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It's not about punishing those people, but about not supporting the government which is currently invading another country. You can't stop supporting the govern
by Timon3 3y ago
It's not about punishing those people, but about not supporting the government which is currently invading another country. You can't stop supporting the government without "punishing" the people, and it's not acceptable to keep supporting the government.
Ultimately the people who are being punished are responsible for stopping the punishment by removing their government.
- alex_smart 3y agoAren't the two of you saying the same things?
- Timon3 3y agoI don't think so. GP is saying that "punishing" Russian citizens by not doing business with them is immoral. I'm saying that doing business with Russian entities is immoral.
- Andrew_nenakhov 3y ago> Ultimately the people who are being punished are responsible for stopping the punishment by removing their government. Yes, all of Ukraine with an actual army, drones, rockets, tanks, artillery and zillions of cash from NATO countries struggles to contain Putin's gang, and Russian people must remove him from power barehanded, while the EU help comes mostly in a form of sanctions, visa bans and cancellations of service by such companies as Grammarly.
- Timon3 3y agoIf you don't want nuclear fallout, then yes, that is literally what has to happen.
- marcinzm 3y agoNot to mention there are very very few cases of a foreign forceful power changes in a country working out well for the people of that country. I'd argue it's utterly immoral based on historical examples to invade a country to change it's government no matter the type of government. To say a million dead people is better than not accessing Grammarly is such a baffling statement to me.
- Andrew_nenakhov 3y agoCan you please share with me some realistic tactical advice how can a bunch of unarmed civilians overthrow the government guarded by ~5 million armed, organized and well paid thugs who are currently on Putin's payroll?
- Timon3 3y agoCan you explain why you want "some realistic tactical advice how can a bunch of unarmed civilians overthrow the government guarded by ~5 million armed, organized and well paid thugs who are currently on Putin's payroll"? Is this the only way that Putin could be overthrown that you can think of?
- Andrew_nenakhov 3y agoA few messages above you said, > Ultimately the people who are being punished are responsible for stopping the punishment by removing their government. I'm one of the punished people. Sure, I don't want the nuclear fallout. So please, share with me your wisdom on how should I, a responsible person, act to remove Putin from power? > Is this the only way that Putin could be overthrown that you can think of? Apparently, you were able to think of several ways how Putin could be overthrown, I'll be happy to hear them all.
- Timon3 3y agoIt's sad you can't think of any way except literally violently overthrowing him! But I'm happy to share my ideas. The most important thing is to build support against him. Putin isn't in power because he pays everyone so well, but because he has enough support that nobody can easily overthrow him without themselves suffering for it afterwards. But just look a couple of weeks back - Wagner has at most 50k people, and they could have succeeded. They probably would have if the russian public was outspoken against Putin, because other supporters would have joined. It's all about the key supporters, and ultimately about public support. But what can you do to strengthen suport against him? - Spread non-russian news to people - Tell them about the horrors the russian military is inflicting on Ukraine - Tell people about Putins close supporters who seem to be building support against him - Tell people about the terrible effect the war has on those drafted Any problems?