis lol.
- mlyle 3y ago
  There's multiple kinds of liquor licenses. You can be a bar or restaurant that serves alcohol (retail consumption license). You can also be a brewpub (restricted brewery license), which comes with production limits and requires the above. You can be a brewery, which mostly makes and sells beer to retailers and distributors to consume elsewhere, but might have some tasting events (limited brewery license). New Jersey strictly limits the number of liquor licenses of different types. Limited brewery licenses don't count against these limits: it's expected they're mostly selling their goods to other licensees. It might be protectionism, but more likely it's just an effort to regulate alcohol that doesn't take into account the changes in the craft beer scene in the last couple of decades.