4 ms·

Here are the first 7 potential “Gatekeepers” under the EU Digital Markets Act

32 points by LelouBil 3y ago

znpy 3y ago
The eu is basically doing the work that us antitrust hasn’t done for years. Nice.
- LelouBil 3y ago
  Yeah, especially the "up to 20% of annual worldwide turnover" fine for repeated infringment will really make companies get off from the "fines are just a cost of business" mindset
paxys 3y ago
An official EU website popping up a cookie banner is some delicious irony.
- tetris11 3y ago
  they do let you scroll and read the whole article without agreeing to anything though
- Rygian 3y ago
  What is the irony about? All I can see is a non-intrusive banner with a clear button to "accept only essential" which is all I care about.
  - paxys 3y ago
    Why does a website whose sole job it is to communicate official EU news need to collect and handle user data at all? The answer is likely that the firm in charge of the site themselves can't make sense of GDPR, and included the prompt by default like everyone else does, making the whole thing pointless and leading to nothing but visual pollution.
    - LelouBil 3y ago
      From : https://commission.europa.eu/cookies-policy_en#howdoweusecookies https://commission.europa.eu/cookies-policy_en#howdoweusecoo... > How do we use cookies? > European Commission websites mostly use “first-party cookies”. These are cookies set and controlled by the Commission, not by any external organisation. > However, to view some of our pages, you will have to accept cookies from external organisations. > The 3 types of first-party cookie we use are to: > store visitor preferences > make our websites operational > gather analytics data (about user behaviour) and below : > Analytics cookies > We use these purely for internal research on how we can improve the service we provide for all our users. > The cookies simply assess how you interact with our website – as an anonymous user (the data gathered does not identify you personally). > Also, this data is not shared with any third parties or used for any other purpose. The anonymised statistics could be shared with contractors working on communication projects under contractual agreement with the Commission. > However, you are free to refuse these types of cookies – either via the cookie banner you’ll see on the first page you visit or at Europa Analytics. So they understood GDPR very well, because they are requiring consent for *non essential cookies* and they are *making the "no" as easy to click on as the "yes"*
      - paxys 3y ago
        So why does the banner pop up every time I open the site even if I explicitly decline non essential cookies?
        jabradoodle 3y ago
        It only asks me once, I assume your deleting your cookies somehow.
zeroCalories 3y ago
How likley is it for these companies to actually implement these changes? Are these enforcable?
- Rygian 3y ago
  Quoting: What happens if a gatekeeper ignores the rules? To ensure the effectiveness of the new rules, the possibility of sanctions for non-compliance with the obligations is foreseen. If a gatekeeper does not comply with the rules, the Commission can impose fines of up to 10% of the company's total worldwide annual turnover or 20% in the event of repeated infringements and periodic penalty payments of up to 5% of the company's total worldwide daily turnover. Source: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_20_2349 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_...
  - Rygian 3y ago
    And from same source: Will private damages be available to those harmed by gatekeeper conduct? The DMA is a Regulation, containing precise obligations and prohibitions for the gatekeepers in scope, which can be enforced directly in national courts. This will facilitate direct actions for damages by those harmed by the conduct of non-complying gatekeepers.
littlecranky67 3y ago
Why do I doubt we will see inter-operable Whatsapp and iMessages in 7 months from now? Let alone a side-loadable iOS Appstore.
- LelouBil 3y ago
  From : https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-2019-2024/europe-fit-digital-age/digital-markets-act-ensuring-fair-and-open-digital-markets_en https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-... What will be the consequences of non-compliance? Fines of up to 10% of the company’s total worldwide annual turnover, or up to 20% in the event of repeated infringements Periodic penalty payments of up to 5% of the average daily turnover Remedies In case of systematic infringements of the DMA obligations by gatekeepers, additional remedies may be imposed on the gatekeepers after a market investigation. Such remedies will need to be proportionate to the offence committed. If necessary and as a last resort option, non-financial remedies can be imposed. These can include behavioural and structural remedies, e.g. the divestiture of (parts of) a business.
- martin8412 3y ago
  And why would I want interoperable messenging apps? That will essentially place an upper bound on features. Interoperability on messaging, that includes ByteDance, is a ban on end to end encryption.
  - malermeister 3y ago
    Why would that be a ban on e2e?
    - martin8412 3y ago
      Because ByteDance is Chinese. China doesn't allow for end to end encryption without at the very least a backdoor. By mandating interoperability with ByteDance, that's effectively a ban on E2E. The other messaging apps can't have secure E2E when it needs to be compatible with the compromised model of ByteDance. If they make it secure, it's in violation of the DMA rules on interoperability.
LatteLazy 3y ago
These companies: Alphabet Amazon Apple ByteDance Meta Microsoft Samsung Requirements: They will no longer be able to lock in users in their ecosystem. They will no longer be able to decide which apps you need to have pre-installed on your devices; which app store you have to use. They will not be able to “self-preference”: exploiting the advantage of being the gatekeeper by treating their own products and services more favorably. Their messaging apps will have to interoperate with others.
nologic01 3y ago
The EU represents a vast market of (relatively) well-off and (relatively) informed consumers and businesses. While famously keen on having social safety nets, its politics is generally center-right and the economy cannot be described as anything else than a market economy. The unusual circumstances are that for a major and growing in importance sector (digital services) it is almost entirely relying on US companies for software and Asian companies for hardware. The result is that the EU is forced to either accept the abysmal regulatory standards of these other regions or try to throw its weight around and hope for the best. The positive end games are either US politicians growing up a spine and ensuring this vital sector is not strangled by oligopolies or the EU developing its own services (and fast). Neither is very likely, so grab you pop corn...
EMIRELADERO 3y ago
For those who say Apple/Google will make sideloading more difficult to reach/enable: > 3. The gatekeeper shall ensure that the obligations of Articles 5, 6 and 7 are fully and effectively complied with. > 4. The gatekeeper shall not engage in any behaviour that undermines effective compliance with the obligations of Articles 5, 6 and 7 regardless of whether that behaviour is of a contractual, commercial or technical nature, or of any other nature, or consists in the use of behavioural techniques or interface design. > 6. The gatekeeper shall not degrade the conditions or quality of any of the core platform services provided to business users or end users who avail themselves of the rights or choices laid down in Articles 5, 6 and 7, or make the exercise of those rights or choices unduly difficult, including by offering choices to the end-user in a non-neutral manner, or by subverting end users’ or business users' autonomy, decision-making, or free choice via the structure, design, function or manner of operation of a user interface or a part thereof. > 7. Where the gatekeeper circumvents or attempts to circumvent any of the obligations in Article 5, 6, or 7 in a manner described in paragraphs 4, 5 and 6 of this Article, the Commission may open proceedings pursuant to Article 20 and adopt an implementing act referred to in Article 8(2) in order to specify the measures that the gatekeeper is to implement.
localtoast 3y ago
I, for one, cannot wait to able to sideload (easily) on my iPhone and AppleTV. Downvote me, baby.
- throwawaymobule 3y ago
  I'm looking forward to what it means for quest headsets too. I'm assuming they'll skirt past it the same way that xboxes will.

32 points by LelouBil 3y ago

znpy 3y ago

The eu is basically doing the work that us antitrust hasn’t done for years. Nice.

LelouBil 3y ago
Yeah, especially the "up to 20% of annual worldwide turnover" fine for repeated infringment will really make companies get off from the "fines are just a cost of business" mindset

paxys 3y ago

An official EU website popping up a cookie banner is some delicious irony.

tetris11 3y ago
they do let you scroll and read the whole article without agreeing to anything though
Rygian 3y ago
What is the irony about? All I can see is a non-intrusive banner with a clear button to "accept only essential" which is all I care about.
- paxys 3y ago
  Why does a website whose sole job it is to communicate official EU news need to collect and handle user data at all? The answer is likely that the firm in charge of the site themselves can't make sense of GDPR, and included the prompt by default like everyone else does, making the whole thing pointless and leading to nothing but visual pollution.
  - LelouBil 3y ago
    From : https://commission.europa.eu/cookies-policy_en#howdoweusecookies https://commission.europa.eu/cookies-policy_en#howdoweusecoo... > How do we use cookies? > European Commission websites mostly use “first-party cookies”. These are cookies set and controlled by the Commission, not by any external organisation. > However, to view some of our pages, you will have to accept cookies from external organisations. > The 3 types of first-party cookie we use are to: > store visitor preferences > make our websites operational > gather analytics data (about user behaviour) and below : > Analytics cookies > We use these purely for internal research on how we can improve the service we provide for all our users. > The cookies simply assess how you interact with our website – as an anonymous user (the data gathered does not identify you personally). > Also, this data is not shared with any third parties or used for any other purpose. The anonymised statistics could be shared with contractors working on communication projects under contractual agreement with the Commission. > However, you are free to refuse these types of cookies – either via the cookie banner you’ll see on the first page you visit or at Europa Analytics. So they understood GDPR very well, because they are requiring consent for *non essential cookies* and they are *making the "no" as easy to click on as the "yes"*
    - paxys 3y ago
      So why does the banner pop up every time I open the site even if I explicitly decline non essential cookies?
      - jabradoodle 3y ago
        It only asks me once, I assume your deleting your cookies somehow.

zeroCalories 3y ago

How likley is it for these companies to actually implement these changes? Are these enforcable?

Rygian 3y ago
Quoting: What happens if a gatekeeper ignores the rules? To ensure the effectiveness of the new rules, the possibility of sanctions for non-compliance with the obligations is foreseen. If a gatekeeper does not comply with the rules, the Commission can impose fines of up to 10% of the company's total worldwide annual turnover or 20% in the event of repeated infringements and periodic penalty payments of up to 5% of the company's total worldwide daily turnover. Source: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_20_2349 https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_...
- Rygian 3y ago
  And from same source: Will private damages be available to those harmed by gatekeeper conduct? The DMA is a Regulation, containing precise obligations and prohibitions for the gatekeepers in scope, which can be enforced directly in national courts. This will facilitate direct actions for damages by those harmed by the conduct of non-complying gatekeepers.

littlecranky67 3y ago

Why do I doubt we will see inter-operable Whatsapp and iMessages in 7 months from now? Let alone a side-loadable iOS Appstore.

LelouBil 3y ago
From : https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-2019-2024/europe-fit-digital-age/digital-markets-act-ensuring-fair-and-open-digital-markets_en https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-... What will be the consequences of non-compliance? Fines of up to 10% of the company’s total worldwide annual turnover, or up to 20% in the event of repeated infringements Periodic penalty payments of up to 5% of the average daily turnover Remedies In case of systematic infringements of the DMA obligations by gatekeepers, additional remedies may be imposed on the gatekeepers after a market investigation. Such remedies will need to be proportionate to the offence committed. If necessary and as a last resort option, non-financial remedies can be imposed. These can include behavioural and structural remedies, e.g. the divestiture of (parts of) a business.
martin8412 3y ago
And why would I want interoperable messenging apps? That will essentially place an upper bound on features. Interoperability on messaging, that includes ByteDance, is a ban on end to end encryption.
- malermeister 3y ago
  Why would that be a ban on e2e?
  - martin8412 3y ago
    Because ByteDance is Chinese. China doesn't allow for end to end encryption without at the very least a backdoor. By mandating interoperability with ByteDance, that's effectively a ban on E2E. The other messaging apps can't have secure E2E when it needs to be compatible with the compromised model of ByteDance. If they make it secure, it's in violation of the DMA rules on interoperability.

LatteLazy 3y ago

These companies: Alphabet Amazon Apple ByteDance Meta Microsoft Samsung Requirements: They will no longer be able to lock in users in their ecosystem. They will no longer be able to decide which apps you need to have pre-installed on your devices; which app store you have to use. They will not be able to “self-preference”: exploiting the advantage of being the gatekeeper by treating their own products and services more favorably. Their messaging apps will have to interoperate with others.

nologic01 3y ago

The EU represents a vast market of (relatively) well-off and (relatively) informed consumers and businesses. While famously keen on having social safety nets, its politics is generally center-right and the economy cannot be described as anything else than a market economy. The unusual circumstances are that for a major and growing in importance sector (digital services) it is almost entirely relying on US companies for software and Asian companies for hardware. The result is that the EU is forced to either accept the abysmal regulatory standards of these other regions or try to throw its weight around and hope for the best. The positive end games are either US politicians growing up a spine and ensuring this vital sector is not strangled by oligopolies or the EU developing its own services (and fast). Neither is very likely, so grab you pop corn...

EMIRELADERO 3y ago

For those who say Apple/Google will make sideloading more difficult to reach/enable: > 3. The gatekeeper shall ensure that the obligations of Articles 5, 6 and 7 are fully and effectively complied with. > 4. The gatekeeper shall not engage in any behaviour that undermines effective compliance with the obligations of Articles 5, 6 and 7 regardless of whether that behaviour is of a contractual, commercial or technical nature, or of any other nature, or consists in the use of behavioural techniques or interface design. > 6. The gatekeeper shall not degrade the conditions or quality of any of the core platform services provided to business users or end users who avail themselves of the rights or choices laid down in Articles 5, 6 and 7, or make the exercise of those rights or choices unduly difficult, including by offering choices to the end-user in a non-neutral manner, or by subverting end users’ or business users' autonomy, decision-making, or free choice via the structure, design, function or manner of operation of a user interface or a part thereof. > 7. Where the gatekeeper circumvents or attempts to circumvent any of the obligations in Article 5, 6, or 7 in a manner described in paragraphs 4, 5 and 6 of this Article, the Commission may open proceedings pursuant to Article 20 and adopt an implementing act referred to in Article 8(2) in order to specify the measures that the gatekeeper is to implement.

localtoast 3y ago

I, for one, cannot wait to able to sideload (easily) on my iPhone and AppleTV. Downvote me, baby.

throwawaymobule 3y ago
I'm looking forward to what it means for quest headsets too. I'm assuming they'll skirt past it the same way that xboxes will.