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This has nothing to do with politics: > “We recognize the importance and historic significance of Anchor to San Francisco and to the craft brewing industry, bu

by bink 3y ago

This has nothing to do with politics: > “We recognize the importance and historic significance of Anchor to San Francisco and to the craft brewing industry, but the impacts of the pandemic, inflation, especially in San Francisco, and a highly competitive market left the company with no option but to make this sad decision to cease operations.” You really think California is "collapsing economically" or are you just trying to inject your politics into something unrelated?

brigadier132 3y ago
Guess you missed > especially in San Francisco San Francisco had some of the most restrictive covid policies in the country.
- jkubicek 3y ago
  I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I'm having trouble seeing how covid policies from a year ago (strict or not) would still affect a manufacturer that ships beer everywhere in the US.
- jedberg 3y ago
  And lowest rates of death, especially for the density. A choice was made to trade off companies (which can be replaced) for lives (which can't be replaced).
  - athinggoingon 3y ago
    Companies that provide store fronts that law abiding customers living in those neighborhoods can't live without.
  - brigadier132 3y ago
    Everyone left, im sure san francisco factored that into the denominator and didnt use statistics from before covid
jkubicek 3y ago
Too many people were shoplifting beer from their gift shop and SF police refused to do anything about it. Anchor had no choice but to shut down. /s
athinggoingon 3y ago
Do you expect these corporate announcements to contain anything but PR and euphemisms?
- jimmychoozyx 3y ago
  Exactly. One of the cardinal sins in statistics is: Self-reports are biased. A corporation is telling you about that same corporation? You can expect some bias ;) I find it quite telling this attitude of "If someone tells you something, it's got to be true! Especially if it's a corporation!!" quite telling, regarding those folks who are saying "Hey you can't criticize California! You conservative!" It's like... Really? California is some gleaming pinnacle of perfection? It's with great hesitation that I say this: Californians... get out-- and ask people in other states how they feel about California & its citizens-- and then go right back and stay in your confinement zone lol (I kid! I kid! Dang plz don't ban me :))
  - bink 3y ago
    "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - emodendroket 3y ago
    I moved here a few years ago, so I don’t think I’m that lacking in perspective, and I think it’s nicer than other places I lived in a lot of ways. Certainly not seeing reasons for panic.
jimmychoozyx 3y ago
I am mostly referring to the exodus of citizens who find California can no longer sustain them economically. As a result, they're moving in substantial proportions to conservative states. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_exodus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_exodus There has also been a significant exodus of businesses. "An exodus of California businesses is gaining steam, with the number of departing establishments nearly doubling from 2012 to 2019" [2] https://www.ocregister.com/2023/06/05/california-business-departures-rising-study-says https://www.ocregister.com/2023/06/05/california-business-de... From [2] ( June 5, 2023 ) "Companies that have moved their U.S. headquarters out of state in recent years include Hewlett Packard Enterprise, Oracle, Charles Schwab, CBRE, Toyota and Tesla. Nevada, Texas, Arizona, Oregon, Washington and Florida ranked as the top destinations for relocating California establishments, the data shows. The findings resemble those in the Hoover Institution’s latest business exodus study, released last September. The Stanford University institution reported that at least 352 business moved their headquarters out of California from 2018 through 2021, including 11 Fortune 1,000 companies. “Headquarter relocations are accelerating substantially, with no sign of reversing course,” the Hoover Institution report said. It blames the departures on a business environment “that ranks near the bottom of all U.S. states.” "RELATED: Tesla’s Elon Musk follows 687,626 Californians who moved to Texas"
- bink 3y ago
  Your own links suggest that peak migration was in 2021, when California lost 360,000 people. That's less than 1% of the population. You're also ignoring the fact that Anchor Steam is owned by Sapporo and has been for the last 6 years. This isn't a decision being made by people working in the factory who are angry that they had to wear masks or upset about a rise in homelessness. Despite Musk's political nonsense claims about moving the Tesla HQ, he's still expanding the Fremont factory: https://www.tesla.com/fremont-factory https://www.tesla.com/fremont-factory The most common reason cited for normal companies to leave California is the cost of living, especially housing and labor costs. If the economy were collapsing those costs would be decreasing. California's GDP has also continued to rise, with only a brief blip at the beginning of 2020: https://www.statista.com/statistics/187834/gdp-of-the-us-federal-state-of-california-since-1997/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/187834/gdp-of-the-us-fed... California saw historic budget surpluses from 2021 to 2023: "As a result, in the last two years, the state saw historic budget surpluses—including $47 billion in 2021‑22 and $55 billion in 2022‑23. https://lao.ca.gov/Publications/Report/4687 https://lao.ca.gov/Publications/Report/4687

by bink 3y ago

brigadier132 3y ago

Guess you missed > especially in San Francisco San Francisco had some of the most restrictive covid policies in the country.

jkubicek 3y ago
I'm not saying that you're wrong, but I'm having trouble seeing how covid policies from a year ago (strict or not) would still affect a manufacturer that ships beer everywhere in the US.
jedberg 3y ago
And lowest rates of death, especially for the density. A choice was made to trade off companies (which can be replaced) for lives (which can't be replaced).
- athinggoingon 3y ago
  Companies that provide store fronts that law abiding customers living in those neighborhoods can't live without.
- brigadier132 3y ago
  Everyone left, im sure san francisco factored that into the denominator and didnt use statistics from before covid

jkubicek 3y ago

Too many people were shoplifting beer from their gift shop and SF police refused to do anything about it. Anchor had no choice but to shut down. /s

athinggoingon 3y ago

Do you expect these corporate announcements to contain anything but PR and euphemisms?

jimmychoozyx 3y ago
Exactly. One of the cardinal sins in statistics is: Self-reports are biased. A corporation is telling you about that same corporation? You can expect some bias ;) I find it quite telling this attitude of "If someone tells you something, it's got to be true! Especially if it's a corporation!!" quite telling, regarding those folks who are saying "Hey you can't criticize California! You conservative!" It's like... Really? California is some gleaming pinnacle of perfection? It's with great hesitation that I say this: Californians... get out-- and ask people in other states how they feel about California & its citizens-- and then go right back and stay in your confinement zone lol (I kid! I kid! Dang plz don't ban me :))
- bink 3y ago
  "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- emodendroket 3y ago
  I moved here a few years ago, so I don’t think I’m that lacking in perspective, and I think it’s nicer than other places I lived in a lot of ways. Certainly not seeing reasons for panic.

jimmychoozyx 3y ago

I am mostly referring to the exodus of citizens who find California can no longer sustain them economically. As a result, they're moving in substantial proportions to conservative states. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_exodus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_exodus There has also been a significant exodus of businesses. "An exodus of California businesses is gaining steam, with the number of departing establishments nearly doubling from 2012 to 2019" [2] https://www.ocregister.com/2023/06/05/california-business-departures-rising-study-says https://www.ocregister.com/2023/06/05/california-business-de... From [2] ( June 5, 2023 ) "Companies that have moved their U.S. headquarters out of state in recent years include Hewlett Packard Enterprise, Oracle, Charles Schwab, CBRE, Toyota and Tesla. Nevada, Texas, Arizona, Oregon, Washington and Florida ranked as the top destinations for relocating California establishments, the data shows. The findings resemble those in the Hoover Institution’s latest business exodus study, released last September. The Stanford University institution reported that at least 352 business moved their headquarters out of California from 2018 through 2021, including 11 Fortune 1,000 companies. “Headquarter relocations are accelerating substantially, with no sign of reversing course,” the Hoover Institution report said. It blames the departures on a business environment “that ranks near the bottom of all U.S. states.” "RELATED: Tesla’s Elon Musk follows 687,626 Californians who moved to Texas"

bink 3y ago
Your own links suggest that peak migration was in 2021, when California lost 360,000 people. That's less than 1% of the population. You're also ignoring the fact that Anchor Steam is owned by Sapporo and has been for the last 6 years. This isn't a decision being made by people working in the factory who are angry that they had to wear masks or upset about a rise in homelessness. Despite Musk's political nonsense claims about moving the Tesla HQ, he's still expanding the Fremont factory: https://www.tesla.com/fremont-factory https://www.tesla.com/fremont-factory The most common reason cited for normal companies to leave California is the cost of living, especially housing and labor costs. If the economy were collapsing those costs would be decreasing. California's GDP has also continued to rise, with only a brief blip at the beginning of 2020: https://www.statista.com/statistics/187834/gdp-of-the-us-federal-state-of-california-since-1997/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/187834/gdp-of-the-us-fed... California saw historic budget surpluses from 2021 to 2023: "As a result, in the last two years, the state saw historic budget surpluses—including $47 billion in 2021‑22 and $55 billion in 2022‑23. https://lao.ca.gov/Publications/Report/4687 https://lao.ca.gov/Publications/Report/4687